179,854Messages
9,130Senders
30Years
342mboxes

← archive index

[idm] Computers as Artists [was Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ]

13 messages · 11 participants · spans 1 day · search this subject
◇ merged from 3 subjects: computers as artists [was re: [idm] idm list suggestion ------ everyone please read] · idm list suggestion · idm list suggestion ------ everyone please read
2003-02-22 06:18Jason Vorhees [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
├─ 2003-02-22 06:26Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
├─ 2003-02-22 15:31Brett Dietsch Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
└─ 2003-02-22 21:45Mike Brown Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
├─ 2003-02-22 21:50Neil Walsh Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
├─ 2003-02-22 22:23Muffin Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
├─ 2003-02-22 23:59The REAL Mxyzptlk Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
└─ 2003-02-23 01:43Jason Vorhees Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION
2003-02-22 19:47seeklektek Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
2003-02-22 20:44cutups Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
2003-02-22 20:52Richard Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
└─ 2003-02-22 21:08Greg Clow Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
└─ 2003-02-22 21:33Muffin [idm] Computers as Artists [was Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ]
expand allcollapse allclick any summary to toggle that message
2003-02-22 06:18Jason VorheesGreetings! Wouldn't it be easier if there was a messageboard that everyone could read and
From:
Jason Vorhees
To:
Date:
Fri, 21 Feb 2003 22:18:33 -0800 (PST)
Subject:
[idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
permalink · <20030222061833.55552.qmail@web14803.mail.yahoo.com>
Greetings! Wouldn't it be easier if there was a messageboard that everyone could read and post at will instead of filling all of our inbox's with garbage? I know i'm not alone in the fact, that i have to just delete most of mail right off.. Especially with the EGAY spammers.. If I'm interested in your stuff, i will do a search for it. I know alot of us use message boards daily. Why wouldn't this work? I see it now, the "IDM Board" i'm thiniking something like this only IDM minded.. and some better colors... http://www.nubreaks.com/forum/ cheers --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more
2003-02-22 06:26"kiya \"iamacopier\" babzani" <denial@ix.netcom.com>> I know alot of us use message boards daily. Why wouldn't this work? I see it > now, the
From:
To:
idm list
Date:
Fri, 21 Feb 2003 22:26:35 -0800
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
Reply to:
[idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
permalink · <BA7C581B.3245%denial@ix.netcom.com>
quoted 5 lines I know alot of us use message boards daily. Why wouldn't this work? I see it> I know alot of us use message boards daily. Why wouldn't this work? I see it > now, the "IDM Board" i'm thiniking something like this only IDM minded.. and > some better colors... > > http://www.nubreaks.com/forum/
this is a great fucking idea. everybody unsub, and go use a message board! thanks Mr. Vorhees for your groundbreaking idea! see you on the message boards. :) -kiya iamacopierltd. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-02-22 15:31Brett DietschOn Saturday, February 22, 2003, at 01:18 AM, Jason Vorhees wrote: > I know alot of us use
From:
Brett Dietsch
To:
Date:
Sat, 22 Feb 2003 10:31:24 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
Reply to:
[idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
permalink · <B3AC789C-467A-11D7-AD0A-000393AE83B6@lawngnome.org>
On Saturday, February 22, 2003, at 01:18 AM, Jason Vorhees wrote:
quoted 3 lines I know alot of us use message boards daily. Why wouldn't this work? I> I know alot of us use message boards daily. Why wouldn't this work? I > see it now, the "IDM Board" i'm thiniking something like this only IDM > minded.. and some better colors...
i'll switch to a message board if its able to filter posts from certain people and of certain topics, plus each user should be able to delete an entire thread from their view with the click of one button. it should also go out to all other message boards that each user goes to, pull down those posts, and present each of them in an easy to read, easy to parse, easy to sort format and present them on a per-user basis. oh, and it should accept and send all posts via email as well, because message boards suck. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-02-22 21:45Mike BrownJason Vorhees wrote: > Wouldn't it be easier if there was a messageboard If you think the
From:
Mike Brown
To:
Jason Vorhees
Cc:
Date:
Sat, 22 Feb 2003 13:45:25 -0800 (PST)
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
Reply to:
[idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
permalink · <20030222214525.46608.qmail@hyperreal.org>
Jason Vorhees wrote:
quoted 1 line Wouldn't it be easier if there was a messageboard> Wouldn't it be easier if there was a messageboard
If you think the posts are getting moronic now, you should see what happens when any idiot with a web browser can read and post. I was running some general message boards on Hyperreal for a while, and they utterly sucked. For every decent thread, there were fifty off-topic posts from trolls, bigots, spammers, and people who just clearly have not one single clue about what they are talking about. Yes, it would be "easier" but there is a huge price you pay for that convenience: even with user registration, the overall quality and the signal-to-noise ratio go WAY down. Using an old-fashioned mailing list that enforces plain text content raises the bar sufficiently to keep out most, but obviously not all, of the riff-raff. It's a bit like running a telnet-based chat server (these days) rather than full-blown IRC. Mike -- Denver, Colorado, USA http://hyperreal.org/~mike/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-02-22 21:50Neil WalshOn Sat, Feb 22, 2003 at 01:45:25PM -0800, Mike Brown wrote: > Jason Vorhees wrote: > > Wou
From:
Neil Walsh
To:
Date:
Sat, 22 Feb 2003 22:50:20 +0100
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
Reply to:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
permalink · <20030222225020.A20243@prodigy.Redbrick.DCU.IE>
On Sat, Feb 22, 2003 at 01:45:25PM -0800, Mike Brown wrote:
quoted 16 lines Jason Vorhees wrote:> Jason Vorhees wrote: > > Wouldn't it be easier if there was a messageboard > > If you think the posts are getting moronic now, you should see what happens > when any idiot with a web browser can read and post. I was running some > general message boards on Hyperreal for a while, and they utterly sucked. For > every decent thread, there were fifty off-topic posts from trolls, bigots, > spammers, and people who just clearly have not one single clue about what they > are talking about. > > Yes, it would be "easier" but there is a huge price you pay for that > convenience: even with user registration, the overall quality and the > signal-to-noise ratio go WAY down. Using an old-fashioned mailing list that > enforces plain text content raises the bar sufficiently to keep out most, but > obviously not all, of the riff-raff. It's a bit like running a telnet-based > chat server (these days) rather than full-blown IRC.
If you want to see how bad a messageboard can get then look no further than www.watmm.com/forum Neil -- Are we going to the same place If so can I come? --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-02-22 22:23Muffin> If you think the posts are getting moronic now, you should see what happens > when any i
From:
Muffin
To:
IDM
Date:
Sat, 22 Feb 2003 22:23:36 +0000
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
Reply to:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
permalink · <BA7DA8E8.2102F%muffin@signmytits.com>
quoted 13 lines If you think the posts are getting moronic now, you should see what happens> If you think the posts are getting moronic now, you should see what happens > when any idiot with a web browser can read and post. I was running some > general message boards on Hyperreal for a while, and they utterly sucked. For > every decent thread, there were fifty off-topic posts from trolls, bigots, > spammers, and people who just clearly have not one single clue about what they > are talking about. > > Yes, it would be "easier" but there is a huge price you pay for that > convenience: even with user registration, the overall quality and the > signal-to-noise ratio go WAY down. Using an old-fashioned mailing list that > enforces plain text content raises the bar sufficiently to keep out most, but > obviously not all, of the riff-raff. It's a bit like running a telnet-based > chat server (these days) rather than full-blown IRC.
This is why the Warp forum got taken down. Introducing registration to it didn't solve the problems and the comments from posters were becoming offensive to the label staff. Some people just want to take and don't realise what they are doing to other people. This could be perceived as fascism on behalf of the label, or bigotry from the posters. Which is worse. Warp decided they didn't want the people visiting the site to think that their music was associated with a limited, vocal, few on the message list. Rather sad don't you think? ... Have some care and attention. Big up the Ninja crew for keeping their forum going. I know they've had shit directed at their staff before and contemplated > /dev/null for the whole lot. I'm reading this thread alongside reading Cory Doctrow's "down and out in the magic kingdom" [ http://www.craphound.com/down/ ] and can't help wondering how Whuffle would affect this all ... Goes with my idea of a distributed collaborative A&R system to replace record labels too ... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-02-22 23:59The REAL MxyzptlkAt 03:45 PM 2/22/2003, Mike Brown wrote: >Jason Vorhees wrote: > > Wouldn't it be easier i
From:
The REAL Mxyzptlk
To:
Mike Brown , Jason Vorhees
Cc:
Date:
Sat, 22 Feb 2003 17:59:22 -0600
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
Reply to:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
permalink · <5.1.0.14.2.20030222174727.0299aba0@mail.comcast.net>
At 03:45 PM 2/22/2003, Mike Brown wrote:
quoted 10 lines Jason Vorhees wrote:>Jason Vorhees wrote: > > Wouldn't it be easier if there was a messageboard > >If you think the posts are getting moronic now, you should see what happens >when any idiot with a web browser can read and post. I was running some >general message boards on Hyperreal for a while, and they utterly sucked. For >every decent thread, there were fifty off-topic posts from trolls, bigots, >spammers, and people who just clearly have not one single clue about what >they >are talking about.
Additionally, the noise part of "signal to noise" has historically been a part of IDM-l (as much as it is of IDM) for ages. It's like philosophical trends...the pendulum swings this way and that. Sure it can be annoying and insipid. Everybody gets close to and some do unsub. There are moderated lists (Lance's idm-m via yahoogroups is a great alternative) for those who get tired of the noise factor. The grain of salt you take with this list *is* the possible advent of irrelevant ballyhoo. People mark themselves; if anybody gets too noisy, the killfiles go up (I suspect most of us have filters which have for their targets IDM-l posters) and the public censure comes down. The list has a certain charm about it and an atmosphere which, to some extent, lends itself to noise and sarcasm. Not to champion the idiotic, but just to say that an email list without heavy moderation pays a certain price for its "freedom". That's the way it be sometimes. jeff --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-02-23 01:43Jason Vorheesthanx for the comments everyone. i have now seen the light.. i love this community and hav
From:
Jason Vorhees
To:
Date:
Sat, 22 Feb 2003 17:43:13 -0800 (PST)
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION
Reply to:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
permalink · <20030223014313.14201.qmail@web14804.mail.yahoo.com>
thanx for the comments everyone. i have now seen the light.. i love this community and have mad respect for everyone and the history. I guess i just need to learn how to use my e-mail features better, because i just seem to be deleting everything, and by the time i sift through everything, i'm to tired to read the stuff, i'm interested in. on a message board, 50 - 100 posts on a topic would be in one thread that one can choose to view or not to view instead of having 100 e-mails to delete.. i only suggested some type of messageboard because i used to use a few of them everyday, but never found one for all aspects of IDM , the record label boards are awesome too, just doesn't seem to capture all that idm has to offer.... thanx for the replies.. ...:: jason runs to corner to listen to crunch ::... --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more
2003-02-22 19:47seeklektekFrom: "Jason Vorhees" > Greetings! > > Wouldn't it be easier if there was a messageboard t
From:
seeklektek
To:
Date:
Sat, 22 Feb 2003 11:47:57 -0800
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
permalink · <927b01c2daab$4ca834f0$875be40c@obelisk>
From: "Jason Vorhees"
quoted 3 lines Greetings!> Greetings! > > Wouldn't it be easier if there was a messageboard that everyone could read and post at will
instead of filling all of our inbox's with garbage? I know i'm not alone in the fact, that i have to just delete most of mail right off.. Especially with the EGAY spammers.. EGAY? hmmmm.... Anyway, start a newsgroup, if ya feel like it: newsgroups are easier to access and to use than are most message boards. =seek= --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-02-22 20:44cutupsReguarding a message board - i think theres too much history wrapped up in the IDM list to
From:
cutups
To:
Date:
Sat, 22 Feb 2003 15:44:09 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
permalink · <013c01c2dab3$26aa6ea0$b77c97d8@sgi1452>
Reguarding a message board - i think theres too much history wrapped up in the IDM list to scrap it and go to a message board. There are a few related message boards that i read....planet-mu.com mostly. watmm.com occasionally. I've heard the ninjatune board is good. So theres not for a lack of boards. --- WRECKED diy electronics http://rhinoplex.org/wrecked --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-02-22 20:52RichardI for one am not entirely for the idea of message boards. I belong to a couple and visit t
From:
Richard
To:
Date:
Sat, 22 Feb 2003 20:52:14 -0000
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
permalink · <000d01c2dab4$49092620$6dbd8351@com>
I for one am not entirely for the idea of message boards. I belong to a couple and visit them very rarely, so therefore I don't follow them much. I just set my email handler to filter the crap that we get, and would prefer a warning system, or alternatively a specific day for ebay nonsense (99.9% of which I ignore - so why bother?) but I figure that keeping this list going in its current format and finding solutions rather than changing the whole thing. Just my tuppence worth Rich --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-02-22 21:08Greg ClowSome people like mailing lists. That's why we have IDM, IDM-Moderated and countless others
From:
Greg Clow
To:
Date:
Sat, 22 Feb 2003 16:08:43 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
Reply to:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
permalink · <5.1.0.14.0.20030222160318.00a9ae50@mail.velocet.net>
Some people like mailing lists. That's why we have IDM, IDM-Moderated and countless others. Some people like message boards. That's why we have the ones at Planet Mu, Neo Ouija, Warp and countless others. Some people like both, and are free to participate in both types of forums as they see fit. The idea of shutting down one in favour of the other is fucking stupid, especially when the one which is being suggested for shut-down is quite likely the oldest continuously existing online discussion forum for this type of music. If the signal-to-noise ratio on the list isn't working out well for someone, they should either unsubscribe or get some email software with a proper filtering utility and spend 15 minutes learning how to use it. Greg :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Greg Clow ::: greg@stainedproductions.com ::::::::: concert & event promotions ::: http://www.stainedproductions.com :::::: electronic music radio & reviews ::: http://www.feedbackmonitor.com ::: electronic/experimental record label ::: http://www.pieheadrecords.com ::::::::: 158 Close Ave. 2nd Floor ::: Toronto, Ontario M6K 2V5 ::: Canada --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-02-22 21:33Muffin> > Some people like mailing lists. That's why we have IDM, IDM-Moderated and > countless
From:
Muffin
To:
IDM
Date:
Sat, 22 Feb 2003 21:33:55 +0000
Subject:
[idm] Computers as Artists [was Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ]
Reply to:
Re: [idm] IDM LIST SUGGESTION ------ EVERYONE PLEASE READ
permalink · <BA7D9D43.21018%muffin@signmytits.com>
quoted 9 lines Some people like mailing lists. That's why we have IDM, IDM-Moderated and> > Some people like mailing lists. That's why we have IDM, IDM-Moderated and > countless others. > > Some people like message boards. That's why we have the ones at Planet Mu, > Neo Ouija, Warp and countless others. > > Some people like both, and are free to participate in both types of forums > as they see fit.
Spoken like a true Information Designer. The ideal feed would be spread across all three of course, so the archive would also allow people to post to it, and the posts would appears on the mailing list and usenet. Then think how much noise we would have on the list! You'd then have to have your agent filter it all for you and select what it thought was suitable for you. Of course then would you be deciding your tastes or would your agent? What if the agent had first 'learnt' from humans? Greg has touched on the point of human perception here, which we apply to music all the time on this list [I like old Autechre, well I like new Autechre being the most common, and neither having the right answer] [And, here is my tangent, before someone accuses me of IDM list noise ... ] Is this the same argument between computer generative music and human composed music as valid art forms? Because something has not had a human hand directly at play in it does it make it less creative, less intelligent? I suppose this is also the laptop performances thread - "But they just press a button and it does it all for them" vs "They are subtly altering the nuances of what you hear but your individual perception doesn't allow you to take that in and instead you look for some physical sign of that involvement". I'm just kind of rambling, but what are your thoughts on computer generated music [as opposed to music generated by humans controlling computers] I know a few people on this list work with software like Max, and wonder if they perceive creating generative music programs within it as the act of composition, just composition on a more abstracted level than most listeners are used to perceiving? In other news, 26 Mixes for Cash [Aphex Twin] is here, but I'm finding it quite dull. It's also quite beautiful, but I keep on finding myself ignoring it. The Chocolate Coins that warp are doing as Promo Items are quite funny. I'll try and listen to it again. "Sickle Cell Hysteria" on the new Beans album is wicked. on 22/2/03 9:08 pm the person going by the name Greg Clow at greg@stainedproductions.com spake :
quoted 26 lines The idea of shutting down one in favour of the other is fucking stupid,> The idea of shutting down one in favour of the other is fucking stupid, > especially when the one which is being suggested for shut-down is quite > likely the oldest continuously existing online discussion forum for this > type of music. > > If the signal-to-noise ratio on the list isn't working out well for > someone, they should either unsubscribe or get some email software with a > proper filtering utility and spend 15 minutes learning how to use it. > > > Greg > > > > :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Greg Clow ::: greg@stainedproductions.com > ::::::::: concert & event promotions ::: http://www.stainedproductions.com > :::::: electronic music radio & reviews ::: http://www.feedbackmonitor.com > ::: electronic/experimental record label ::: http://www.pieheadrecords.com > ::::::::: 158 Close Ave. 2nd Floor ::: Toronto, Ontario M6K 2V5 ::: Canada > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > >
--------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org