IDM Mailing Archive

quoted 4 lines is all about. But if you would normally go out and buy a Squarepusher

> is all about. But if you would normally go out and buy a Squarepusher > album > and instead just download the whole thing for free, does Squarepusher > get anything for it? No.

i tend to think the opposite way, that Napster (and mp3s in general - this is an old debate) introduce people to music they would not otherwise have heard, and thus can only be beneficial to the music industry. most people, at least the ones on this list, would probably agree that mp3 quality is only so good - so if i hear in an mp3 i really like i delete it and go look for the CD (okay, maybe not in that order). unless it's something like the _one_ song that i like by some band whose music i don't respect enough to ever buy their CD (ie. dave matthews "crush"). in which case dave matthews and crew can go fuck themselves. sorry to decrease the S/N. nub --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

On Tue, 7 Mar 2000, Nub wrote:

quoted 10 lines But if you would normally go out and buy a Squarepusher album

> > But if you would normally go out and buy a Squarepusher album > > and instead just download the whole thing for free, does Squarepusher > > get anything for it? No. > > i tend to think the opposite way, that Napster (and mp3s in general - this > is an old debate) introduce people to music they would not otherwise have > heard, and thus can only be beneficial to the music industry. most people, > at least the ones on this list, would probably agree that mp3 quality is > only so good - so if i hear in an mp3 i really like i delete it and go > look for the CD

I used to agree with this stance wholeheartedly. And yes, I think that most people on this list (myself included) would do the same thing. I don't consider MP3s to be a good replacement for "the real thing", and unless a release is otherwise unavailable (i.e. out of print), I'll go out and buy the CD/record if I like an MP3. However - the more I've talked to "normal" people about this issue (i.e. people who aren't on this list and who don't have the same sort of obsession about music as most of us do), the more I've come to discover that a large majority of the people using Napster and other methods of MP3 trading or collection DO consider MP3s to be an adequate substitute to "real" music formats. Why do you think college campuses are starting to shut down the Napster ports on their firewalls? Because college students are downloading entire albums by artists like Smashing Pumpkins, Oasis, Korn or whoever at an astounding rate. Please note that I'm trying to not make a judgement call either way on this issue. I'm simply making the point that despite the prevailing attitude on this list that MP3s are good only for (A) giving a taste of an artist's music before buying the album; or (B) giving people access to out of print & otherwise unavailable material, MP3s have become accepted in the "real world" as a viable music medium. And as such, there *is* a threat to the sales of CDs. Mostly on the major label level, of course, but I'm sure there are a lot of IDM fans out there who aren't nearly as "ethical" as most of us. Greg -- Greg Clow - greg@stainedproductions.com - greg@feedbackmonitor.com concert & event promotions - http://www.stainedproductions.com electronic music radio/reviews/interviews - http://www.feedbackmonitor.com 158 Close Ave. 2nd Floor - Toronto, Ontario M6K 2V5 - Canada --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

At 10:24 AM 3/7/00 -0700, Nub wrote:

quoted 3 lines i tend to think the opposite way, that Napster (and mp3s in general - this

>i tend to think the opposite way, that Napster (and mp3s in general - this >is an old debate) introduce people to music they would not otherwise have >heard, and thus can only be beneficial to the music industry.

The way that Napster works makes me pretty skeptical of this idea. You log on to a server (or don't, most of the time), and type in the name of whatever band/track you're looking for. People know exactly what they're looking for when they use Napster. I doubt that people "discover" any new bands. That's why the blurb on the Napster web page to the effect of "Are you an undiscovered band? Share your mp3s with the world!" is so comical. If no one's ever heard of you, then no one will search for you, and the odds are slim that they will gamble and download your mp3 if they browse someone else's collection. Come on. People log on to napster, type "GIVE ME METALLECA MP3S" into the search window, and try to leech down albums. I'm not saying this to argue about the badness of mp3s; people will trade tapes or cd-rs or whatever new format comes along, anyway. Besides, who ever finds anything with napster? i've ripped off a few artists, but by and large, I never find anything I search for. It's disheartening to search for someone fairly well-known and popular like Thomas Brinkmann, and turn up 0 results out of terabytes of mp3s. Bah. If someone wrote a version of napster called Pr0nster, for searching and sharing porn, they would become extremely rich overnight. ---- THEY'RE REVERTING TO THEIR DOLPHIN SHAPE! THE CONTAINMENT FIELD FAILS jeff@spof.net http://bling.spof.net/ Jeff Pitrman --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

Napster is the enemy of what mp3s should be about. mp3s are about exposing new music, it is unfortunate that the vast majority of mp3 kids out there are whoring music, any music, every music .. as long as its free. i find that irc/ftp/hotline are much more effective at the promotion of the artist. talk encourages one to explore new levels of music. i, as a result of being on irc, have evolved from the shameful period of commericial electronic (chem bros/new prodigy/fat boy slim) into my new found home with downtempo/jazz .. had it not been for a circle of individuals who shared the goal to promote artists that were deserving of selling a few hundred cds or even a few cds, i would have never found the ecstacy that is coldcut; the creativity that is kid koala; the madness that is squarepusher; or the sublime that is the herbaliser... mp3s have the ability to promote music or to destroy music .. certain circles of mp3 kids have found themselves purchasing albums they enjoy .. sharing the wealth and encouraging others to do so as well .. while others have chosen to whore music .. trade .. listen .. burn .. collect dust .. there is no controlling what people do with mp3s .. there is only controlling who gets mp3s, from both a legal and a moral aspect ... morally - give mp3s to kids who are interested in exploring .. who will buy albums they dig and ignore albums they dont legally - if too many whores rip off artists .. mp3s are gonna get nicked quick .. granted theyre still going to find their way around, more and more narcs will be out there making friends with traders .. do the right thing. -game.set.match -jason --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

quoted 12 lines However - the more I've talked to "normal" people about this issue (i.e.

>However - the more I've talked to "normal" people about this issue (i.e. >people who aren't on this list and who don't have the same sort of >obsession about music as most of us do), the more I've come to discover >that a large majority of the people using Napster and other methods of MP3 >trading or collection DO consider MP3s to be an adequate substitute to >"real" music formats. > >Why do you think college campuses are starting to shut down the Napster >ports on their firewalls? Because college students are downloading entire >albums by artists like Smashing Pumpkins, Oasis, Korn or whoever at an >astounding rate. >

Actually, it's funny you should mention it. In my residence hall Napster use is running rampant, but the director of the residence halls' only concern was that it was taking up bandwidth, not that it was stealing, they didn't even touch that issue, kinda funny. I know of one guy at my school who is buying a something like 20 gig HD just for downloaded music. Sure people aren't doing it on a widespread level, but only time will tell when the technology will be available to everyone to upload their whole CD collection on and download someone else's whole CD collection. We all know how fast technology travels, our first modem just a couple years ago was just a 2400 bps, know what I mean? Ok, if it's for a preview of the artist then that's fine, music stores do that as well. but where do you draw the line? It appeared to me that many songs were fine quality, and many you didn't need the album cover or notes for. I think those who would really go out and buy the music are the minority on Napster. I can see though that it is more of a personal, individual issue, and I see now that there is more behind it. I'm sure most of these people on the list wouldn't dis the artist by enjoying the music w/ out paying. Anyway, thanks for the feedback and you made me think about it more and such. Dev ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org