I am not looking to extend this thread, but rather offer a public service of sorts. Please read some Chomsky criticism and then make up your own mind.
Your can find good factual critcism here:
http://www.leftwatch.com/FAQ/People/noam_chomsky.html
and here:
http://www.talene.net/chomsky/
(direct link to criticism section:
http://www.talene.net/home/modules.php?op=modload&name=Web_Links&file=index&req=viewlink&cid=40&POSTNUKESID=243164d0c2c186974f0b955b60821913 )
Both of the above sites are linked to from this more pro-Chomsky site, which also contains links to many more chomsky resources:
http://www.synaptic.bc.ca/ejournal/chomsky.htm
Brandon Smith <gozravp@yahoo.com> wrote:
quoted 8 lines But you do have to have a rather "creative"
> >But you do have to have a rather "creative"
> conscience
> >to do it with a straight face, having even a remote
> >idea of certain trends in our foreign policy.
>
> nonsense. millions of normal americans celebrated
> this weekend without suffering from bad conscience.
> you're completely out of touch with reality.
*NOT* to make a *direct* comparison to Nazi Germany
with the United Stated in motive or wickedness
(clearly Nazi Germany was considerably worse in its
actions and ideology) but millions of normal, every
day Germans were behind the super race. What I am
trying to say is that it is very easy to follow the
leader and ignore the moral implications. Are we Nazi
Germany? Of course not, but to illustrate how "lots of
people weren't bothered" doesn't say all that much.
Lots of people would rather go to Starbucks and wave a
flag than actually look too far into the story given
by those in power, past and present. Millions of
Americans would much rather ignore America's limiting
of the freedoms of others while celebrating its own
historical record. The latter is something to
celebrate while the former is something to raise an
eyebrow over if (1) you believe all human live is
sacred and (2) you believe the term 'freedom' deserves
application to nations other than our own.
quoted 5 lines i do not agree with the federal government's foreign
> i do not agree with the federal government's foreign
> policy. of course, america's current foreign
> relations are wholly unrelated to the fight for
> independence and self-government of the united
> states.
It is a simple matter of ethics. We are *presently*
celebrating "independence" which is something that we
*presently* limit concerning others.
I, as well as many other considerate people, do not
qualify 'independence' with only 'United States'.
Call me unpatriotic, but I feel just as good when
someone I don't know from Montana has freedom than
someone I don't know from Iraq or the occupied
territories. Again, that is something to celebrate.
You didn't see me burning a flag this July 4th, but I
certainly wan't waving one. I appreciate this country
more than many would generalize about folks like
myself, but I do have a serious problem with how
decidedly unfree we make many human beings across the
globe.
quoted 25 lines stop taking cheap shots at the united states,
> >> stop taking cheap shots at the united states,
> >
> >I suppose it is also a cheap shot to point out that
> >the mustard gas used against the Kurds by Saddam in
> >1988 (that is, before he was 'evil') was part of a
> >military aid package supplied by the United States,
> >which kept coming well after these disgusting
> actions.
> > Hell, we even gave him agricultural aid in light
> of
> >the crops ruined by this gas attack.
> >This is, mind you, the same attack that was, time
> and
> >time again, thrown up at us as the end all be all
> >reason to take him out. Disgusting propaganda
> >understood by anyone who actually takes the time to
> >look into the history.
> >But that point is so cheap it is not even worth
> >mentioning, right?
>
> don't be an ass. it's bad enough i've got this other
> fool recommending noam chomsky to me. he made quite
> foolish generalizations about the united states and
> about thanksgiving (of all the subjects to
> choose..).
First of all, I am not him. His 'generalizations', if
you feel that is what they are, are not mine, though I
am of the opinion that Professor Chomsky does have a
vast amount of knowledge to offer anyone who actually
believes the "good intentions" of the United States.
Second of all "don't be an ass" is the only response
you have to a clear example (laid out above) of the
systematic propaganda fed to us, and how the leaders
of our nation, in spite of all the synonyms to
'freedom' or 'justice' named military operations,
don't give one damn about the other human beings on
the Earth? I do not believe that what I stated above
is a generalization. It is pretty specific and its
shameful to me that you (and don't worry, you're not
alone) don't recognize just how immoral and misleading
the situation is.
I'm sorry, I just can't help but see irony in America
celebrating "independence." I have a conscience.
quoted 4 lines Kind of like how Howard Zinn looks ridiculus next
> >Kind of like how Howard Zinn looks ridiculus next
> to
> >such modern day jingoist intellects as Sean Hannity
> >or, bless her ego, Ann Coulter. quoted 2 lines yeah, the three of them are ridiculous compared to
> yeah, the three of them are ridiculous compared to
> just about anybody.
How about Gore Vidal? Or for that matter anyone else
who does critical analysis and believes that, yes, the
United States is not above ethical accountability?
I've read a good bit of Chomsky's writing and, though
I do not necessarily agree with everything he has to
say on a philosophical level, the man brings to light
numerous horrific examples of violations of basic
human rights that you, or most anyone else, would
collapse at the sight of, and all with extensive
research and care. The only meaningful way to refute
about 99% of what he has to say is to simply ignore
him or make empty statements like him being "full of
you know what."
It is a source of great amusement to me how people
like you just brush off others like Chomsky as
"nonsense" but do not give even a single bit of
serious criticism to what he has to say or why he is
wrong. Just "don't be an ass", right?
Brandon
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