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Re: [idm] why the list is going south fast

5 messages · 3 participants · spans 1 day · search this subject
2000-06-16 08:10John Re: [idm] why the list is going south fast
2000-06-16 18:23William Samuels Re: [idm] why the list is going south fast
└─ 2000-06-16 22:05John Re: [idm] why the list is going south fast
2000-06-16 22:51William Samuels Re: [idm] why the list is going south fast
2000-06-17 03:15Gonzi 'Fresh' Merchan Re: [idm] why the list is going south fast
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2000-06-16 08:10JohnGonzi, >William, saying that a piece of music is garbage is exactly AGAINST >everything th
From:
John
To:
Date:
Fri, 16 Jun 2000 18:10:50 +1000
Subject:
Re: [idm] why the list is going south fast
permalink · <4.3.1.0.20000616175659.00aae210@pop3.zipworld.com.au>
Gonzi,
quoted 9 lines William, saying that a piece of music is garbage is exactly AGAINST>William, saying that a piece of music is garbage is exactly AGAINST >everything the list is about. IDM used to be about a sense of community and >shared interest. The increasing lack of thought put behind some the opinions >I see here serves only to alienate people and discourage them from exposing >themselves and releasing something in the first place. If the list comes to >that then what's the point of continuing with it at all? The current state >of the list and the decreasing number of contributing artists and label >representative to it is no coincidence. Whether or not Phoenecia cares (and >I'm sure they probably don't), you should care. This is our list, damn you.
Actually when the list first started there wasn't much in the way of established or otherwise artists on it back then, except for Greg Eden jagging a job with Warp because of his enthusiasm for the music and his Warp discography. So the question I put to you is decreasing from what? When was the peak of artist involvement with this list.. the Ae spat or the RDJ tiff? Having said that I don't disagree with fostering a better community attitude but it ain't going to be done through this list or any other list or the internet for that matter because people can be hostile towards each other without fear of too much in the way of repercussions. Cheers, John Aural Industries Pty Ltd http://www.aural-industries.com.au John Aural Industries Pty Ltd http://www.aural-industries.com.au --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-16 18:23William Samuels--- John <turbo@zip.com.au> wrote: > Gonzi, > > >William, saying that a piece of music is
From:
William Samuels
To:
John ,
Date:
Fri, 16 Jun 2000 11:23:51 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
Re: [idm] why the list is going south fast
permalink · <20000616182351.7058.qmail@web2104.mail.yahoo.com>
--- John <turbo@zip.com.au> wrote:
quoted 7 lines Gonzi,> Gonzi, > > >William, saying that a piece of music is garbage is > exactly AGAINST > >everything the list is about. IDM used to be about > a sense of community and > >shared interest.
I don't know if this is worth clarifying, I didn't refer to anything as garbage. I did defend someone's right to say if they think it's garbage to say it and be honest about it. With regards to comment "saying that a piece of music is garbage is exactly AGAINST everything the list is about". I have always intrepretted this list as a forum to discuss music. I think "honesty" is an essential part of that discussion. Perhaps you feel that negative comments should be watered down or surpressed, I disagree. I would rather see two sides to the story. I would like to hear why someone likes it and why someone else doesn't. I am also of the belief that people can think for themselves and distinguish what they want to take out of the discussion.
quoted 1 line The increasing lack of thought put behind some the> The increasing lack of thought put behind some the
opinions
quoted 4 lines I see here serves only to alienate people and> >I see here serves only to alienate people and > discourage them from exposing > >themselves and releasing something in the first > place.
I don't think it alienates anyone. Everyone should be able to distinguish that a post is only one person's opinion. With regards to discouraging an artist from releasing something, that's pretty funny. I wouldn't think that any artist would expect EVERYONE to love them. Some will like it and some won't, why worry about it? Go with your passion!
quoted 2 lines the list comes to that then what's the point of>> the list comes to that then what's the point of >> continuing with it at all?
So unless you only say positive things about everything, the list isn't worth doing? Ok all you opinionated people, time to take your prozac, E, or thorazine so we can keep things chipper and sunshiney all of the time. Maybe a nice Haiku or poem might be special.
quoted 3 lines The current state of the list and the decreasing> >The current state of the list and the decreasing > >number of contributing artists and label > >representative to it is no coincidence.
So why is that? Because people are honest? Most of the people I know that have unsubscribed (and of course I am speaking of fans, not artists) have done so because there are TOO many posts with not enough substance to it. It seems harder to find those "pearls of wisdom" in a lot of post these days.
quoted 3 lines Whether or not Phoenecia cares (and I'm sure they> >Whether or not Phoenecia cares (and I'm sure they > >probably don't), you should care. This is our list, > >damn you.
Take some time to read past posts, I have NEVER said one BAD thing about Phoenecia/Schematic EVER on this list. I dare you to try and fine some. Stop popping pills and learn to keep things straight.
quoted 8 lines Actually when the list first started there wasn't> Actually when the list first started there wasn't > much in the way of > established or otherwise artists on it back then, > except for Greg Eden > jagging a job with Warp because of his enthusiasm > for the music and his > Warp discography. So the question I put to you is > decreasing from what?
Quantity of emails & quantity of substance is might bet. I know SO MANY people that feel like the list just wasn't worth it anymore for them. And they still love the music! And I must say another possible reason, is that they have already learned enough about some artists that have dominate the attention of the list. I took a break for a while myself (years back), because I already knew everything I wanted to know about Squarepusher, Autechre, and RDJ. Everyday they were discussed, nothing new really added, and it got boring. I'm glad to see these days that people are adding input from all over from noise to minimalism, etc. I think the list improves when people bring in discussion about other electronic music that might not be strictly defined as IDM.
quoted 11 lines When was the peak of artist involvement with this> When was the peak of artist involvement with this > list.. the Ae spat or the RDJ tiff? > > Having said that I don't disagree with fostering a > better community > attitude but it ain't going to be done through this > list or any other list > or the internet for that matter because people can > be hostile towards each > other without fear of too much in the way of > repercussions.
__________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-16 22:05JohnWilliam Samuels wrote: I don't know if you did it deliberately or by accident, but since y
From:
John
To:
William Samuels ,
Date:
Sat, 17 Jun 2000 08:05:01 +1000
Subject:
Re: [idm] why the list is going south fast
Reply to:
Re: [idm] why the list is going south fast
permalink · <4.3.1.0.20000617075830.00aa9660@pop3.zipworld.com.au>
William Samuels wrote: I don't know if you did it deliberately or by accident, but since you didn't add Gonzi to your reply field anything above your "Stop popping pills and learn to keep things straight." line is from Gonzi's original message and your reply to that... I never wrote a word of it. Can you please practice what your preach and stop popping pills so you can assign what is said on list to the right person. I for one agree with you sentiment that a person has the right to speak there mind. Doesn't mean I don't think there is too much negativity on the list though. Cheers, John
quoted 124 lines --- John <turbo@zip.com.au> wrote:>--- John <turbo@zip.com.au> wrote: > > Gonzi, > > > > >William, saying that a piece of music is garbage is > > exactly AGAINST > > >everything the list is about. IDM used to be about > > a sense of community and > > >shared interest. > >I don't know if this is worth clarifying, I didn't >refer to anything as garbage. I did defend someone's >right to say if they think it's garbage to say it and >be honest about it. > >With regards to comment "saying that a piece of music >is garbage is exactly AGAINST everything the list is >about". >I have always intrepretted this list as a forum to >discuss music. I think "honesty" is an essential part >of that discussion. Perhaps you feel that negative >comments should be watered down or surpressed, I >disagree. I would rather see two sides to the story. >I would like to hear why someone likes it and why >someone else doesn't. > >I am also of the belief that people can think for >themselves and distinguish what they want to take out >of the discussion. > > > The increasing lack of thought put behind some the >opinions > > >I see here serves only to alienate people and > > discourage them from exposing > > >themselves and releasing something in the first > > place. > >I don't think it alienates anyone. Everyone should be >able to distinguish that a post is only one person's >opinion. > >With regards to discouraging an artist from releasing >something, that's pretty funny. I wouldn't think that >any artist would expect EVERYONE to love them. Some >will like it and some won't, why worry about it? Go >with your passion! > > >> the list comes to that then what's the point of > >> continuing with it at all? > >So unless you only say positive things about >everything, the list isn't worth doing? Ok all you >opinionated people, time to take your prozac, E, or >thorazine so we can keep things chipper and sunshiney >all of the time. Maybe a nice Haiku or poem might be >special. > > > >The current state of the list and the decreasing > > >number of contributing artists and label > > >representative to it is no coincidence. > >So why is that? Because people are honest? Most of >the people I know that have unsubscribed (and of >course I am speaking of fans, not artists) have done >so because there are TOO many posts with not enough >substance to it. It seems harder to find those >"pearls of wisdom" in a lot of post these days. > > > >Whether or not Phoenecia cares (and I'm sure they > > >probably don't), you should care. This is our list, > > >damn you. > >Take some time to read past posts, I have NEVER said >one BAD thing about Phoenecia/Schematic EVER on this >list. I dare you to try and fine some. > >Stop popping pills and learn to keep things straight. > > > Actually when the list first started there wasn't > > much in the way of > > established or otherwise artists on it back then, > > except for Greg Eden > > jagging a job with Warp because of his enthusiasm > > for the music and his > > Warp discography. So the question I put to you is > > decreasing from what? > >Quantity of emails & quantity of substance is might >bet. I know SO MANY people that feel like the list >just wasn't worth it anymore for them. And they still >love the music! > >And I must say another possible reason, is that they >have already learned enough about some artists that >have dominate the attention of the list. I took a >break for a while myself (years back), because I >already knew everything I wanted to know about >Squarepusher, Autechre, and RDJ. Everyday they were >discussed, nothing new really added, and it got >boring. > >I'm glad to see these days that people are adding >input from all over from noise to minimalism, etc. I >think the list improves when people bring in >discussion about other electronic music that might not >be strictly defined as IDM. > > > When was the peak of artist involvement with this > > list.. the Ae spat or the RDJ tiff? > > > > Having said that I don't disagree with fostering a > > better community > > attitude but it ain't going to be done through this > > list or any other list > > or the internet for that matter because people can > > be hostile towards each > > other without fear of too much in the way of > > repercussions. > > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Send instant messages with Yahoo! Messenger. >http://im.yahoo.com/
John Aural Industries Pty Ltd http://www.aural-industries.com.au --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-16 22:51William Samuels--- John <turbo@zip.com.au> wrote: > > I don't know if you did it deliberately or by > acc
From:
William Samuels
To:
John ,
Date:
Fri, 16 Jun 2000 15:51:10 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
Re: [idm] why the list is going south fast
permalink · <20000616225110.1345.qmail@web2105.mail.yahoo.com>
--- John <turbo@zip.com.au> wrote:
quoted 6 lines I don't know if you did it deliberately or by> > I don't know if you did it deliberately or by > accident, but since you > didn't add Gonzi to your reply field anything above > your "Stop popping > pills and learn to keep things straight."
Hi John, it was directed to Gonzi, but I couldn't find his email address. I responded from your response and you didn't it didn't include his address. I thought it looked clear that it was a direct response to Gonzi. Just not clear since his email wasn't added.
quoted 3 lines from Gonzi's original> from Gonzi's original > message and your reply to that... I never wrote a > word of it.
I know
quoted 3 lines Can you please practice what your preach and stop> Can you please practice what your preach and stop > popping pills so you can assign what is said on > list to the right person.
The pill popper reference wasn't towards you John :)
quoted 1 line I for one agree with your sentiment that a person> I for one agree with your sentiment that a person
has
quoted 1 line the right to speak there mind.> the right to speak there mind.
Right on!
quoted 2 lines Doesn't mean I don't think there is too much> Doesn't mean I don't think there is too much > negativity on the list though.
Your right, but I think it goes in cycles. Cheers __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-17 03:15Gonzi 'Fresh' Merchan> >Whether or not Phoenecia cares (and I'm sure they > >probably don't), you should care.
From:
Gonzi 'Fresh' Merchan
To:
William Samuels
Cc:
Date:
Fri, 16 Jun 2000 20:15:13 -0700
Subject:
Re: [idm] why the list is going south fast
permalink · <003a01bfd80a$4089aba0$10c40018@flrtn1.occa.home.com>
quoted 3 lines Whether or not Phoenecia cares (and I'm sure they> >Whether or not Phoenecia cares (and I'm sure they > >probably don't), you should care. This is our list, > >damn you.
quoted 3 lines Take some time to read past posts, I have NEVER said>Take some time to read past posts, I have NEVER said >one BAD thing about Phoenecia/Schematic EVER on this >list. I dare you to try and fine some.
quoted 1 line Stop popping pills and learn to keep things straight.>Stop popping pills and learn to keep things straight.
It's has never been the criticism I object to, it's the spirit of it. I was never trying to accuse you of not liking Schematic who as we all know, enjoy a large and healthy following here in God's Country (aka Orange County). Also let this be said now: I will never stop popping pills for you or anybody!@!@!@ godbless, Gnz. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org