IDM Mailing Archive

on 6/13/01 6:29 AM, Andrei at andrei@world.std.com wrote:

quoted 6 lines That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is

> That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is > totally IDM, man. > > http://nikebasketball.nike.com/nikebasketball/ > > Andrei

yeah, i just checked it out, pretty cool track, very idm -Peter "Pachinko" Schrock- http://www.mp3.com/pachinko --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

quoted 2 lines That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is

> That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is > totally IDM, man.

Stop me if I'm horribly off-topic, but is that a good thing? It's not that I'm against IDM becoming more popular, or musicians making a living from selling a soundtrack to an ad. But when music gets commercialised, it usually seems to wind up getting sanitised as well as bigger labels try to find some easy formula for making big bucks in a consistent way. On the one hand, it may seem petty that people who've got into some 'underground' music like IDM or techno or whatever don't want to be overrun by hordes of weenies who just had it handed to them on a plate by MegaCorp. And it's true that many artists who loudly proclaim that they would never sell out have never been asked to :-) But when an artist (or a genre) gets plucked out of obscurity by some large corporate concern and turned into the new 'big thing', there often follows a brief feeding frenzy as the competition tries to carve up the little market that has just been discovered and stake out their niches in it. For example there are a lot of small hip-hop labels that are just subsidiaries of large media companies, and they don't really contribute much. With that sort of sponsorship, a lot of bland, safe music gets released, and genuinely independent companies have to compete with the much larger promotion and distribution operations that the big-media labels can draw on. I hope this doesn't sound paranoid or reactionary, and I certainly don't want to discourage anyone from buying a good record, whoever releases it. It just seems to me that fashion is a very hungry beast, and after it has moved on there is often less for the small players/labels to get by on. Anig Browl _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

I think there are always two sides to a coin. Commercialism gives a lot of labels and producers the chance to recieve a wider audience and make some money in te progress, which they can invest into the scene. That is probably a good thing...on the other hand, there will always be rip-offs and cheap imitations that just go for the bucks and not for the music. As you say there will always be independent labels and artists to feed your needs... It's up to us, the public/the fans, to pick out the quality from the quantity... But on another note, the chance that 'idm' as a genre (which it isn't, I know, but for argument's sake I'll not get into that :), will become commercial is a little unlikely...it's far too diverse to fit into a nice little 'box' that the big recordcompanies can sell... And one other thing: to think there is no commercialism in 'idm' is ignorant to say the least ;) Not many people like to say it, but everybody would like a bigger house and a nice car if they get the chance ;)) ===== Pjotr Stam || teccie@mindless.com http://www.fredscape.com Den Haag, The Netherlands "I'm God, but it's kind of a drag actually." (Arnold J. Rimmer, Red Dwarf) ____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

Wow that's an elitish reply. It's always nice for undergound music to get some upperground attention. These kind of things keeps the scene going because some people will (hopefully) be atracted to this kind of music. Your fear that commercialism will destroy the undergound is not nesceary. Remember that without the upperground there will be no underground! -- The Moderator - Groundzero Records

quoted 44 lines That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is

>> That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is >> totally IDM, man. > > Stop me if I'm horribly off-topic, but is that a good thing? It's not > that I'm against IDM becoming more popular, or musicians making a > living from selling a soundtrack to an ad. But when music gets > commercialised, it usually seems to wind up getting sanitised as well > as bigger labels try to find some easy formula for making big bucks in > a consistent way. > > On the one hand, it may seem petty that people who've got into some > 'underground' music like IDM or techno or whatever don't want to be > overrun by hordes of weenies who just had it handed to them on a plate > by MegaCorp. And it's true that many artists who loudly proclaim that > they would never sell out have never been asked to :-) > > But when an artist (or a genre) gets plucked out of obscurity by some > large corporate concern and turned into the new 'big thing', there > often follows a brief feeding frenzy as the competition tries to carve > up the little market that has just been discovered and stake out their > niches in it. For example there are a lot of small hip-hop labels that > are just subsidiaries of large media companies, and they don't really > contribute much. With that sort of sponsorship, a lot of bland, safe > music gets released, and genuinely independent companies have to > compete with the much larger promotion and distribution operations that > the big-media labels can draw on. > > I hope this doesn't sound paranoid or reactionary, and I certainly > don't want to discourage anyone from buying a good record, whoever > releases it. It just seems to me that fashion is a very hungry beast, > and after it has moved on there is often less for the small > players/labels to get by on. > > Anig Browl > > > _________________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

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Plus, if commercials like this lead to the improvement of the tacky and poor state of advertising..please, let there be more! -----Original Message----- From: The Moderator [mailto:moderator@technotourist.org] Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2001 10:22 AM To: anig_browl@yahoo.com Cc: idm@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: [idm] nike ad Wow that's an elitish reply. It's always nice for undergound music to get some upperground attention. These kind of things keeps the scene going because some people will (hopefully) be atracted to this kind of music. Your fear that commercialism will destroy the undergound is not nesceary. Remember that without the upperground there will be no underground! -- The Moderator - Groundzero Records

quoted 44 lines That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is

>> That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is >> totally IDM, man. > > Stop me if I'm horribly off-topic, but is that a good thing? It's not > that I'm against IDM becoming more popular, or musicians making a > living from selling a soundtrack to an ad. But when music gets > commercialised, it usually seems to wind up getting sanitised as well > as bigger labels try to find some easy formula for making big bucks in > a consistent way. > > On the one hand, it may seem petty that people who've got into some > 'underground' music like IDM or techno or whatever don't want to be > overrun by hordes of weenies who just had it handed to them on a plate > by MegaCorp. And it's true that many artists who loudly proclaim that > they would never sell out have never been asked to :-) > > But when an artist (or a genre) gets plucked out of obscurity by some > large corporate concern and turned into the new 'big thing', there > often follows a brief feeding frenzy as the competition tries to carve > up the little market that has just been discovered and stake out their > niches in it. For example there are a lot of small hip-hop labels that > are just subsidiaries of large media companies, and they don't really > contribute much. With that sort of sponsorship, a lot of bland, safe > music gets released, and genuinely independent companies have to > compete with the much larger promotion and distribution operations that > the big-media labels can draw on. > > I hope this doesn't sound paranoid or reactionary, and I certainly > don't want to discourage anyone from buying a good record, whoever > releases it. It just seems to me that fashion is a very hungry beast, > and after it has moved on there is often less for the small > players/labels to get by on. > > Anig Browl > > > _________________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

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--- Anig Browl <anig_browl@yahoo.com> wrote:

quoted 12 lines That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is

> > > > That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is > > totally IDM, man. > > Stop me if I'm horribly off-topic, but is that a good thing? It's not > that > I'm against IDM becoming more popular, or musicians making a living from > selling a soundtrack to an ad. But when music gets commercialised, it > usually seems to wind up getting sanitised as well as bigger labels try > to > find some easy formula for making big bucks in a consistent way.

These commercials don't strike me as "IDM" in any way. If all music that uses sequenced non-traditional drum sounds to construct a dance beat is IDM, I guess that would make IDM just about the most massive musical genre in the world. They're cool commericals, and they are good beats, but it's really generic stuff based on a really basic idea. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Spot the hottest trends in music, movies, and more. http://buzz.yahoo.com/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

I actually thought it was more music concrete... but I doubt the majority of viewers are going to make that connection. erik state.music

quoted 52 lines From: "Anig Browl" <anig_browl@yahoo.com>

>From: "Anig Browl" <anig_browl@yahoo.com> >To: <idm@hyperreal.org> >Subject: Re: [idm] nike ad >Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 02:48:58 +0100 > > > > > That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is > > totally IDM, man. > >Stop me if I'm horribly off-topic, but is that a good thing? It's not that >I'm against IDM becoming more popular, or musicians making a living from >selling a soundtrack to an ad. But when music gets commercialised, it >usually seems to wind up getting sanitised as well as bigger labels try to >find some easy formula for making big bucks in a consistent way. > >On the one hand, it may seem petty that people who've got into some >'underground' music like IDM or techno or whatever don't want to be overrun >by hordes of weenies who just had it handed to them on a plate by MegaCorp. >And it's true that many artists who loudly proclaim that they would never >sell out have never been asked to :-) > >But when an artist (or a genre) gets plucked out of obscurity by some large >corporate concern and turned into the new 'big thing', there often follows >a >brief feeding frenzy as the competition tries to carve up the little market >that has just been discovered and stake out their niches in it. For example >there are a lot of small hip-hop labels that are just subsidiaries of large >media companies, and they don't really contribute much. With that sort of >sponsorship, a lot of bland, safe music gets released, and genuinely >independent companies have to compete with the much larger promotion and >distribution operations that the big-media labels can draw on. > >I hope this doesn't sound paranoid or reactionary, and I certainly don't >want to discourage anyone from buying a good record, whoever releases it. >It >just seems to me that fashion is a very hungry beast, and after it has >moved >on there is often less for the small players/labels to get by on. > >Anig Browl > > >_________________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >

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Andrei wrote:

quoted 2 lines That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is

> > > That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is > > > totally IDM, man.

erik pearson wrote:

quoted 2 lines I actually thought it was more music concrete...

> I actually thought it was more music concrete... > but I doubt the majority of viewers are going to make that connection.

It's like electro meets concrete which pretty much equals Autechre. Andrei --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

Anig Browl wrote:

quoted 8 lines That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is

> > That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is > > totally IDM, man. > > Stop me if I'm horribly off-topic, but is that a good thing? It's not that > I'm against IDM becoming more popular, or musicians making a living from > selling a soundtrack to an ad. But when music gets commercialised, it > usually seems to wind up getting sanitised as well as bigger labels try to > find some easy formula for making big bucks in a consistent way.

This is inevitable, you just gotta get used to it. And get used to the fact that IDM _is_ commercial, accessible and relatively undemanding music when it comes down to it. Andrei --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

Free Caustic Windows 3" cd w/ you buy 2 packs of Camel? anti-consumerism is not elitism! you must know the enemy to fight the enemy. find out more at http://www.adbusters.org i'm thouroughly enjoying going out to logo free, "neighborhood sponsored" IDM events, word of mouth and underground advertising is enough to get our music out the right people - if we all get mobilized. -fcb The Moderator wrote:

quoted 58 lines Wow that's an elitish reply. It's always nice for undergound music to get

> Wow that's an elitish reply. It's always nice for undergound music to get > some upperground attention. These kind of things keeps the scene going > because some people will (hopefully) be atracted to this kind of music. > > Your fear that commercialism will destroy the undergound is not nesceary. > Remember that without the upperground there will be no underground! > > -- > The Moderator - Groundzero Records > > >> That new Nike commercial with all the basketball dudes doing tricks is > >> totally IDM, man. > > > > Stop me if I'm horribly off-topic, but is that a good thing? It's not > > that I'm against IDM becoming more popular, or musicians making a > > living from selling a soundtrack to an ad. But when music gets > > commercialised, it usually seems to wind up getting sanitised as well > > as bigger labels try to find some easy formula for making big bucks in > > a consistent way. > > > > On the one hand, it may seem petty that people who've got into some > > 'underground' music like IDM or techno or whatever don't want to be > > overrun by hordes of weenies who just had it handed to them on a plate > > by MegaCorp. And it's true that many artists who loudly proclaim that > > they would never sell out have never been asked to :-) > > > > But when an artist (or a genre) gets plucked out of obscurity by some > > large corporate concern and turned into the new 'big thing', there > > often follows a brief feeding frenzy as the competition tries to carve > > up the little market that has just been discovered and stake out their > > niches in it. For example there are a lot of small hip-hop labels that > > are just subsidiaries of large media companies, and they don't really > > contribute much. With that sort of sponsorship, a lot of bland, safe > > music gets released, and genuinely independent companies have to > > compete with the much larger promotion and distribution operations that > > the big-media labels can draw on. > > > > I hope this doesn't sound paranoid or reactionary, and I certainly > > don't want to discourage anyone from buying a good record, whoever > > releases it. It just seems to me that fashion is a very hungry beast, > > and after it has moved on there is often less for the small > > players/labels to get by on. > > > > Anig Browl > > > > > > _________________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

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--- fcb <1@1pixl.com> wrote:

quoted 9 lines anti-consumerism is not elitism! you must know the

> anti-consumerism is not elitism! you must know the > enemy to fight the enemy. > find out more at http://www.adbusters.org > > i'm thouroughly enjoying going out to logo free, > "neighborhood sponsored" IDM > events, word of mouth and underground advertising is > enough to get our music > out the right people - if we all get mobilized.

There are "right people"? That sounds dangerously fascist to me. (Let's not start up a big, month long argumentative thread on fascism. Let's just all pretend we did.) -Lord High Damek, Ambassador of Love __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

[fcb <1@1pixl.com>]

quoted 1 line http://www.adbu

> http://www.adbusters.org

Also check out www.stayfreemagazine.com -- :: atomly :: atomly@atomly.com | atomly@my2way.com http://www.atomly.com/ | 877.741.3571 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

I can't believe there is so much discussion about the nike ad. It's Afrika Bambaataa. Planet Rock reached top 4 (on R&B charts) about 20 years ago. I don't think this ad is the most influential thing he's ever done, nor is it really a big step in breaking IDM to the regular public (mainly because _most_ people are just gonna call it hip hop anyhow). I like the ad tho. _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

they are just trying to find a way to sell to us, guys! They are hiring hip and creative advertising people who know what's up and can say, hey! This product... its hip, you know? All that slave labor, sweatshops talk, hush, honey. You know you dont care about that... We can slither and slide right into what you think is cool and you are left dumbfounded, amused, unconsciously bobbing your head to the television screen, and weirdly attracted to the Nike brand. A bit off topic, did Nike buy Etnies (my favorite skate shoes of all time) or is it just a lie (oh please tell me so) *blink blink*

quoted 20 lines From: "Helix Tradesman" <paelon@hotmail.com>

>From: "Helix Tradesman" <paelon@hotmail.com> >To: idm@hyperreal.org >Subject: [idm] Re: nike ad >Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 19:14:47 > >I can't believe there is so much discussion about the nike ad. It's Afrika >Bambaataa. Planet Rock reached top 4 (on R&B charts) about 20 years ago. I >don't think this ad is the most influential thing he's ever done, nor is it >really a big step in breaking IDM to the regular public (mainly because >_most_ people are just gonna call it hip hop anyhow). > >I like the ad tho. >_________________________________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >

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if i was in advertising, and i had to make a cool commercial for nike, it would probably sound somethign like that. or i'd just suggest the wddg guys. a. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

From: The Moderator <moderator@technotourist.org>

quoted 2 lines Wow that's an elitish reply. It's always nice for undergound music to get

> Wow that's an elitish reply. It's always nice for undergound music to get > some upperground attention.

Ooh, I didn't mean it to sound elitish, every scene needs new blood to keep reinventing itself. I'm just a bit skeptical when sponsorship gets involved. I've done some commercial music work, like themes for radio shows and the like, but I'd be kind of reluctant to have music in an ad. Well, it would depend on what was being advertised, if it was something I actually liked obviously that would matter. Anig Browl _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

From: fcb <1@1pixl.com>

quoted 1 line i'm thouroughly enjoying going out to logo free, "neighborhood sponsored"

> i'm thouroughly enjoying going out to logo free, "neighborhood sponsored"

IDM

quoted 1 line events, word of mouth and underground advertising is enough to get our

> events, word of mouth and underground advertising is enough to get our

music

quoted 1 line out the right people - if we all get mobilized.

> out the right people - if we all get mobilized.

Yes, that's the sort of ideal that I'd like to preserve. I find it very pleasant to go to an event that actually feels home-grown and has a real sense of community, compared to something calculated to make me friendly towards a sponsor. A commercial event can be very entertaining, sure, but I find it hard to ignore the 'buy' messages. In fact a small event is a relief from the constant effort of filtering out ad messages on street signs, passing radios and so on in daily life. It's true, I'm a bit over sensitive; but that's precisely why I feel at home at some low-budget party. FWIW, I've also thrown several small parties (psy trance, which used to be my main listening), and mostly just broken even or made a small loss. I'm not asking others to suffer on my behalf or anything :-) Anig Browl _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

From: Adam Piontek <apiontek@yahoo.com>

quoted 1 line There are "right people"?

> There are "right people"?

Yeah, the ones who respect what's going on when they arrive in a scene. I don't mean any sort of 'unwritten code', just regular thoughtfulness. I imagine most people have had the experience of being at an event where someone you've never seen before shows up acting like an ass or trying to 'out-cool' everyone instead of just enjoying the music and making friends. As an analogy, last week someone from AOL mailed me demanding free rap music samples and then said I was 'anti-net' when I explained that I couldn't really help him. I don't mean that we should try to keep particular types of people away from IDM or make it a big secret. I'm just a bit wary when commercial forces are on the lookout for a new trend to link themselves to. That's all I have to say on this subject. Anig Browl _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

If im listening to the right thing, the nike track sounds very similar to the beginning of "In the musicals" off Bjork's Selmasongs album, produced by Mark Bell from LFO. (It uses a bouncing ball as the main rhythm) .. .. .. .. .. . . .. . . . paul webb____designer____http://www.digitlondon.com ___________________________paul@digitlondon.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

i heard some aphex twin in a anti drug commercial. the song is on i care because you do or richard d james. ////////////////////////////////////////////// // /www.horripilations.org / // // /info@horripilations.org / // // /mailing list / // // /horripilations-subscribe@yahoogroups.com// ////////////////////////////////////////////// _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org