IDM Mailing Archive

Humanerr0r@aol.com wrote....

quoted 9 lines maybe we might be able to prove ourselves slightly more civilized than

>> >maybe we might be able to prove ourselves slightly more civilized than >all >> >those crusty punks. > >> Pour the tea vicar and pass me the radio times..... >> (How do you do a yawning smiley ?) Erm..... (:O > >It's my ambition in life to hang around outside Mcdonalds every day, drink >cheap cider till I go blind and change my clothes every 4 years too.

That's not what I meant you dumb AOLer ! I'm not even a punk - I just want to continue liking IDM and not feel I have to be civilised as well. (What a burden). Punk may be dead in the states, you caught on over 20 years late anyway. There is a scene here in the UK, it's quite small and it the music gets called Hardcore (nothing to do with techno etc btw). There are still old punks as well, it's fair to say that scene is dead really - no new records coming out it's very retro. A lot of the people who were attracted to the acid house scene and became artists in techno & IDM were punks before all that, so you might want to think about what punk is as you most likely have less idea than some punks do of IDM ! -- Mark S-D <msd@marksd.demon.co.uk> (not a punk, but some friends are)

quoted 8 lines A lot of the people

>> A lot of the people >> who were attracted to the acid house scene and became artists in techno >> & IDM were punks before all that > >Who, Boy George? > >I'd say that notion is a load of crap, I can't think of any techno musician >who was a punk (or at least was brave enough to say so)

Orbital. (cue mindless "Orbital are not real techno" blather) Alex Patterson was a roadie for Killing Joke, but he probably doesn't count either, right? Moby obviously doesn't count, especially since he was in Flipper briefly. "Both [Marshall] Jefferson's enthusiasm for Black Sabbath and [Larry] Heard's idolisation of progressive rock drummer [Neil] Peart [of Rush] were bemusing at the time. According to stereotypical divisions of taste by skin colour and culture, black musicians were supposed to be listening to soul." - David Toop, Ocean of Sound C. -- C.Hilker (cspot@hyperreal.com) "He was mesmerized by the light-pictures, and the music sent him right into dreamland"

In message <970415163329_151923511@emout03.mail.aol.com>, Humanerr0r@aol.com writes

quoted 1 line AOL is an international service, I live in Manchester.

>AOL is an international service, I live in Manchester.

Can I just say, "you traitor" please? No? ok..... For chrissake i can't believe the gall of a service provider that doesn't even think about opening up a sub-division called Europe On-Line, let alone England-on-line....I honestly don't know how anyone in britain can live with signing up to a service called *America*-On- Line....<shakes head in disbelief> -- Ben Coffer Hybrid Productions http://www.hybridgame.demon.co.uk/

quoted 5 lines I'm not saying I know it all about punk, but I got the general idea that punk

>I'm not saying I know it all about punk, but I got the general idea that punk >was really born in the states, through groups like New York Dolls and obscure >garage bands etc etc. > >BUT let's not go into that any further PLEASE

This is frustrating but I'll respect your request...

quoted 6 lines There is a scene here in the UK, it's quite small and

>> There is a scene here in the UK, it's quite small and >> it the music gets called Hardcore (nothing to do with techno etc btw). > >Yeah but this is just a bunch of students who think they're 'hardcore' but >don't have any idea, it's nothing to do with music, all a load of shit if you >ask me.

There is a relatively big 'hardcore' scene on the go at the moment which is a very political and lifestyle dependent movement. It is very easy to dismiss such, as it is easy to generalise about many groups of people. My opinion on the above differs to your own (bands like 'Los Crudos', 'Drop Dead', and pretty much anything on the Flat Earth record label are personally of great interest) but difference is what makes the world turn round.

quoted 8 lines Guitar (or acoustic, rock, whatever) music can be beautiful and affecting,

>Guitar (or acoustic, rock, whatever) music can be beautiful and affecting, >but how many musicians are emerging now with any real talent? It seems that >anyone who can coax 500 decibels of feedback from their P.A, or whose >wah-pedal movements flurry into a blur, is seen as a guitar hero, where the >truth is that a monkey could make that kind of sound, it requires no skill. > We have moronic John-Squire-A-Likes (who was crap) and cliche-diseased >Hendrix-oids. Guitars have gone NOWHERE for the past 15 years, this is why >no-one can be arsed with them any more.

The above may be an attempt to goad but I will rise to it by disagreeing again. It can be a lot of effort to take an interest in music. I enjoy a lot of differing music (which makes me neither big nor clever) and what I appreciate most is when I hear beauty and originality. It's always largely a personal thing but - guitar bands or guitar music pushing the envelope currently:- Blonde Redhead, Polvo, Don Caballero, anything by or including Jim O'Rourke (brise glace, Gastr del sol, Rien by Faust, Muller O'Rourke, etc...), Idaho, Tortoise, Labradford, Main, ... and there are tons more. One persons nirvana is anothers hell.

quoted 11 lines A lot of the people

>> A lot of the people >> who were attracted to the acid house scene and became artists in techno >> & IDM were punks before all that > >Who, Boy George? > >I'd say that notion is a load of crap, I can't think of any techno musician >who was a punk (or at least was brave enough to say so), the older generation >were generally into industrial electronic music and jazz/funk (check May >Atkins Mills), and the newer generation grew up on electro and hip hop >(Global Communication, LFO, me)

There were/are probably a lot more than you can imagine. I've read numerous interviews with artists who name punk stuff, or things like Black Sabbath, as old faves but *not* as influences on their music. Maybe the attitude exigent in these movements is a fun - but undesirable - element in someones musical make-up.. ..or whatever..

quoted 6 lines To me, although techno is supposed to have a 'punk' ethic (i.e use what you

>To me, although techno is supposed to have a 'punk' ethic (i.e use what you >can, music from bedrooms) I don't see much of a connection. Punk wasn't >about making something new, or even about making music, it was about making a >social stance, about decibel levels, about social aggressiveness and >destruction - it seems to be the opposite to what the techno musicians are >about.

When I make electronic music I hope I do so by putting something of myself into a track - making it impicitly different to something by someone else. When I play guitar in a separate project I hope I do the same - but I also get to leap up and down, happily, like a madman and mess with peoples eardrums. It floats my boat so what the heck. Does it make me a Punk though? Hmmm... I don't often agree with things that I am told are good for me by people who are economically motivated, but a Punk.. ..maybe! (strange thought - I must go and get some piercings and a mohican immediately...).

quoted 2 lines so you might want to think about what

>> so you might want to think about what >> punk is as you most likely have less idea than some punks do of IDM !

My points above are not that "you are wrong and I am right" just that your opinion doesn't represent that of myself, and you posted them in a public forum of which I am part so - solidarite brother, we are all different ;) Rubyjune