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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?

46 messages · 19 participants · spans 4 days · search this subject
◇ merged from 5 subjects: @wl re: [idm] derrick may invented idm? · @wl re: [idm] derrick may invented idm? · analord 3 and 4 · derrick may invented idm? · …
2005-02-27 18:31ed c [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
├─ 2005-02-27 18:48Alan Lucas Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ ├─ 2005-02-27 19:08theREALmxyzptlk Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ │ ├─ 2005-02-27 19:44max Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ │ └─ 2005-02-27 19:46Kent Williams Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ │ ├─ 2005-02-27 21:02Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ │ │ └─ 2005-02-27 21:28Mark Schieldrop RE: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ │ ├─ 2005-02-27 23:54theREALmxyzptlk Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ │ └─ 2005-03-01 22:37atomly Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ │ └─ 2005-03-03 19:29Z Moser [idm] The Strenght of Dax Pierson
│ └─ 2005-02-27 19:28max Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
└─ 2005-02-27 18:52theREALmxyzptlk Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
└─ 2005-02-27 19:42max Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
2005-02-27 21:37Greg Hill Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
└─ 2005-02-27 23:57theREALmxyzptlk Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
└─ 2005-02-27 23:58Robert Freeman [idm] analord 3 and 4
├─ 2005-02-28 00:30max Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
├─ 2005-02-28 04:19Alan Lucas Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
└─ 2005-02-28 19:59Josh Steiner Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
└─ 2005-02-28 20:40paul symons Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
└─ 2005-02-28 20:59Alan Lucas Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
└─ 2005-02-28 21:48StaticBeats Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
├─ 2005-02-28 21:54Neil Walsh Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
│ └─ 2005-02-28 21:56StaticBeats Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
│ └─ 2005-02-28 23:22Alan Lucas Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
└─ 2005-02-28 21:56theREALmxyzptlk Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
2005-02-28 06:15Greg Hill [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
├─ 2005-02-28 13:36John/Slackonomics Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ ├─ 2005-02-28 13:43theREALmxyzptlk Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ │ ├─ 2005-02-28 13:46ersatz-noddy Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ │ │ └─ 2005-02-28 13:55theREALmxyzptlk Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ │ └─ 2005-02-28 14:21John/Slackonomics Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ │ └─ 2005-02-28 14:30theREALmxyzptlk Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ └─ 2005-02-28 23:20Josh Steiner Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
└─ 2005-02-28 13:41ersatz-noddy Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
├─ 2005-02-28 13:54theREALmxyzptlk Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ └─ 2005-02-28 14:01ersatz-noddy Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
│ └─ 2005-02-28 14:10theREALmxyzptlk Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
└─ 2005-02-28 14:32Enquiries Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
└─ 2005-02-28 14:40theREALmxyzptlk Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
└─ 2005-02-28 14:50ersatz-noddy Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
└─ 2005-02-28 23:31dj fishead Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
└─ 2005-03-01 01:13John/Slackonomics Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
├─ 2005-03-01 01:37max Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
└─ 2005-03-01 02:48dj fishead Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
2005-02-28 16:49Greg Hill Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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2005-02-27 18:31ed cI was reading a book that was trying to say Nude Photo was the beggining of IDM. Does anyb
From:
ed c
To:
Date:
Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:31:59 -0800 (PST)
Subject:
[idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <20050227183159.16590.qmail@web53401.mail.yahoo.com>
I was reading a book that was trying to say Nude Photo was the beggining of IDM. Does anybody feel that way cause i sure don't. Thats kind of like saying Donna Summer invented Post-Rock. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - now with 250MB free storage. Learn more.
2005-02-27 18:48Alan LucasOn Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:31:59 -0800 (PST), ed c <echurch86@yahoo.com> wrote: > I was readin
From:
Alan Lucas
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ed c
Cc:
Date:
Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:48:45 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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[idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:31:59 -0800 (PST), ed c <echurch86@yahoo.com> wrote:
quoted 3 lines I was reading a book that was trying to say Nude Photo was the beggining of IDM. Does anyb> I was reading a book that was trying to say Nude Photo was the beggining of IDM. Does anybody feel that way cause i sure don't. Thats kind of like saying Donna Summer invented Post-Rock. > >
Well, you know, which Donna Summer are you talking about? --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-27 19:08theREALmxyzptlkAlan Lucas wrote: >Well, you know, which Donna Summer are you talking about? > > Well, Mr.
From:
theREALmxyzptlk
To:
Alan Lucas
Cc:
ed c ,
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Sun, 27 Feb 2005 14:08:09 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Alan Lucas wrote:
quoted 3 lines Well, you know, which Donna Summer are you talking about?>Well, you know, which Donna Summer are you talking about? > >
Well, Mr. Forrest has little to do with post-rock either. He has more to do with the revival of bad rock - so bad it's supposed to be good. In some cases it is, but NOT so with E.L.O. - do you hear me Jason?? NOT good. Never was, never will be. Down with Jeff Lynne. ;-) jeff --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-27 19:44maxOn Feb 27, 2005, at 1:08 PM, theREALmxyzptlk wrote: > Alan Lucas wrote: > >> Well, you kno
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max
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idm Org
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Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:44:33 -0600
Subject:
Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
Reply to:
Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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On Feb 27, 2005, at 1:08 PM, theREALmxyzptlk wrote:
quoted 6 lines Alan Lucas wrote:> Alan Lucas wrote: > >> Well, you know, which Donna Summer are you talking about? >> > Well, Mr. Forrest has little to do with post-rock either. He has more > to do with the revival of bad rock - so bad it's supposed to be good.
Heh heh, someone beat me to it! --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-27 19:46Kent Williams1. The Hardwax crew (of which Basic Channel is one manifestation) were going to buy one of
From:
Kent Williams
To:
do id
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Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:46:33 -0600
Subject:
Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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1. The Hardwax crew (of which Basic Channel is one manifestation) were going to buy one of Ron Murphy (of NSC)'s record lathes. Don't know if that went through, but that's at least one solid link between Detroit and Berlin. 2. ELO did pretty much suck, after a certain point, but they came out of The Move, and Roy Wood is one of the great unsung heroes of experimental popular music. ELO booted Roy out after the first album for his relentless love of weirdness. He went on to make several curious solo albums, that you should buy on sight if they turn up. 3. Detroit has a curious place in American musical history, because of the myriad people that got their start there. The techno dudes, Madonna, Eminem, MC5, White Stripes, etc. All of the early IDM guys were heavily influenced by Detroit -- Aphex Twin, Black Dog, Kirk DiGiorgio, Dego (of 4Hero), etc. 4. I wouldn't blame Derrick May for IDM. Autechre have a lot to answer for, though. I like Autechre as much as the next boffin, but man o man, the GODAWFUL crap that has come out of Autechre imitators .... On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 14:08:09 -0500, theREALmxyzptlk <theREALmxyzptlk@comcast.net> wrote:
quoted 18 lines Alan Lucas wrote:> Alan Lucas wrote: > > >Well, you know, which Donna Summer are you talking about? > > > > > Well, Mr. Forrest has little to do with post-rock either. He has more to > do with the revival of bad rock - so bad it's supposed to be good. > In some cases it is, but NOT so with E.L.O. - do you hear me Jason?? NOT > good. Never was, never will be. Down with Jeff Lynne. ;-) > > jeff > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > >
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2005-02-27 21:02btallent@gmail.com> 4. I wouldn't blame Derrick May for IDM. Autechre have a lot to answer > for, though. I
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Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:02:48 -0800
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Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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quoted 3 lines 4. I wouldn't blame Derrick May for IDM. Autechre have a lot to answer> 4. I wouldn't blame Derrick May for IDM. Autechre have a lot to answer > for, though. I like Autechre as much as the next boffin, but man o > man, the GODAWFUL crap that has come out of Autechre imitators ....
I always hear this statement or something similar to it, and I wonder, what groups do people consider to be bad (or even good) autechre imitators? -- BJT --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-27 21:28Mark Schieldrop> > 4. I wouldn't blame Derrick May for IDM. Autechre have a lot to answer > > for, though
From:
Mark Schieldrop
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Date:
Sun, 27 Feb 2005 16:28:56 -0500
Subject:
RE: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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quoted 7 lines 4. I wouldn't blame Derrick May for IDM. Autechre have a lot to answer> > 4. I wouldn't blame Derrick May for IDM. Autechre have a lot to answer > > for, though. I like Autechre as much as the next boffin, but man o > > man, the GODAWFUL crap that has come out of Autechre imitators .... > > I always hear this statement or something similar to it, and I wonder, > what groups do people consider to be bad (or even good) autechre > imitators?
A lot of time its random shit you download and delete and the names fade away. - schieldrop --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-27 23:54theREALmxyzptlk> > >2. ELO did pretty much suck, after a certain point, but they came out >of The Move, a
From:
theREALmxyzptlk
To:
Kent Williams
Cc:
do id
Date:
Sun, 27 Feb 2005 18:54:58 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
Reply to:
Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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quoted 9 lines 2. ELO did pretty much suck, after a certain point, but they came out> > >2. ELO did pretty much suck, after a certain point, but they came out >of The Move, and Roy Wood is one of the great unsung heroes of >experimental popular music. ELO booted Roy out after the first album >for his relentless love of weirdness. He went on to make several >curious solo albums, that you should buy on sight if they turn up. > >
Oh yeah - Wizzard. Saw 'em a few times. The music died when Roy took a hike. What ELO did to "Do Ya" is unforgiveable. True confession : I was a hard core Move fan. Turkish Tram Conductor Blues still makes the hair on the back of my arms stand up. jeff --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-03-01 22:37atomlyDon't forget Richie Hawtin's place in the AI series. -- :: atomly :: [ atomly@atomly.com :
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Tue, 1 Mar 2005 16:37:11 -0600
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Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Don't forget Richie Hawtin's place in the AI series. -- :: atomly :: [ atomly@atomly.com : www.atomly.com ... [ atomiq records : po box 805319 chicago il 60680 : 312.804.5389 ... [ e-mail atomly-news-subscribe@atomly.com for atomly info and updates ... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-03-03 19:29Z MoserFrom Adam Drucker (doseone)... To all those who are concerned, On Thursday February 24th a
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Thu, 03 Mar 2005 19:29:35 +0000
Subject:
[idm] The Strenght of Dax Pierson
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Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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From Adam Drucker (doseone)... To all those who are concerned, On Thursday February 24th at approximately 1 a.m. in Atlantic, Iowa, our van hit "black ice" and overturned off of the highway 80. There were seven of us aboard, we were doing 40 miles per hour and slowing down. Patrick Scott was driving the vehicle when it hit the stretch of "black ice", which caused us to skid out of control. Patrick temporarily regained control of the vehicle only to be pulled off the highway by the weight of the equipment trailer we were towing. Fortunately for us, the weight of the trailer then saved all our lives by stopping the vehicle from rolling over multiple times. The crash was 10 seconds long. All of us were wearing our seat belts except for Alex who was lying down in the back seat. We all hit against the roof of the van upon impact. Six of us sustained minor cuts and bruises. Dax, however, broke his neck upon impact. His head was then pinned beneath the front row of passenger seats. Upon dislodging his foot from what looked to be an unnatural position, Dax's air passage way was cleared and he began to breath and communicate with us. He told us immediately that he could not feel his lower body. We were met quickly by another motorist, the local sheriff, and an EMT team. The EMT's and firefighters carefullyremoved Daxfrom the overturned vehicle. He was then taken to Cas County hospital in Atlantic, Iowa. One hour later he was emergency air lifted by helicopter to Creighton University Hospital in Omaha Nebraska for X-rays and treatment. (In a 15-minute window three trailer trucks and another passenger van all overturned on the same 10-mile stretch of highway and black ice.) Dax is currently recovering at Creighton University Hospital in the intensive care unit where he will remain for the next three weeks at least. Fortunately Dax is completely covered by his health insurance provided by Amoeba Music in Berkeley California. So all of his care is being paid for and will continue to be covered through out his healing process. Both Dax's mother and father (Myrna Anderson and Herman Pierson) were contacted as soon as possible and arrived at the hospital in Omaha within 24 hours. Dax shattered his c5 vertebrae, which is located at the base of the neck. When his vertebrae shattered it bruised his spinal chord and caused severe swelling around the c5 and adjacent vertebrae. His broken vertebrae were his only injury. Dax is currently experiencing paralysis from his nipple line down. His paralysis is very severe the muscles used to breathe and operate the lungs are located below the nipple line. As a result he is on a ventilator to help him breath. The ventilator is a tube that runs through Dax's mouth and into his lungs to facilitate respiration. It? s presence coupled with Dax's inability to use his hands makes communication for Dax very difficult at the present time. Dax has remained conscious and cognizant throughout the entire process. While broken bones can be mended, the spinal cord does NOT regenerate itself. There is new research into ways this might be achieved -specifically stem cell research - and a good many of these avenues of research are very promising. For now, however, we can pray for a miracle - and miracles DO happen - while at the same time learning to deal with the reality of Dax's new situation On the 25th at 10 am Dax was taken in for surgery. His 4th and 6th vertebrae were fused in order to create a functional neck for Dax. All broken bonedebris was removed and the spinal chord where his c5 broke was encased in a cage of sorts that will protect it and allowed the 4th and 6th vertebrae to be fused on either end of it. The operation was successful and there were no complications. Since then the swelling around the injury has decreased. Dax's injury is now contained and the healing process has begun. The first major hurdle is to have Dax heal enough to be taken off of the ventilator. If this happens he will be given a tracheotomy. The tracheotomy will enable Dax to move his lips and communicate with those caring for him. This step will be huge for his mental and physical comfort and will take all the strength and love he and those who cherish him can provide in the coming weeks. The end of Dax's stay in intensive care will hopefully coincide with him being weaned off of the ventilator and being given the tracheotomy. Due to the "open" or intensive nature of the surgery Dax underwent to have his vertebrae fused, that wound must heal completely and be free of infection before they can open a new wound when giving him a tracheotomy. After his stay in intensive care Dax will be moved to a rehabilitation center for the rest of his recovery. It will most likely be in Texas as to be close to his mother who will be caring for him through this most difficult leg of his recovery. The rehabilitation process could range anywhere from 2 to 24 months. The process will be long and challenging for Dax, his strength, and the strength of those around him, both near and far. In case it is unclear...Dax's mind is completely healthy and everything above his nipple line is in perfect working condition, so he can shrug his shoulders and move his arms slightly, it is only the presence of the ventilator tube in his mouth that prevents him from communicating verbally. His eyes are wide and his heart is strong. To all of you who are sending him love and prayer, keep doing so it is working, and all of our concern and love remains utterly necessary. The physical healing process for this type of injury takes serious time patience and courage. We are now organizing/preparing for Dax's immediate future care and rehabilitation as well as fund raising benefits. We appreciate everyone's patience as we prepare for the long road ahead of Dax. It will be important for all who love him to be present and offer aid not only while the tragedy is before us but when recovery is before us as well. And recovery may be some time from now. As a result we will be establishing a web site for Dax that will allow everyone to enter his or her contact information for future contact and aid. This site will also provide health update information as it becomes available to us. As you can imagine Dax's care, healing, treatment, and return to his "normal" life will be very expensive. We will do our best to keep all those concerned updated on both his health and how they canhelp, in the form of both monetary donation and sheer love. There is a crowd of beautiful people gathering behind Dax... The overwhelming outpouring of love and concern for him has already begun to work its magic on his mental and physical strength...soplease keep it coming...and thank you all. This just in: march 2nd: dax was taken off of the ventilator...he is now talking and smiling. All flowers cards and positive thoughts can be addressed to: Dax Pierson c/o Creighton University Hospital 601 N. 30th St. Omaha, NE 68131 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-27 19:28maxOn Feb 27, 2005, at 12:48 PM, Alan Lucas wrote: > On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:31:59 -0800 (PST)
From:
max
To:
idm Org
Date:
Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:28:14 -0600
Subject:
Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
Reply to:
Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <30aeb7c632f5cfc17145865f2fa76596@cox.net>
On Feb 27, 2005, at 12:48 PM, Alan Lucas wrote:
quoted 10 lines On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:31:59 -0800 (PST), ed c <echurch86@yahoo.com>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:31:59 -0800 (PST), ed c <echurch86@yahoo.com> > wrote: >> I was reading a book that was trying to say Nude Photo was the >> beggining of IDM. Does anybody feel that way cause i sure don't. >> Thats kind of like saying Donna Summer invented Post-Rock. >> >> > > Well, you know, which Donna Summer are you talking about? >
It was really more Giorgio Moroder in this case anyway, not so much Donna Summer, 'Disco Queen' (vs. disco 'Queen' Jason Forrest).... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-27 18:52theREALmxyzptlked c wrote: >I was reading a book that was trying to say Nude Photo was the beggining of I
From:
theREALmxyzptlk
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ed c
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Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:52:38 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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[idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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ed c wrote:
quoted 4 lines I was reading a book that was trying to say Nude Photo was the beggining of IDM. Does anyb>I was reading a book that was trying to say Nude Photo was the beggining of IDM. Does anybody feel that way cause i sure don't. Thats kind of like saying Donna Summer invented Post-Rock. > > >
While I might not agree with that statement in a vacuum, I would say that anyone who feels like IDM just floated down one day in the 1990s is missing a big aspect of the roots involved. Derrick May has a LOT more to do with IDM than Donna has to do with post-rock any way you shake it; that's just a bad analogy, sorry. Take it back to the late 80s, early 90s - where did Carl Craig get his start? A.R.T. is the obvious link between Detroit and IDM with the whole TBD, Plaid, Degiorgio, Stasis LINK with the Detroit sound as well as the fact that they were doing things on the same label. However you want to slot Monolake, Basic Channel and that whole crew, if you don't think there's a connection to Detroit, think again. I'm not a Detroit monger (just because I live very nearby), but it's just the truth. Detroit didn't happen in a vacuum, either - you can kick it back to Kraftwerk, the experimentalists (Stockhausen, Dockstader, etc.) or even Musique Concret if you wish. Even if you do so, you still can't eascape the Detroit influence. And if Detroit never happened, who knows - it might have sprung in some fashion from Chicago or acid house, both of which have their fingers in the pots as well. Everything came from somewhere and if you deny the dance music/techno leg of the whole of IDM, you have a truncated version - an amputee, i.e, a very limited definition which becomes more so the farther back you trace roots. jeff --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-27 19:42max> Detroit didn't happen in a vacuum, either - you can kick it back to > Kraftwerk, the exp
From:
max
Cc:
idm Org
Date:
Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:42:12 -0600
Subject:
Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <0770a5737d373e8b7cf15b564c19f05f@cox.net>
quoted 4 lines Detroit didn't happen in a vacuum, either - you can kick it back to> Detroit didn't happen in a vacuum, either - you can kick it back to > Kraftwerk, the experimentalists (Stockhausen, Dockstader, etc.) or > even Musique Concret if you wish. Even if you do so, you still can't > eascape the Detroit influence.
So true, 'Techno' emerged as an entity of its own due to the Detroit-ists parroting the German and Eurodisco disco sound...
quoted 6 lines And if Detroit never happened, who knows - it might have sprung in> And if Detroit never happened, who knows - it might have sprung in > some fashion from Chicago or acid house, both of which have their > fingers in the pots as well. Everything came from somewhere and if > you deny the dance music/techno leg of the whole of IDM, you have a > truncated version - an amputee, i.e, a very limited definition which > becomes more so the farther back you trace roots.
'God' created Adam, and Adam begat Moses, and Moses begat Jesus, and Jesus begat Anton LaVey, and Anton LaVey begat Marilyn Manson, and Marilyn Manson begat....? It works in a similar vein thru so called 'IDM'... There was a Genesis (who was parroting the Detroit/Chicago sound in establishing 'Acid House'), but there were plenty 'Gods' there before shaping and forming a sound out of the murky void... Derrick May, Juan Adkins, Kevin Saunderson were certainly among the originators of this (R)evolution, in as much as the early Aphexes and Autechres and et ecteras that begat begat.... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-27 21:37Greg Hillwhy doesn't anyone ever mention electro funk as an influence? that's where techno came fro
From:
Greg Hill
To:
, ed c
Cc:
Date:
Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:37:08 -0800
Subject:
Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <005701c51d14$7de1d230$6501a8c0@greg68b4399502>
why doesn't anyone ever mention electro funk as an influence? that's where techno came from...then house, IDM, trance...pretty much all forms of 'dance' music... ----- Original Message ----- From: "theREALmxyzptlk" <theREALmxyzptlk@comcast.net> To: "ed c" <echurch86@yahoo.com> Cc: <idm@hyperreal.org> Sent: Sunday, February 27, 2005 10:52 AM Subject: Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
quoted 37 lines ed c wrote:> ed c wrote: > >>I was reading a book that was trying to say Nude Photo was the beggining >>of IDM. Does anybody feel that way cause i sure don't. Thats kind of like >>saying Donna Summer invented Post-Rock. >> >> > While I might not agree with that statement in a vacuum, I would say that > anyone who feels like IDM just floated down one day in the 1990s is > missing a big aspect of the roots involved. Derrick May has a LOT more to > do with IDM than Donna has to do with post-rock any way you shake it; > that's just a bad analogy, sorry. > Take it back to the late 80s, early 90s - where did Carl Craig get his > start? A.R.T. is the obvious link between Detroit and IDM with the whole > TBD, Plaid, Degiorgio, Stasis LINK with the Detroit sound as well as the > fact that they were doing things on the same label. However you want to > slot Monolake, Basic Channel and that whole crew, if you don't think > there's a connection to Detroit, think again. I'm not a Detroit monger > (just because I live very nearby), but it's just the truth. > Detroit didn't happen in a vacuum, either - you can kick it back to > Kraftwerk, the experimentalists (Stockhausen, Dockstader, etc.) or even > Musique Concret if you wish. Even if you do so, you still can't eascape > the Detroit influence. And if Detroit never happened, who knows - it might > have sprung in some fashion from Chicago or acid house, both of which have > their fingers in the pots as well. Everything came from somewhere and if > you deny the dance music/techno leg of the whole of IDM, you have a > truncated version - an amputee, i.e, a very limited definition which > becomes more so the farther back you trace roots. > > > jeff > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >
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2005-02-27 23:57theREALmxyzptlkGreg Hill wrote: > why doesn't anyone ever mention electro funk as an influence? that's >
From:
theREALmxyzptlk
To:
Greg Hill
Cc:
Date:
Sun, 27 Feb 2005 18:57:05 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Greg Hill wrote:
quoted 3 lines why doesn't anyone ever mention electro funk as an influence? that's> why doesn't anyone ever mention electro funk as an influence? that's > where techno came from...then house, IDM, trance...pretty much all > forms of 'dance' music...
There's some truth to that, but electro-funk has it's start as well. That whole Arthur Baker/John Robie NYC thing was all mixed up with the Cabs and Brits as well - but where would they have been without Kraftwerk? jeff --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-27 23:58Robert Freemanhow're these? havent heard em yet... r. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!?
From:
Robert Freeman
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Date:
Sun, 27 Feb 2005 15:58:26 -0800 (PST)
Subject:
[idm] analord 3 and 4
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Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <20050227235826.52163.qmail@web41607.mail.yahoo.com>
how're these? havent heard em yet... r. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 00:30maxOn Feb 27, 2005, at 5:58 PM, Robert Freeman wrote: > how're these? havent heard em yet...
From:
max
Cc:
Date:
Sun, 27 Feb 2005 18:30:26 -0600
Subject:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
Reply to:
[idm] analord 3 and 4
permalink · <4abb59847039e203d4ba2d43d7239f5d@cox.net>
On Feb 27, 2005, at 5:58 PM, Robert Freeman wrote:
quoted 3 lines how're these? havent heard em yet...> how're these? havent heard em yet... > r. >
Not quite as good as 1 & 2...... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 04:19Alan LucasOn Sun, 27 Feb 2005 15:58:26 -0800 (PST), Robert Freeman <mammal11@yahoo.com> wrote: > how
From:
Alan Lucas
To:
Robert Freeman
Cc:
Date:
Sun, 27 Feb 2005 23:19:00 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
Reply to:
[idm] analord 3 and 4
permalink · <5e21321c0502272019347e3096@mail.gmail.com>
On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 15:58:26 -0800 (PST), Robert Freeman <mammal11@yahoo.com> wrote:
quoted 3 lines how're these? havent heard em yet...> how're these? havent heard em yet... > r. >
Well worth it, IMO. Especially 04, whose A-Side is killer. Crying In Your Face is pure gold. Absolutely loving the Analords. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 19:59Josh Steineri think they are a lot better than 1 + 2, its seems he's getting more melodic and less min
From:
Josh Steiner
To:
Robert Freeman
Cc:
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 11:59:12 -0800
Subject:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
Reply to:
[idm] analord 3 and 4
permalink · <42237810.8060204@vitriolix.com>
i think they are a lot better than 1 + 2, its seems he's getting more melodic and less minimal as he progresses forward, i wonder if he's planning on takign a smooth curve from 1+ 2 --> 10. Robert Freeman wrote:
quoted 15 lines how're these? havent heard em yet...>how're these? havent heard em yet... >r. > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. >http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > >
-- ________________________________________________________________ live experimental electronic music -- http://bluevitriol.com independent u.s. drum'n'bass -- http://vitriolix.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 20:40paul symonsis there anyway of geting hold of them digitaly or on cd ? On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 11:59:12 -0
From:
paul symons
To:
Josh Steiner
Cc:
Robert Freeman ,
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 12:40:34 -0800
Subject:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
Reply to:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
permalink · <8fc23919050228124021d7cede@mail.gmail.com>
is there anyway of geting hold of them digitaly or on cd ? On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 11:59:12 -0800, Josh Steiner <josh@vitriolix.com> wrote:
quoted 32 lines i think they are a lot better than 1 + 2, its seems he's getting more> i think they are a lot better than 1 + 2, its seems he's getting more > melodic and less minimal as he progresses forward, i wonder if he's > planning on takign a smooth curve from 1+ 2 --> 10. > > Robert Freeman wrote: > > >how're these? havent heard em yet... > >r. > > > > > > > >__________________________________ > >Do you Yahoo!? > >Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. > >http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- > >To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > >For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > > > > > > -- > ________________________________________________________________ > live experimental electronic music -- http://bluevitriol.com > independent u.s. drum'n'bass -- http://vitriolix.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > >
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2005-02-28 20:59Alan LucasOn Mon, 28 Feb 2005 12:40:34 -0800, paul symons <soulstealer.ps@gmail.com> wrote: > is the
From:
Alan Lucas
To:
incidental derogatory mnemonics
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 15:59:30 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
Reply to:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
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On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 12:40:34 -0800, paul symons <soulstealer.ps@gmail.com> wrote:
quoted 2 lines is there anyway of geting hold of them digitaly or on cd ?> is there anyway of geting hold of them digitaly or on cd ? >
It's easy enough to find them if you know where to look. There's no CD version, and I don't think that Rephlex has plans to do a CD. Geez. I can't believe I only have five more slots in the binder to fill. This series is going to be finished before you know it, and then I'm not going to have any new AFX to look forward to. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 21:48StaticBeatsWell, Im having a hard time tracking down a confirmation (rephlex has removed analord 10 f
From:
StaticBeats
To:
Intolerable Daily Madness
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 13:48:26 -0800 (PST)
Subject:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
Reply to:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
permalink · <20050228214826.18620.qmail@web54003.mail.yahoo.com>
Well, Im having a hard time tracking down a confirmation (rephlex has removed analord 10 from their site) but I was under the impression that a CD was to be released sometime after Analord 9? Here's an older warp link that does not answer the question: http://www.warprecords.com/artists/news.php?filter=afx&ti_id=894 Shimone/Justes http://www.staticbeats.com Electronic Music > Digital Culture --- Alan Lucas <alucas@gmail.com> wrote:
quoted 17 lines On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 12:40:34 -0800, paul symons> On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 12:40:34 -0800, paul symons > <soulstealer.ps@gmail.com> wrote: > > is there anyway of geting hold of them digitaly or > on cd ? > > > > It's easy enough to find them if you know where to > look. There's no CD > version, and I don't think that Rephlex has plans to > do a CD. > > Geez. I can't believe I only have five more slots in > the binder to > fill. This series is going to be finished before you > know it, and then > I'm not going to have any new AFX to look forward > to.
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2005-02-28 21:54Neil WalshOn Mon, 28 Feb 2005 13:48:26 -0800 (PST), StaticBeats <stupidnametaken@yahoo.com> wrote: >
From:
Neil Walsh
To:
Intolerable Daily Madness
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 21:54:35 +0000
Subject:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
Reply to:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
permalink · <64e028a205022813546c4b2c10@mail.gmail.com>
On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 13:48:26 -0800 (PST), StaticBeats <stupidnametaken@yahoo.com> wrote:
quoted 4 lines Well, Im having a hard time tracking down a> Well, Im having a hard time tracking down a > confirmation (rephlex has removed analord 10 from > their site) but I was under the impression that a CD > was to be released sometime after Analord 9?
Around the time in one of the mailouts they mentioned releaseding Analord on an "alternative format". Everyone assumed that "alternative format" meant a CD, but Grant (co-owner of Rephlex) clarified that and said that a "normal" 12" version of Analord 10 would be released after the other 9. There are no plans to release this on CD. Neil --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 21:56StaticBeatsAh yes. It was one of the mailouts... and true - alternative does not necessarily mean CD.
From:
StaticBeats
To:
Intolerable Daily Madness
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 13:56:49 -0800 (PST)
Subject:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
Reply to:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
permalink · <20050228215650.87874.qmail@web54004.mail.yahoo.com>
Ah yes. It was one of the mailouts... and true - alternative does not necessarily mean CD. Any chance we'll see this on Bleep? Shimone/Justes http://www.staticbeats.com Electronic Music > Digital Culture --- Neil Walsh <walsh.neil@gmail.com> wrote:
quoted 23 lines On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 13:48:26 -0800 (PST),> On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 13:48:26 -0800 (PST), > StaticBeats > <stupidnametaken@yahoo.com> wrote: > > Well, Im having a hard time tracking down a > > confirmation (rephlex has removed analord 10 from > > their site) but I was under the impression that a > CD > > was to be released sometime after Analord 9? > > Around the time in one of the mailouts they > mentioned releaseding > Analord on an "alternative format". Everyone assumed > that "alternative > format" meant a CD, but Grant (co-owner of Rephlex) > clarified that and > said that a "normal" 12" version of Analord 10 would > be released after > the other 9. There are no plans to release this on > CD. > > Neil > >
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quoted 6 lines To unsubscribe, e-mail:> To unsubscribe, e-mail: > idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: > idm-help@hyperreal.org > >
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2005-02-28 23:22Alan LucasOn Mon, 28 Feb 2005 13:56:49 -0800 (PST), StaticBeats <stupidnametaken@yahoo.com> wrote: >
From:
Alan Lucas
To:
StaticBeats
Cc:
Intolerable Daily Madness
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 18:22:23 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
Reply to:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
permalink · <5e21321c050228152218b09124@mail.gmail.com>
On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 13:56:49 -0800 (PST), StaticBeats <stupidnametaken@yahoo.com> wrote:
quoted 8 lines Ah yes. It was one of the mailouts... and true -> Ah yes. It was one of the mailouts... and true - > alternative does not necessarily mean CD. Any chance > we'll see this on Bleep? > > Shimone/Justes > http://www.staticbeats.com > Electronic Music > Digital Culture >
I would kinda doubt it given that RDJ had them yank the HAB eps shortly after Bleep's inception. That and the fact that Rephlex still aren't on Bleep anyway. That AFX is a cagey bastard. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 21:56theREALmxyzptlkStaticBeats wrote: >Well, Im having a hard time tracking down a >confirmation (rephlex has
From:
theREALmxyzptlk
To:
StaticBeats
Cc:
Intolerable Daily Madness
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 16:56:16 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
Reply to:
Re: [idm] analord 3 and 4
permalink · <42239380.50807@comcast.net>
StaticBeats wrote:
quoted 6 lines Well, Im having a hard time tracking down a>Well, Im having a hard time tracking down a >confirmation (rephlex has removed analord 10 from >their site) but I was under the impression that a CD >was to be released sometime after Analord 9? > >
I thought the opposite and that speculation was (logically) that it MIGHT happen, but they (Rephlex) were playing it awfully close by saying it wasn't or that no plans for one exist. jeff --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 06:15Greg Hillyes, Kraftwerk the innovators in ALL forms of electronic music..much respect! ----- Origin
From:
Greg Hill
To:
Cc:
Date:
Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:15:56 -0800
Subject:
[idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <00a401c51d5c$f7bf18e0$6501a8c0@greg68b4399502>
yes, Kraftwerk the innovators in ALL forms of electronic music..much respect! ----- Original Message ----- From: "theREALmxyzptlk" <theREALmxyzptlk@comcast.net> To: "Greg Hill" <cameron69@comcast.net> Cc: <idm@hyperreal.org> Sent: Sunday, February 27, 2005 3:57 PM Subject: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
quoted 12 lines Greg Hill wrote:> Greg Hill wrote: > >> why doesn't anyone ever mention electro funk as an influence? that's >> where techno came from...then house, IDM, trance...pretty much all forms >> of 'dance' music... > > There's some truth to that, but electro-funk has it's start as well. That > whole Arthur Baker/John Robie NYC thing was all mixed up with the Cabs and > Brits as well - but where would they have been without Kraftwerk? > > jeff >
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2005-02-28 13:36John/SlackonomicsOn Feb 28, 2005, at 12:15 AM, Greg Hill wrote: > yes, Kraftwerk the innovators in ALL form
From:
John/Slackonomics
To:
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 07:36:24 -0600
Subject:
Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
Reply to:
[idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <811471876b480fa957e5168a6ff36b79@slackonomics.com>
On Feb 28, 2005, at 12:15 AM, Greg Hill wrote:
quoted 2 lines yes, Kraftwerk the innovators in ALL forms of electronic music..much> yes, Kraftwerk the innovators in ALL forms of electronic music..much > respect!
Don't forget Yellow Magic Orchestra, Pink Floyd, David Bowie/Brian Eno and especially Jean-Jacques Perry/Gershon Kingsley and many others. In fact, I think Perry/Kingsley are more important to electronic music than even maybe the legendary Kraftwerk. -- Mr. Tangent [the binary police] www.mrtangent.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 13:43theREALmxyzptlkJohn/Slackonomics wrote: > > >> > In fact, I think Perry/Kingsley are more important to el
From:
theREALmxyzptlk
To:
John/Slackonomics
Cc:
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:43:01 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <42231FE5.4020906@comcast.net>
John/Slackonomics wrote:
quoted 6 lines In fact, I think Perry/Kingsley are more important to electronic> > >> > In fact, I think Perry/Kingsley are more important to electronic > music than even maybe the legendary Kraftwerk. >
Nice for an obscure reference points in a thread, but c'mon - do you really THINK so? jeff --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 13:46ersatz-noddyIn that case, Thomas Edison is most important to electronic music... m* On Feb 28, 2005, a
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ersatz-noddy
To:
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Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:46:29 +0100
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <2cbc55c818d7f9c7e9645036794230d2@ersatzdesign.com>
In that case, Thomas Edison is most important to electronic music... m* On Feb 28, 2005, at 2:43 PM, theREALmxyzptlk wrote:
quoted 18 lines John/Slackonomics wrote:> John/Slackonomics wrote: > >> >> >>> >> In fact, I think Perry/Kingsley are more important to electronic >> music than even maybe the legendary Kraftwerk. >> > Nice for an obscure reference points in a thread, but c'mon - do you > really THINK so? > > jeff > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >
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2005-02-28 13:55theREALmxyzptlkersatz-noddy wrote: > In that case, Thomas Edison is most important to electronic music...
From:
theREALmxyzptlk
To:
ersatz-noddy
Cc:
idm list
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:55:13 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <422322C1.80306@comcast.net>
ersatz-noddy wrote:
quoted 3 lines In that case, Thomas Edison is most important to electronic music...> In that case, Thomas Edison is most important to electronic music... > m* >
Let's not forget Tesla :-) jeff --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 14:21John/SlackonomicsOn Feb 28, 2005, at 7:43 AM, theREALmxyzptlk wrote: >> In fact, I think Perry/Kingsley are
From:
John/Slackonomics
To:
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:21:53 -0600
Subject:
Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
Reply to:
Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <18ca07a93b17f5e0e8d8f18cea458e9f@slackonomics.com>
On Feb 28, 2005, at 7:43 AM, theREALmxyzptlk wrote:
quoted 5 lines In fact, I think Perry/Kingsley are more important to electronic>> In fact, I think Perry/Kingsley are more important to electronic >> music than even maybe the legendary Kraftwerk. >> > Nice for an obscure reference points in a thread, but c'mon - do you > really THINK so?
Indeed, because not only did they precede Kraftwerk by a decade or so, but their music was extremely more elaborate to create. Some several miles of tape were painstakingly handspliced in order to get the "sampled" sound that we identify with so readily now (and can so easily recreate in seconds with modern samplers/computers). I give Kraftwerk major props, no doubt, but I feel that at very least Perry/Kingsley are as important. Especially, in their own unique way, to experimental electronic and idm. You could say that Perry/Kinglsey's music was, in some perverse fantasy-land form, proto-idm. Much the same that I consider Ryuichi Sakamoto's B2 Unit a proto-idm album, a good decade+ before IDM came around. -- Mr. Tangent [the binary police] www.mrtangent.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 14:30theREALmxyzptlkJohn/Slackonomics wrote: > On Feb 28, 2005, at 7:43 AM, theREALmxyzptlk wrote: > >>> In fa
From:
theREALmxyzptlk
To:
John/Slackonomics
Cc:
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 09:30:44 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
Reply to:
Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <42232B14.2060303@comcast.net>
John/Slackonomics wrote:
quoted 22 lines On Feb 28, 2005, at 7:43 AM, theREALmxyzptlk wrote:> On Feb 28, 2005, at 7:43 AM, theREALmxyzptlk wrote: > >>> In fact, I think Perry/Kingsley are more important to electronic >>> music than even maybe the legendary Kraftwerk. >>> >> Nice for an obscure reference points in a thread, but c'mon - do you >> really THINK so? > > > Indeed, because not only did they precede Kraftwerk by a decade or so, > but their music was extremely more elaborate to create. Some several > miles of tape were painstakingly handspliced in order to get the > "sampled" sound that we identify with so readily now (and can so > easily recreate in seconds with modern samplers/computers). > > I give Kraftwerk major props, no doubt, but I feel that at very least > Perry/Kingsley are as important. Especially, in their own unique way, > to experimental electronic and idm. You could say that > Perry/Kinglsey's music was, in some perverse fantasy-land form, > proto-idm. Much the same that I consider Ryuichi Sakamoto's B2 Unit a > proto-idm album, a good decade+ before IDM came around. >
Again - you miss the thread by a mile : influence - not complexity. I wouldn't disagree with you about anything you say, except when you subsitute "importance" for "influence". Not quite the same thing. I could argue that I knew of just about anyone doing whatever before it became popular, but whe the topic is influence, one has to take an aspect of scope into the picture. Perry/Kingsley just didn't have the exposure THEN *or* now in comparison with Kraftwerk. Not even with Sakamoto/YMO, who didn't have the exposure Kraftwerk did (and I would argue that "Technodelic" is as IDM as B2 Unit). If you want to take the thread somewhere else, fine. But changing horses in mid-stream as a debate progresses usualy means the one you were on was a loser. jeff --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 23:20Josh Steinerraymond. scott. John/Slackonomics wrote: > On Feb 28, 2005, at 12:15 AM, Greg Hill wrote:
From:
Josh Steiner
To:
Date:
Mon, 28 Feb 2005 15:20:49 -0800
Subject:
Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
Reply to:
Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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raymond. scott. John/Slackonomics wrote:
quoted 20 lines On Feb 28, 2005, at 12:15 AM, Greg Hill wrote:> On Feb 28, 2005, at 12:15 AM, Greg Hill wrote: > >> yes, Kraftwerk the innovators in ALL forms of electronic music..much >> respect! > > > Don't forget Yellow Magic Orchestra, Pink Floyd, David Bowie/Brian Eno > and especially Jean-Jacques Perry/Gershon Kingsley and many others. > In fact, I think Perry/Kingsley are more important to electronic music > than even maybe the legendary Kraftwerk. > > -- > > Mr. Tangent [the binary police] > www.mrtangent.com > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
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2005-02-28 13:41ersatz-noddyOk, and let us not forget Eno/Michael Rother/Neu!/Moebius/Roedelius (Cluster), Connie Plan
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Ok, and let us not forget Eno/Michael Rother/Neu!/Moebius/Roedelius (Cluster), Connie Plank, and other German Prog-gies. I find a lot of their material has aged better and holds up a little more strongly than Kraftwerk as a pre-cursor, who seem to be--to me anyway--rather dreary and overly-pretentious. Anyone who caught their tour/side show last year might agree--they are too easy to parody; in fact, they're doing it themselves. The Tour De France Soundtracks make me think of hampsters running on wheels. Harmonia's "Tracks and Traces" is a truer grandaddy of "Geogaddi" than "Autobahn" (and most certainly "Electric Cafe" ;) just my 2 cents, m*
2005-02-28 13:54theREALmxyzptlkersatz-noddy wrote: > Ok, and let us not forget Eno/Michael Rother/Neu!/Moebius/Roedelius
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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ersatz-noddy wrote:
quoted 8 lines Ok, and let us not forget Eno/Michael Rother/Neu!/Moebius/Roedelius> Ok, and let us not forget Eno/Michael Rother/Neu!/Moebius/Roedelius > (Cluster), Connie Plank, and other German Prog-gies. I find a lot of > their material has aged better and holds up a little more strongly > than Kraftwerk as a pre-cursor, who seem to be--to me anyway--rather > dreary and overly-pretentious. Anyone who caught their tour/side show > last year might agree--they are too easy to parody; in fact, they're > doing it themselves. The Tour De France Soundtracks make me think of > hampsters running on wheels.
You pick the weakest selection, culled from a time when 1/2 of the band is gone and ignore some very pertinent history to make that point. If you're talking about influence, Kraftwerk just can't be denied - regarless of what you think "holds up". I was there when all of those artists splashed on the scene and still listen to them all, but influence takes scope into account. They were all major forces, but Kraftwerk is the big gun up there, with only Eno even in that kind of 'running'. Even YMO (and I was/am a rabid J-pop collector from the late 70s on) cite Kraftwerk as THE influence. There's a whole web-page out there devoted to a meeting between the bands. jeff --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 14:01ersatz-noddyOk. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't "Tracks and Traces" (their third and last record in
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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permalink · <6f41a56b6ad35d28c01ec6dc526fc53c@ersatzdesign.com>
Ok. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't "Tracks and Traces" (their third and last record in this capacity) consist of Rother, Moebius, Roedelius with the edition of Eno? And after Michael Rother left they became Cluster and Eno? Educate me, sir. I need education.... m* On Feb 28, 2005, at 2:54 PM, theREALmxyzptlk wrote:
quoted 27 lines ersatz-noddy wrote:> ersatz-noddy wrote: > >> Ok, and let us not forget Eno/Michael Rother/Neu!/Moebius/Roedelius >> (Cluster), Connie Plank, and other German Prog-gies. I find a lot of >> their material has aged better and holds up a little more strongly >> than Kraftwerk as a pre-cursor, who seem to be--to me anyway--rather >> dreary and overly-pretentious. Anyone who caught their tour/side show >> last year might agree--they are too easy to parody; in fact, they're >> doing it themselves. The Tour De France Soundtracks make me think of >> hampsters running on wheels. > > You pick the weakest selection, culled from a time when 1/2 of the > band is gone and ignore some very pertinent history to make that > point. > If you're talking about influence, Kraftwerk just can't be denied - > regarless of what you think "holds up". > I was there when all of those artists splashed on the scene and still > listen to them all, but influence takes scope into account. They were > all major forces, but Kraftwerk is the big gun up there, with only Eno > even in that kind of 'running'. Even YMO (and I was/am a rabid J-pop > collector from the late 70s on) cite Kraftwerk as THE influence. > There's a whole web-page out there devoted to a meeting between the > bands. > > > jeff >
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2005-02-28 14:10theREALmxyzptlkersatz-noddy wrote: > Ok. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't "Tracks and Traces" (their >
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ersatz-noddy
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Mon, 28 Feb 2005 09:10:52 -0500
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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ersatz-noddy wrote:
quoted 6 lines Ok. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't "Tracks and Traces" (their> Ok. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't "Tracks and Traces" (their > third and last record in this capacity) consist of Rother, Moebius, > Roedelius with the edition of Eno? And after Michael Rother left they > became Cluster and Eno? Educate me, sir. I need education.... > > m*
You can google it out as well as I - but my point was to the suggestion of scope/influence, the thread topic. And as part of that context, just because Eno Clustered himself for a while, doesn't place the influence of Roedelius/Moebius or Rother quite (imo, of course) in the same league as Eno. Brian was a Tour de Force before he did the Cluster records, although they probably influenced his direction. Still, he did "No Pussyfooting" with Fripp WAY back when, so one would be hard pressed to say he had no 'ambient' notions pre-Cluster. jeff --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 14:32Enquiries> Ok, and let us not forget Eno/Michael Rother/Neu!/Moebius/Roedelius (Cluster), > Connie
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permalink · <BE48DBF7.E228%enquiries@eleventhvolume.com>
quoted 9 lines Ok, and let us not forget Eno/Michael Rother/Neu!/Moebius/Roedelius (Cluster),> Ok, and let us not forget Eno/Michael Rother/Neu!/Moebius/Roedelius (Cluster), > Connie Plank, and other German Prog-gies. I find a lot of their material has > aged better and holds up a little more strongly than Kraftwerk as a > pre-cursor, who seem to be--to me anyway--rather dreary and > overly-pretentious. Anyone who caught their tour/side show last year might > agree--they are too easy to parody; in fact, they're doing it themselves. The > Tour De France Soundtracks make me think of hampsters running on wheels. > Harmonia's "Tracks and Traces" is a truer grandaddy of "Geogaddi" than > "Autobahn" (and most certainly "Electric Cafe" ;)
You, like so many others, seem to miss the fact that Kraftwerk have always had a sense of humour both about themselves as performers and about their music. Just a few examples: the failure of the starter motor to work at the beginning of the live version of Autobahn, the subjection of Numbers in live performance to the uncertainty principle, the droll intonation of the vocals on Pocket Calculator. As to Geogaddi - lovely though BoC may be, we're not talking groundbreaking in any real sense of the word. Musical fashions ebb and flow, but Kraftwerk are widely acknowledged to be successors to the Beatles in terms of breadth of influence on popular music. No one else comes close. You may not like Kraftwerk very much, but Harmonia/Cluster/Neu (who I, like Jeff, adore) are just not in the same league. Cheers, Colin. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 14:40theREALmxyzptlkEnquiries wrote: >>ric Cafe" ;) >> >> >You, like so many others, seem to miss the fact tha
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <42232D6E.8020003@comcast.net>
Enquiries wrote:
quoted 12 lines ric Cafe" ;)>>ric Cafe" ;) >> >> >You, like so many others, seem to miss the fact that Kraftwerk have always >had a sense of humour both about themselves as performers and about their >music. Just a few examples: the failure of the starter motor to work at the >beginning of the live version of Autobahn, the subjection of Numbers in live >performance to the uncertainty principle, the droll intonation of the vocals >on Pocket Calculator. > > >
I might add the whole thing about robots taking over onstage - very tongue in cheek. I recall an interview they did in the early 80s (?) where they said the tape recorder was the new god. jeff --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 14:50ersatz-noddyI probably did miss the point and I think you bring up some very good points. However, som
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Mon, 28 Feb 2005 15:50:02 +0100
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <8d176fbe7ae0d8fa1ceabfc75622b2ff@ersatzdesign.com>
I probably did miss the point and I think you bring up some very good points. However, sometimes the artists themselves are the most deluded about where they get their ideas. My personal opinion (and this is really only my opinion) culled from simply listening to the music, is that Eno (and not Kraftwerk) is most central to the IDM canon, in spirit, tone, seriousness, and beauty. Kevin Blechdom said it best (she always says it best): "If you're talking and you know it, Shut the fuck up" and so I will... m* On Feb 28, 2005, at 3:40 PM, theREALmxyzptlk wrote:
quoted 29 lines Enquiries wrote:> Enquiries wrote: > >>> ric Cafe" ;) >>> >> You, like so many others, seem to miss the fact that Kraftwerk have >> always >> had a sense of humour both about themselves as performers and about >> their >> music. Just a few examples: the failure of the starter motor to work >> at the >> beginning of the live version of Autobahn, the subjection of Numbers >> in live >> performance to the uncertainty principle, the droll intonation of the >> vocals >> on Pocket Calculator. >> >> > I might add the whole thing about robots taking over onstage - very > tongue in cheek. > I recall an interview they did in the early 80s (?) where they said > the tape recorder was the new god. > > jeff > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >
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2005-02-28 23:31dj fisheadhow come nobody is talking about the influence of industrial on idm? just curious - especi
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Mon, 28 Feb 2005 23:31:39 +0000
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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how come nobody is talking about the influence of industrial on idm? just curious - especially in light of folks like Richard H. Kirk being involved with records on both Industrial Records and Warp... take a listen to Distant Dreams (Part 2), AB7A or Hot On The Heels Of Love by Throbbing Gristle. It's rather interesting stuff. TG's reputation seems mostly based on their more abrasive material (Mission Of Dead Souls, for example), but Heathen Earth is a wonderful listen. ...and that's without even getting started on the whole post-industrial ebm -> idm transition (Greater Than One/Tricky Disco, Final Cut/U.R. connection)... although, when it comes down to it... the Industrial stuff really owes debts to prog, performance art and ABBA. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-03-01 01:13John/SlackonomicsOn Feb 28, 2005, at 5:31 PM, dj fishead wrote: > how come nobody is talking about the infl
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Mon, 28 Feb 2005 19:13:21 -0600
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <65356fdd6f3885b29435260947434d15@slackonomics.com>
On Feb 28, 2005, at 5:31 PM, dj fishead wrote:
quoted 15 lines how come nobody is talking about the influence of industrial on idm?> how come nobody is talking about the influence of industrial on idm? > > just curious - especially in light of folks like Richard H. Kirk being > involved with records on both Industrial Records and Warp... take a > listen to Distant Dreams (Part 2), AB7A or Hot On The Heels Of Love by > Throbbing Gristle. It's rather interesting stuff. TG's reputation > seems mostly based on their more abrasive material (Mission Of Dead > Souls, for example), but Heathen Earth is a wonderful listen. > > ...and that's without even getting started on the whole > post-industrial ebm -> idm transition (Greater Than One/Tricky Disco, > Final Cut/U.R. connection)... > > although, when it comes down to it... the Industrial stuff really owes > debts to prog, performance art and ABBA.
It's been spoken about a lot here, actually. I came to IDM by way of industrial. IDM owes some allegiance to industrial but only marginally, imo. Except, perhaps, the aforementioned ebm sound or artists like Coil and maybe even Clock DVA. Most "true" industrial like TG, SPK, Merzbow, etc. are just too abrasive/dissonant compared to the sound of quote-unquote IDM. Except for maybe Autechre's more atonal moments. I suppose industrial was an influence, but IDM isn't a direct descendent. -- Mr. Tangent [the binary police] www.mrtangent.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-03-01 01:37maxOn Feb 28, 2005, at 7:13 PM, John/Slackonomics wrote: > On Feb 28, 2005, at 5:31 PM, dj fi
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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On Feb 28, 2005, at 7:13 PM, John/Slackonomics wrote:
quoted 5 lines On Feb 28, 2005, at 5:31 PM, dj fishead wrote:> On Feb 28, 2005, at 5:31 PM, dj fishead wrote: > >> how come nobody is talking about the influence of industrial on idm? >> >>
Psychic TV played around in the early noodlings of Acid House.... np: Psychic TV---"Blue Pyramid" --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-03-01 02:48dj fishead>It's been spoken about a lot here, actually. I came to IDM by way of >industrial. IDM owe
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Tue, 01 Mar 2005 02:48:16 +0000
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <BAY1-F2736E507C8880EF4B39DA78D590@phx.gbl>
quoted 7 lines It's been spoken about a lot here, actually. I came to IDM by way of>It's been spoken about a lot here, actually. I came to IDM by way of >industrial. IDM owes some allegiance to industrial but only marginally, >imo. Except, perhaps, the aforementioned ebm sound or artists like Coil >and maybe even Clock DVA. Most "true" industrial like TG, SPK, Merzbow, >etc. are just too abrasive/dissonant compared to the sound of quote-unquote >IDM. Except for maybe Autechre's more atonal moments. I suppose >industrial was an influence, but IDM isn't a direct descendent.
I think it would depend on which album you checked out.. as mentioned earlier, TG had a fair amount of melodic material that was overlooked - and if you subtract the effect of a hostile crowd, then there are some really great things. There's this idea that industrial is related to factory/machinery sounds - but the whole concept behind the label was to get people thinking about the music 'industry' as such... a factory that grinds out popstars. This is probably more true now than ever before. As far as 'true' industrial goes - Clock DVA's earliest material was released on Industrial Records (as was some of Richard H. Kirk's) - so I'm assuming you're refering to 'industrial' as the term was mistakenly applied, rather than how it was originally intended (as a statement, not a description). Clock DVA (and the numerous side projects of Newton - specifically those involving McKenzie) do merit special mention. Not so much with the jazzier material (or maybe the jazzier stuff *is* more important - especially in light of the importance of time signature play in a lot of idm. I'm not talking about Time Out... Thelonius Monk is what I'm driving at- sorry, tangent, back to the point...). Once you've reached the Buried Dreams-era things get very interesting (see: The Unseen, The Act [the instrumental version, in particular] and b-sides like Connection Machine and Sonology Of Sex)... TAGC's rhythmic contribution to Hafler Trio's Masturbatorium is really nice (and can be heard sans Annie Sprinkle on the Psychophysicists album). The bulk of these releases also feature some of the most absurdly detailed liner notes I've ever encountered... Can't believe I haven't mentioned Portion Control... the stuff they were doing 80-82 is damned impressive... Simulate Sensual might be the White Light/White Heat of the late 80s electronic scene. The kids at Hot Topic wouldn't know it, but the people making the music know. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2005-02-28 16:49Greg Hillthe people you mentioned are mostly ambient type artists.. how did they influence dance ge
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Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:49:17 -0800
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Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM?
permalink · <005801c51db5$718ed7c0$6501a8c0@greg68b4399502>
the people you mentioned are mostly ambient type artists.. how did they influence dance genres?? electro, trance, house, DnB???? Kraftwerk is the group that almost everyone will say started electronic dance music... ----- Original Message ----- From: ersatz-noddy To: idm list Sent: Monday, February 28, 2005 5:41 AM Subject: Re: [idm] Re: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM? Ok, and let us not forget Eno/Michael Rother/Neu!/Moebius/Roedelius (Cluster), Connie Plank, and other German Prog-gies. I find a lot of their material has aged better and holds up a little more strongly than Kraftwerk as a pre-cursor, who seem to be--to me anyway--rather dreary and overly-pretentious. Anyone who caught their tour/side show last year might agree--they are too easy to parody; in fact, they're doing it themselves. The Tour De France Soundtracks make me think of hampsters running on wheels. Harmonia's "Tracks and Traces" is a truer grandaddy of "Geogaddi" than "Autobahn" (and most certainly "Electric Cafe" ;) just my 2 cents, m* ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ www.ersatzdesign.com On Feb 28, 2005, at 7:15 AM, Greg Hill wrote: yes, Kraftwerk the innovators in ALL forms of electronic music..much respect! ----- Original Message ----- From: "theREALmxyzptlk" <theREALmxyzptlk@comcast.net> To: "Greg Hill" <cameron69@comcast.net> Cc: <idm@hyperreal.org> Sent: Sunday, February 27, 2005 3:57 PM Subject: @WL Re: [idm] Derrick May invented IDM? Greg Hill wrote: why doesn't anyone ever mention electro funk as an influence? that's where techno came from...then house, IDM, trance...pretty much all forms of 'dance' music... There's some truth to that, but electro-funk has it's start as well. That whole Arthur Baker/John Robie NYC thing was all mixed up with the Cabs and Brits as well - but where would they have been without Kraftwerk? jeff --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org