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[idm] OT: Vice City OST.

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◇ merged from 2 subjects: future of idm · ot: vice city ost.
2002-10-30 19:36Re: [idm] Future of IDM
├─ 2002-10-30 19:59EggyToast Re: [idm] Future of IDM
│ ├─ 2002-10-30 19:34atomly Re: [idm] Future of IDM
│ │ └─ 2002-10-30 20:52EggyToast Re: [idm] Future of IDM
│ └─ 2002-10-31 01:21Gaylord M. Focker Re: [idm] Future of IDM
│ ├─ 2002-10-31 01:31Thomas Millar [idm] OT: Vice City OST.
│ └─ 2002-10-31 11:42J.P.L'asthme Fawn Re: [idm] Future of IDM
├─ 2002-10-30 20:54Nuutti-Iivari Meriläinen Re: [idm] Future of IDM
└─ 2002-10-30 20:58J.P.L'asthme Fawn Re: [idm] Future of IDM
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2002-10-30 19:36CAPOIIEE@aol.comIn a message dated 10/30/02 9:49:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, jwhite@ShoppersDrugMart.CA w
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Re: [idm] Future of IDM
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In a message dated 10/30/02 9:49:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, jwhite@ShoppersDrugMart.CA writes:
quoted 3 lines Hello. I was just wondering where everyone sees IDM going in the near> Hello. I was just wondering where everyone sees IDM going in the near > future? I mean sound/genre - anything really. Just interested in hearing > some opinions.
to hell in a handbasket? its becoming "genre" music now, like "industrial," "drum n bass," "house," "punk" etc.. producers start wondering if their tracks are "idm" enough. it used to be that idm was wierd experimental music that no one could categorize, it will be a genre with its own rules and subculture. kids in highschool will walk around with moptops and laptops wearing schematic t-shirts.. soon there will be a band that will have vocals and make it mainstreamish, and everyone on this list will be very upset. 15 year old kids will start joining the list and ask who aphex twin is. the 'post-warp' era is coming if not already here.. you wait and see
2002-10-30 19:59EggyToast>In a message dated 10/30/02 9:49:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, >jwhite@ShoppersDrugMart.CA
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EggyToast
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Wed, 30 Oct 2002 14:59:56 -0500
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Re: [idm] Future of IDM
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Re: [idm] Future of IDM
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quoted 12 lines In a message dated 10/30/02 9:49:51 AM Eastern Standard Time,>In a message dated 10/30/02 9:49:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, >jwhite@ShoppersDrugMart.CA writes: > > >> Hello. I was just wondering where everyone sees IDM going in the near >> future? I mean sound/genre - anything really. Just interested in hearing >> some opinions. > >to hell in a handbasket? > >its becoming "genre" music now, like "industrial," "drum n bass," "house," >"punk" etc..
See, now despite what I said in my past post, this is what I'm not sure about. Perhaps the moniker "IDM" will stick around, and the different parts of it that DO fit into genres well (such as, say, the "post-hop" stuff) will splinter off into its own genre, leaving the "weird" stuff under the "IDM" name? It's happened before. IDM used to be the name for quiet, glitchy music, but now that's called "microsound." So now the microsound stuff has its own name, whereas the stuff that's outside of it is still referred to as "IDM." "Techno" used to be the catch-all phrase for anything electronic, sometimes with or without vocals, and some people still use it as such, but it generally has a very well-defined genre that it fits now. Is that bad? Well, not really -- it helps people know what to expect that are looking for that, but also helps people avoid it if they want. I love me some good IDM, but I would probably never buy a record that was called (at least, by someone on this list) "techno." Either it's too broad or it means detroit-style acidy techno. It really wouldn't surprise me if some of the more "out there" idm-genres split off and become their own "genre." I mean, the hyper-noisy stuff like Venetian Snares is ages away from the melodic Marumari stuff, and depending on what artists do and call themselves, *something* is going to split them off. The term "idm" has for many people lost any actual meaning, as much of the stuff called "idm" hasn't been even remotely dance music since, what, '97? :D It really wouldn't surprise me if stuff called "idm" stuck around for years or decades, always on the edge of electronic music, before the "genre monkeys" you speak of get ahold of it. Some of the artists will happily accept a genre label that's more specific, as they probably care more about making good music than necessarily sounding "new." Plaid would be a good example, as their releases are ultimately rather similar and if a genre came about that they fit into, you could probably lump all of their releases (including black dog stuff, probably) into it. Some artists will end up continually making new stuff, refusing to be easily classified (such as Autechre) and I think those are the groups that will continually be called just plain-jane IDM. Despite how unplain it is. derek -- eggytoast.com -------------- you'll shoot your eye out --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2002-10-30 19:34atomly[EggyToast <eggy@eggytoast.com>] > It's happened before. IDM used to be the name for quiet
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atomly
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Wed, 30 Oct 2002 13:34:54 -0600
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Re: [idm] Future of IDM
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[EggyToast <eggy@eggytoast.com>]
quoted 4 lines It's happened before. IDM used to be the name for quiet, glitchy> It's happened before. IDM used to be the name for quiet, glitchy > music, but now that's called "microsound." So now the microsound > stuff has its own name, whereas the stuff that's outside of it is > still referred to as "IDM."
IDM started as a name for "intelligent techno," like early Autechre and Aphex Twin.
quoted 8 lines "Techno" used to be the catch-all phrase for anything electronic,> "Techno" used to be the catch-all phrase for anything electronic, > sometimes with or without vocals, and some people still use it as > such, but it generally has a very well-defined genre that it fits now. > Is that bad? Well, not really -- it helps people know what to expect > that are looking for that, but also helps people avoid it if they > want. I love me some good IDM, but I would probably never buy a > record that was called (at least, by someone on this list) "techno." > Either it's too broad or it means detroit-style acidy techno.
Techno has meant this since the 80s. It started to be used as a blanket term in the early 90s by outsiders but that has somewhat fallen off.
quoted 5 lines It really wouldn't surprise me if some of the more "out there"> It really wouldn't surprise me if some of the more "out there" > idm-genres split off and become their own "genre." I mean, the > hyper-noisy stuff like Venetian Snares is ages away from the melodic > Marumari stuff, and depending on what artists do and call themselves, > *something* is going to split them off.
I don't think Venetian Snares would ever call himself IDM. Drug and bass and breakcore are the names I've heard him use. -- :: atomly :: [ atomly@atomly.com : www.atomly.com ... [ atomiq records : po box 805319 chicago il 60680 : 877.741.3571 ... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2002-10-30 20:52EggyToast>[EggyToast <eggy@eggytoast.com>] >> It's happened before. IDM used to be the name for qui
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EggyToast
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Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:52:29 -0500
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Re: [idm] Future of IDM
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Re: [idm] Future of IDM
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quoted 8 lines [EggyToast <eggy@eggytoast.com>]>[EggyToast <eggy@eggytoast.com>] >> It's happened before. IDM used to be the name for quiet, glitchy >> music, but now that's called "microsound." So now the microsound >> stuff has its own name, whereas the stuff that's outside of it is >> still referred to as "IDM." > >IDM started as a name for "intelligent techno," like early Autechre and >Aphex Twin.
I know. What I mean is that microsound was called IDM. People didn't know what to call it, and figured it would be lumped into whatever "IDM" is.
quoted 2 lines Techno has meant this since the 80s. It started to be used as a blanket>Techno has meant this since the 80s. It started to be used as a blanket >term in the early 90s by outsiders but that has somewhat fallen off.
Agreed. I think it happened mostly because people referred to IDM as techno, figuring it had obvious connections to detroit techno (which is arguably true). Now that there's other names for it, I think it's easy to call what was originally just "techno," techno.
quoted 2 lines I don't think Venetian Snares would ever call himself IDM. Drug and>I don't think Venetian Snares would ever call himself IDM. Drug and >bass and breakcore are the names I've heard him use.
Sure. That's exactly what I mean -- people making the stuff will say "i'm something else," or a group that would otherwise get lumped into one genre will say "no, we're something else." If the name sticks and other people decide to join, a genre is born! In fact, I brought up mr. snares exactly for that reason. He's someone that would be lumped broadly into the IDM category at, say, a record store. He could be put into the drum 'n bass category, but he's sort of too noisy, and he's not really made for dancing at all, so they put him in with the aphex twin and the autechre and the other "weird electronic music that doesn't really fit into another category [yet]" stuff. But he says "no, don't put me there; I'm something else entirely." Now, he can say all he wants, of course, but if he's still always put right in that IDM category, then most everyone will call him that. However, if more people start making music like him, and saying "no no, we're "drug 'n bass" or "breakcore," then the more backing there is to calling that a genre and possibly convincing the record stores, the music discussion lists, and everything else to start calling it that. You can't have a genre of yourself -- that's a given ("oh, I make eggy music"). When other people adopt it, follow it, use it -- then it's a genre. mr. snares may very well be on his way to his own genre, but it depends on what happens *next*. derek -- eggytoast.com -------------- you'll shoot your eye out --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2002-10-31 01:21Gaylord M. FockerYou people have already gone and done it by lamenting over and over about British Hip Hop
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Gaylord M. Focker
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Wed, 30 Oct 2002 17:21:20 -0800 (PST)
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Re: [idm] Future of IDM
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You people have already gone and done it by lamenting over and over about British Hip Hop for the past 72 hours. Do you not see the subgenre IDMers have created thus far with the recent catch phrase of glitch-hop and all its predecessors to that of down tempo acid jazz to ambient noise which are all entirely related to the mere philosophy of dsp acoustical trickery which so many kids today only correlate to Intelligent Dance Music. This genre is so massive now that I wouldn?t be surprised to see a Deborah Harry (Blondie) or Yoko Ono remix pop up on the list in say the next eight months which people will then begin denying it has and relevance to our first love. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2002-10-31 01:31Thomas MillarI'm gonna recommend that everybody check out the new Grand Theft Auto: Vice City soundtrac
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Thomas Millar
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Wed, 30 Oct 2002 20:31:52 -0500
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[idm] OT: Vice City OST.
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Re: [idm] Future of IDM
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I'm gonna recommend that everybody check out the new Grand Theft Auto: Vice City soundtracks, esp. the Box set, which is only about $40 or so for seven CDs. Having watched this game being played over the past two days I have observed that several of the radio stations genuinely kick ass, esp. the 'Wildstyle' pirate station and 'Wave 103.5'. That and the fact that it's easily cheaper and better than Rhino's recent 'Totally 80s' box set. Sigue Sigue Sputnik. Cybotron. Ozzy Osbourne. Cheat codes. You can't go wrong. Tom --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2002-10-31 11:42J.P.L'asthme Fawn--- "Gaylord M. Focker" <gaylordmfocker@yahoo.com> wrote: > I wouldn?t be surprised to see
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J.P.L'asthme Fawn
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Thu, 31 Oct 2002 03:42:41 -0800 (PST)
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Re: [idm] Future of IDM
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Re: [idm] Future of IDM
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--- "Gaylord M. Focker" <gaylordmfocker@yahoo.com> wrote:
quoted 6 lines I wouldn?t be surprised to see a> I wouldn?t be surprised to see a > Deborah Harry (Blondie) or Yoko Ono remix pop up on > the list in say the next eight months which people > will then begin denying it has and relevance to our > first love. >
don't know 'bout debbie harry but yoko commissioned a remix from herbert to be released shortly. gregory ===== )the fawn )"i thought when i started playing )shows i'd meet a lot of really cool )people, but most of the people i've )met just want me to copy software )for them" __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2002-10-30 20:54Nuutti-Iivari MeriläinenOn Wed, 30 Oct 2002 CAPOIIEE@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 10/30/02 9:49:51 AM Easte
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Nuutti-Iivari Meriläinen
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Wed, 30 Oct 2002 22:54:24 +0200 (EET)
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Re: [idm] Future of IDM
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On Wed, 30 Oct 2002 CAPOIIEE@aol.com wrote:
quoted 9 lines In a message dated 10/30/02 9:49:51 AM Eastern Standard Time,> In a message dated 10/30/02 9:49:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, > jwhite@ShoppersDrugMart.CA writes: > > > Hello. I was just wondering where everyone sees IDM going in the near > > future? I mean sound/genre - anything really. Just interested in hearing > > some opinions. > > to hell in a handbasket? >
To me, it is quite telling that the definition of the name of the list has come up in this thread, and people are actually doing research to find out things about the list while on the list. Sad. ("Why is so much attention given to Warp's recent past?") By no small fault of the list itself, concentrating on the machinery and mechanics of IDM production, from DSP Max to spotting the sort of algorithms used in a particular track through to requesting patches for Max similar to those used by Autechre. I find that the culmination point of the whole discussion on the relevance of IDM is the article on Richard Devine on Wired (http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/9.03/eword.html?pg=4), because "It never gets old [...] As processor speeds go up, the crazier my music gets!" In a later issue, laptop techno gets a thumbs up from the self-appointed digerati life-style magazine: http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/10.05/laptop.html . I do not wish to appear deprecative towards mainstream recognition of the culture and music I've been entrenched in for the past well over a decade. Nevertheless, focusing on the technologies and mechanics of production simply take the attention away from the music itself. The music becomes more appealing to some people because it is generated using the latest gadgets, gizmos and software. I have since the beginning been interested in the music, mainly because I've had a (partial) classical musical education. I still find being able to play a real, physical instrument more valuable than being able to tweak virtual knobs and variables inside software. I do use software myself, nevertheless the emphasis is on the actual process of composing, not the use and availability of plug-ins, algorithms, combinations of software and good old raw processing power. It seems to me that what nowadays is characterised as IDM is music for engineers. The pool of diverse genres that used to be IDM has been dried up, and electronic music is, or has already become, the soulless sort of music it used to be accused of being in the beginning.
quoted 3 lines its becoming "genre" music now, like "industrial," "drum n bass,&> its becoming "genre" music now, like "industrial," "drum n bass," "house," > "punk" etc.. >
All music degenerates this way. From my point of view, IDM started as a counterreaction to the somewhat stagnated music scene in the UK.
quoted 4 lines producers start wondering if their tracks are "idm" enough. it used to be> producers start wondering if their tracks are "idm" enough. it used to be > that idm was wierd experimental music that no one could categorize, it will > be a genre with its own rules and subculture. >
I would call rules functions and subculture subroutines. Categorisation is how we make sense of our immediate surroundings and create structure in our lives. It is inevitable and unavoidable. I find it quite sarcastic that RePHLeX categorised the music they release as Braindance, as a piss-take on the stagnancy and canonised goings-on on IDM. I wonder if anyone else has realised this.
quoted 7 lines kids in highschool will walk around with moptops and laptops wearing> kids in highschool will walk around with moptops and laptops wearing > schematic t-shirts.. soon there will be a band that will have vocals > and make it mainstreamish, and everyone on this list will be very > upset. 15 year old kids will start joining the list and ask who aphex > twin is. the 'post-warp' era is coming if not already here.. you wait > and see >
I have already been upset for a number of years. The numbers of veterans on the list have dwindled almost down to nothing. Mostly, I just depress the D button (as suggested in a recent post) when the prefix [idm] appears on my message list. It is quite easy to judge if a posting is worthy of attention by the subject line. Time consuming, yes, due to the drivel that passes as IDM nowadays. So, why do I still hang on? Because there is gold in them mines. Every now and then something I deem worth my while comes up, and then I'm again glad that I didn't dismiss the list as a waste of my time. Not that there is a lot to say about the recent discussions, mind you. A friend on the list said before unsubscribing, "This list used to be the shit. Now it's just shit." To me, the future of the list is what the people on the list make of it. We could moderate. We could spawn parallel lists. There are a number of things we could do. All things that could be done would (and perhaps will) be construed to be elitistic snobbery. Nevertheless, I do not advocate anything. I will stay on the list. I will still listen to my Warps, GPRs, Likeminds, Skams, and whatnot. Just to bring in some music content as well, today I've been listening to the following: D'Arcangelo: Broken Toys' Corner (RePHLeX CAT127LP 2xLP) Dr. Derek F: Acidic Possession (Skam-related 12") Silicon Scally: Mr. Machine (SCSI-AV ID009 2xLP) Zero DB: Audio Battery (Black Label BL002 12") Ada: Blindhouse (Areal AREAL10 12") In my not-at-all-humble opinion, all are relevant and on-topic releases for IDM. Cheers, -- nuutti-iivari meriläinen gordon at diversion dot org http colon slash slash www dot diversion dot org slash --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2002-10-30 20:58J.P.L'asthme Fawn--- CAPOIIEE@aol.com wrote: >soon there will > be a band that will have vocals and make it
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J.P.L'asthme Fawn
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Wed, 30 Oct 2002 12:58:32 -0800 (PST)
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Re: [idm] Future of IDM
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--- CAPOIIEE@aol.com wrote:
quoted 4 lines soon there will>soon there will > be a band that will have vocals and make it > mainstreamish, and everyone on > this list will be very upset.
i definitely will not be upset. i've been waiting for it actually. if bjork were american it would have already happened. as soon as this happens, i think there will be serious explosions of good music on the fringes. post-punk vs punk, electro vs. new wave, psych vs. rock n roll, etc. gregory ===== )the fawn )"i thought when i started playing )shows i'd meet a lot of really cool )people, but most of the people i've )met just want me to copy software )for them" __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org