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Re: [idm] IDM concerts - performance vs home listening

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◇ merged from 2 subjects: idm concerts · idm concerts - performance vs home listening
2002-04-19 03:45... hellothisisalex ... [idm] IDM concerts
├─ 2002-04-19 04:04EggyToast Re: [idm] IDM concerts
│ └─ 2002-04-19 04:41Aaron Ximm Re: [idm] IDM concerts
└─ 2002-04-19 08:49j d Re: [idm] IDM concerts - performance vs home listening
2002-04-19 08:54Helix Tradesman Re: [idm] IDM concerts - performance vs home listening
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2002-04-19 03:45... hellothisisalex ...Hello, As a performer this is the kind of question that seems to pop into my own head ever
From:
... hellothisisalex ...
To:
IDM List
Date:
Thu, 18 Apr 2002 23:45:24 -0400
Subject:
[idm] IDM concerts
permalink · <000c01c1e754$a3e138c0$763c6480@trinity.toronto.edu>
Hello, As a performer this is the kind of question that seems to pop into my own head every once and a while--what can I do that is entertaining for myself and the audience but allows me to create and perform electronic music in a live setting? Something that occurred to me recently was how much of this debate over 'live' performance rests on expectations carried over from rock and pop (and hiphop) concerts into electronic shows. It seems that the more successful shows in IDM draw on resources from outside IDM to make their shows engaging. But could it be that there is something about that use of computer that alienates people? A computer is a two way connection between a person and a machine, with both interacting (to some degree) with each other. The computer is designed to demand your attention in a manner so wholly different from that of most other instruments that it almost seems as though the audience is left out of the equation. Perhaps the audience feels that the performer isn't really 'there' as in engaging the audience, etc. So maybe this is a question of presence and absence--how much presence is demanded of the performer? I would say that 99.9% the presence required depends on the setting. Some people don't like to dance and would rather listen. Some performers would rather have people listen than dance. For example: the Autechre show mentioned; Radiohead has been known to ask people to not mosh at shows, etc. There is apparently a two-way communication between the audience and the performer to be maintained, and maybe the problem at a lot of IDM shows is that the audience isn't sure what the performer expects of them, and vice versa. I would say that musicians writing music for listening are asking people to listen, whether they like that or not. The audience doesn't have to comply, but they are being asked. If a performer is engaging the audience in a blatant manner (ala Cex), the audience knows they are being engaged. I don't have any answers to this solution, but I would also say that it can be disheartening for some musicians when the audience doesn't understand the 'unwritten rules' of a performance. All performances have them (picture Cat Power playing to an audience--should the audience listen quietly or jump about madly because they are so driven?) and some performances maybe just need to articulate them better. The first step I think I would take if I was a laptop artist would be to not perform raised up on a stage or in a position to be watched. Beyond that, I have no idea. cheers Mark & Melissa hellothisisalex www.hellothisisalex.com / records.hellothisisalex.com mp3s at www.raw42.com/cgi-bin/featuredartist.pl?artist=213 mark@hellothisisalex --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2002-04-19 04:04EggyToast>Something that occurred to me recently was how much of this debate over >'live' performan
From:
EggyToast
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Date:
Thu, 18 Apr 2002 23:04:53 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM concerts
Reply to:
[idm] IDM concerts
permalink · <5.1.0.14.2.20020418230242.00b47c90@mail.eggytoast.com>
quoted 13 lines Something that occurred to me recently was how much of this debate over>Something that occurred to me recently was how much of this debate over >'live' performance rests on expectations carried over from rock and pop (and >hiphop) concerts into electronic shows. It seems that the more successful >shows in IDM draw on resources from outside IDM to make their shows >engaging. But could it be that there is something about that use of >computer that alienates people? A computer is a two way connection between >a person and a machine, with both interacting (to some degree) with each >other. The computer is designed to demand your attention in a manner so >wholly different from that of most other instruments that it almost seems as >though the audience is left out of the equation. Perhaps the audience feels >that the performer isn't really 'there' as in engaging the audience, etc. >So maybe this is a question of presence and absence--how much presence is >demanded of the performer?
In "normal" rock concerts, the guy who plays with the sequencers and the crazy sound thingies is usually in the back, and off to the side. There's usually a guitarist or someone who can run around on stage and look like they're doing something interesting. Therefore, you should get a cheesy guitarist. Or, even better -- just set up your stuff to play, and make a cardboard guitar, and run around with a sweatband on your head. derek ------- eggytoast.com ------- with lather thingy --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2002-04-19 04:41Aaron Ximm> Therefore, you should get a cheesy guitarist. > > Or, even better -- just set up your st
From:
Aaron Ximm
To:
EggyToast
Cc:
Date:
Thu, 18 Apr 2002 21:41:06 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM concerts
Reply to:
Re: [idm] IDM concerts
permalink · <Pine.SOL.4.42.0204182139190.9274-100000@well.com>
quoted 4 lines Therefore, you should get a cheesy guitarist.> Therefore, you should get a cheesy guitarist. > > Or, even better -- just set up your stuff to play, and make a cardboard > guitar, and run around with a sweatband on your head.
At one point I thought about getting together a full (rock) band, but minus drum sticks, guitar strings, bass strings, and mic (though with stand to swing). We'd start a tape of loud pink/white noise, go through the motions of playing an entire set (encore and banter included) silently, then turn off the white noise. I was hoping to tour. best aaron ghede@well.com http://www.quietamerican.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2002-04-19 08:49j dnot exactly IDM - but close enough: the prodigy have got it right if yer gonna play music
From:
j d
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Date:
Fri, 19 Apr 2002 01:49:08 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM concerts - performance vs home listening
Reply to:
[idm] IDM concerts
permalink · <20020419084908.63679.qmail@web9705.mail.yahoo.com>
not exactly IDM - but close enough: the prodigy have got it right if yer gonna play music that makes you want to dance (I "DANCE" M) then they have the right formula if you make chin-scratching music ("INTELLIGENT" DM )(sic) then the stage presence isnt really required so much a la autechre live shows. for this reason i find IDM pretty fucking boring live, and prefer to listen to it at home. if im in a club, i like to have a few beers and jump about. that might not be the general list consensus - but i think most people feel the same. --- "... hellothisisalex ..." <mark@hellothisisalex.com> wrote:
quoted 89 lines Hello,> Hello, > > As a performer this is the kind of question that > seems to pop into my own > head every once and a while--what can I do that is > entertaining for myself > and the audience but allows me to create and perform > electronic music in a > live setting? > > Something that occurred to me recently was how much > of this debate over > 'live' performance rests on expectations carried > over from rock and pop (and > hiphop) concerts into electronic shows. It seems > that the more successful > shows in IDM draw on resources from outside IDM to > make their shows > engaging. But could it be that there is something > about that use of > computer that alienates people? A computer is a two > way connection between > a person and a machine, with both interacting (to > some degree) with each > other. The computer is designed to demand your > attention in a manner so > wholly different from that of most other instruments > that it almost seems as > though the audience is left out of the equation. > Perhaps the audience feels > that the performer isn't really 'there' as in > engaging the audience, etc. > So maybe this is a question of presence and > absence--how much presence is > demanded of the performer? > > I would say that 99.9% the presence required depends > on the setting. Some > people don't like to dance and would rather listen. > Some performers would > rather have people listen than dance. For example: > the Autechre show > mentioned; Radiohead has been known to ask people to > not mosh at shows, etc. > There is apparently a two-way communication between > the audience and the > performer to be maintained, and maybe the problem at > a lot of IDM shows is > that the audience isn't sure what the performer > expects of them, and vice > versa. I would say that musicians writing music for > listening are asking > people to listen, whether they like that or not. > The audience doesn't have > to comply, but they are being asked. If a performer > is engaging the > audience in a blatant manner (ala Cex), the audience > knows they are being > engaged. > > I don't have any answers to this solution, but I > would also say that it can > be disheartening for some musicians when the > audience doesn't understand the > 'unwritten rules' of a performance. All > performances have them (picture Cat > Power playing to an audience--should the audience > listen quietly or jump > about madly because they are so driven?) and some > performances maybe just > need to articulate them better. The first step I > think I would take if I > was a laptop artist would be to not perform raised > up on a stage or in a > position to be watched. Beyond that, I have no > idea. > > cheers > Mark & Melissa > hellothisisalex > www.hellothisisalex.com / > records.hellothisisalex.com > mp3s at > www.raw42.com/cgi-bin/featuredartist.pl?artist=213 > mark@hellothisisalex > > > >
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2002-04-19 08:54Helix Tradesman> >the prodigy have got it right > >if yer gonna play music that makes you want to dance >
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Helix Tradesman
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Date:
Fri, 19 Apr 2002 08:54:11 +0000
Subject:
Re: [idm] IDM concerts - performance vs home listening
permalink · <F761YsmSY4ldo1afd1C000170d7@hotmail.com>
quoted 6 lines the prodigy have got it right> >the prodigy have got it right > >if yer gonna play music that makes you want to dance >(I "DANCE" M) then they have the right formula >
I think we all know the answer then. At 50% of your group (if it's just you performing, I'm afraid it will have to be you) must be dancers. In some cases it would be nice if the sole qualification for them to be in the group is their dancing skill too. :) _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org