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Re: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.

8 messages · 6 participants · spans 3 days · search this subject
1997-12-28 00:17Arthur B. Purvis (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
└─ 1997-12-28 16:42Ashok Divakaran RE: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
└─ 1997-12-31 00:32Mark Kolmar RE: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
1997-12-28 03:06Steve /k/./F/ Re: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
└─ 1997-12-28 03:23Arthur B. Purvis Re: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
1997-12-29 01:29Oeivind Idsoe Re: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
└─ 1997-12-29 02:33Brian & Sharon Beuchaw Re: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
1997-12-29 02:05Oeivind Idsoe Re: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
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1997-12-28 00:17Arthur B. Purvis> I have to 'defend' The Wire, as I think it's one of very few magazines who actually > ha
From:
Arthur B. Purvis
To:
Date:
Sat, 27 Dec 1997 19:17:00 -0500 (EST)
Subject:
(idm) The Wire etc. etc.
permalink · <Pine.GSO.3.95.971227184716.25736B-100000@sunlab3.princeton.edu>
quoted 3 lines I have to 'defend' The Wire, as I think it's one of very few magazines who > I have to 'defend' The Wire, as I think it's one of very few magazines who actually > has something interesting to say about music (and I really couldn't care less if > street-cred boys think it's "arty" or whatever else is the hip ugly word of the
I have had this argument enough times to acknowledge that the wire is not a total evil at all, because the fact remains that it is a glossy magazine with a large circulation with Steven Stapleton on the cover (it only took them 15 years to notice him, too! - this is the basis of my dissatisfaction). I'll say this: all your arguments are good, and they all apply to the arguments I made. However, the arguments I made are not my _main_ problem with the wire. My main problem with them is this: they claim to be the last bastion of experimental/avant-garde music, while they refuse to actually go out and look for new music. They wait for the music to "come to them" as it were. They never write about a band that's just started up with no commercial or "credible" backing. They just sit on their asses. See the NWW point: NWW has been around _forever_. As has Current 93, Death in June, etc. It's great that the Wire has recently done a cover story on Stapleton and a feature on Tibet. But why didn't they notice in the early 80s? Answer: because they were a bunch of crazed crowleyites making a lot of noise, and no one "important" was backing them - they created their own scene while everyone else paid no attention, _especially_ the "new music" rags. Why does the Wire, to this day, ignore Aube and only write about Merzbow, Violent Onsen Geisha, and a few others, when Aube is infinitely more interesting than all of them?
quoted 5 lines decides to slag off all No U Turn releases in his first issue. Fine. But don't think> decides to slag off all No U Turn releases in his first issue. Fine. But don't think > you can avoid the hype, because you are yourself creating it ("I hate Purvis' > magazine because he doesn't think No U Turn is 'arty' enough. And he thinks Panacea > came before No U Turn, and doesn't pay enough respect to the real innovators."). The > hype is the unavoidable consequence of the media world (and the fact that there
To clarify: When I say "arty" I mean the kind of people who will de facto think anything "musique concrete" or "electroacoustic" or "free jazz" is the bee's fucking knees, and will laugh contemptuously at bands called "skinny puppy," "Nirvana," etc. etc. I have no inherent problems with "artiness." And while I admit that the first time I heard Input I was infuriated about such blatant Panacea ripoffs, I have since first begun to question that and now have had it confirmed (in public, with my ignorance on view for all to see. Always the best kind of learning experience).
quoted 1 line whatever). And it certainly doesn't mean I agree with everything they say.> whatever). And it certainly doesn't mean I agree with everything they say.
But the problem is that a _LOT_ of people do. Even worse, they think they know everything about experimental music when in fact they know jack shit.
quoted 8 lines To the issue of The Wire being too arty: What the hell does word "arty" mean any> To the issue of The Wire being too arty: What the hell does word "arty" mean anyway? > It's being dropped everywhere, but would you care to explain why *you* think The Wire > chose Oval instead of Skinny Puppy to generate the CD-skipping hype (BTW, I like Oval > quite a bit)? Your claim has a sort of semi-paranoid ring to it (although I'm sure > you didn't mean for it to sound paranoid), and I'm curious as to what you might think > the The Wire's motives are/were. Perhaps Skinny Puppys version of CD-skipping just > wasn't to be liked (I haven't heard the track(s) you're refering to -- sorry), and > Oval are simply doing it 'better' (whatever that means)?
The Oval and Skinny Puppy approaches to the sound are WORLDS apart. I love both, pretty much equally. The point is that the wire an co. made a big deal of it as if it were something totally new, when SP did it years ago. The Wire didn't have any motives, they just totally ignored Sp (because of their name and genre alone, pretty much) and thus were unaware of SP, despite their claims to knowledge. It's not like SP is particularly obscure; they sold > 50,000 copies or so of their final album.
quoted 4 lines Second, what I really like (and hate when it's about something I like ;) about The> Second, what I really like (and hate when it's about something I like ;) about The > Wire is that although they might put Artist X on the cover one month, or make a > two-page feature on Artist Y the next, you can never rest assured that this artist > might not be dogged in the next couple of issues. The reviewers/writers sometimes
True enough - Simon Reynolds vs. Squarepusher is a good example. And John Everall runs totally against everything else in the magazine, and he has my infinite respect for actually finding new music for the rest of them (and putting it out! see the recent thread on Sentrax records).
quoted 4 lines Besides, your opinions on The Wire are just as stereotyped as the stereotypes you> Besides, your opinions on The Wire are just as stereotyped as the stereotypes you > claim The Wire are presenting, if you know what I mean. Come on...Alec Empire "arty"? > Plaid "arty"? Mouse On Mars "arty"? Patrick Pulsinger "arty"!?? No way. Art, perhaps, > but not arty.
See above, but you honestly can't find anything artsy about MoM or Alec Empire? What about artistic goofiness and "rebellion?" These are equally as artistically valid as pretension.
quoted 5 lines I whole-heartedly agree. Any kind of ignoration (is that a word?) based on something> I whole-heartedly agree. Any kind of ignoration (is that a word?) based on something > as totalitarian as a concept (Adorno (he-he)) is use- and worthless. Forget about > "Techno" and "Rock". What does it sound like? Any good? Are they using guitars!? Oh > my God...but...what the...it rules! (this could be the reaction of a person fixated > on Techno upon hearing My Bloody Valentine for the first time).
"Loveless" is better than anything ever called IDM or techno. "To Here Knows When" is quite possibly the greatest 4 1/2 minutes of music in the history of the art form. That is all I will say. I had little use for free jazz, but I knew there had to be _something_ great in there, and eventually, I found Cecil Taylor and earlier Ornette Coleman, and my digging through tons of shit was rewarded. Just keep looking... Same goes for country, folk, qawwali, African musics, etc. There is great music hidden in so many places.
1997-12-28 16:42Ashok Divakaran> I'll say this: all your arguments are good, and they all apply to the > arguments I made
From:
Ashok Divakaran
To:
Date:
Sun, 28 Dec 1997 16:42:04 +0000 (GMT)
Subject:
RE: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
Reply to:
(idm) The Wire etc. etc.
permalink · <"A1603ZXEHHER01*/R=WBWASH/R=A1/U=ASHOK DIVAKARAN/"@MHS>
quoted 7 lines I'll say this: all your arguments are good, and they all apply to the> I'll say this: all your arguments are good, and they all apply to the > arguments I made. However, the arguments I made are not my _main_ problem > with the wire. My main problem with them is this: they claim to be the > last bastion of experimental/avant-garde music, while they refuse to > actually go out and look for new music. They wait for the music to "come > to them" as it were. They never write about a band that's just started up > with no commercial or "credible" backing. They just sit on their asses.
This is simply not true. Here's a selection of some of the people, off the top of my head, that have had full pieces written on them in the Wire. None of them, to my knowledge, have "commercial or credible" backing (what does "credible backing" mean - that you're not part of the tape-only circuit ant more?) Ryoji Ikeda, Panasonic, Nijimu, Stefan Jaworzyn, John Wall, Simon Fisher Turner, Pete Namlook...
quoted 3 lines See the NWW point: NWW has been around _forever_. As has Current 93,> > See the NWW point: NWW has been around _forever_. As has Current 93, > Death in June, etc.
Both these last two stopped making Wire-relevant music years ago. It's great that the Wire has recently done a cover
quoted 5 lines story on Stapleton and a feature on Tibet. But why didn't they notice in> story on Stapleton and a feature on Tibet. But why didn't they notice in > the early 80s? Answer: because they were a bunch of crazed crowleyites > making a lot of noise, and no one "important" was backing them - they > created their own scene while everyone else paid no attention, > _especially_ the "new music" rags.
Come on, this is pure conspiracy theory! Firstly, I understand that the Wire itself changed its focus quite a bit in recent years. Maybe NWW simply didn't fall within their sphere of interest in those days (did the Wire even exist then anyway?) Back in the 80s ambient industrial/noise/whatever you want to call 'em bands were a dime a dozen (and most of them stunk.) Even the dedicated underground industrial/noise zines couldn't keep up. I think the Wire can rather be excused for having overlooked NWW, who, in any case, are overrated IMO and owe their popularity more to their secretiveness, surreal attitude and plain old inexplicable cultdom than any particular musical prowess.
quoted 3 lines Why does the Wire, to this day, ignore Aube and only write about Merzbow,> Why does the Wire, to this day, ignore Aube and only write about Merzbow, > Violent Onsen Geisha, and a few others, when Aube is infinitely more > interesting than all of them?
Hey, BTW, since when has VGO had any "commercial or credible" backing?
quoted 4 lines The Oval and Skinny Puppy approaches to the sound are WORLDS apart. I> The Oval and Skinny Puppy approaches to the sound are WORLDS apart. I > love both, pretty much equally. The point is that the wire an co. made a > big deal of it as if it were something totally new, when SP did it years > ago.
This I can agree with... If there's one thing that the Wire _is_ guilty of, it's their tendency to "discover" the next coolest thing and drown in their own mouth-froth. Look, any mag that's as brave as the Wire is treading in dangerous waters. How many mags do you know of that discuss all of these: Ravi Shankar; Stockhausen; Daniel Pemberton; Derrick May; Mark Isham. And what's more, they do so seriously and try to understand the music they discuss on its own terms. The flip side is that this free-ranging eclectism often results in trite and shallow discourse on how all the threads of "new music" all mesh together into this gigantic conceptual tapestry (something David Toop is particularly guilty of.) That's something I'm willing to live with - it's food for thought and in some cases they're actually onto something. All considered, for a glossy mag that's freely available and has a large circulation, I find the Wire to be a happy compromise between obscurity and commercial considerations. They are in business, after all - this isn't your 4-page xeroxed zine that costs 10c a copy to make. Ashok
1997-12-31 00:32Mark KolmarJust wanted to throw in a (slightly self-promotional) $0.02, re: The Wire, and tangentiall
From:
Mark Kolmar
To:
Ashok Divakaran
Cc:
Date:
Tue, 30 Dec 1997 18:32:04 -0600 (CST)
Subject:
RE: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
Reply to:
RE: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
permalink · <Pine.SOL.3.95.971230181441.22939A-100000@typhoon>
Just wanted to throw in a (slightly self-promotional) $0.02, re: The Wire, and tangentially, Oval and their supposed future plans: On Sun, 28 Dec 1997, Ashok Divakaran wrote:
quoted 12 lines They wait for the music to "come> > They wait for the music to "come > > to them" as it were. They never write about a band that's just started up > > with no commercial or "credible" backing. They just sit on their asses. > > This is simply not true. Here's a selection of some of the people, off the > top of my head, that have had full pieces written on them in the Wire. None > of them, to my knowledge, have "commercial or credible" backing (what does > "credible backing" mean - that you're not part of the tape-only circuit ant > more?) > > Ryoji Ikeda, Panasonic, Nijimu, Stefan Jaworzyn, John Wall, Simon Fisher > Turner, Pete Namlook...
Hell, The Wire published an article which mentioned a project of mine in issue 146 (April 1996): "...One person who has seen the potential is Mark Kolmar, whose Chaotic Entertainment Internet site uses special software to generate CDLink instructions at random. Choose any CD, choose a track, and Chaotic Entertainment will compose some delightfully minimalist, looping music for you that sounds not unlike CD deconstructors such as Oval or Nicolas Collins but which is never the same twice." ( Brian Duguid ) The URL, incidentally, is http://www.xnet.com/~mkolmar/chaotic.html, and it links to the full article. --Mark __ <http://www.xnet.com/~mkolmar/BurningRome> < MPEG & RA audio clips > Forthcoming CD SENSELESS on Mindfield Records MINDCD03 Cathartium 14 m u s i c : w e b : s o u n d d e s i g n : h t m l : c g i : e t c "I'm a liberal guy too cool for the macho ache with a secret tooth for the cherry on the cake" -- Prefab Sprout, "Cruel"
1997-12-28 03:06Steve /k/./F/> > I whole-heartedly agree. Any kind of ignoration (is that a word?) > based on something
From:
Steve /k/./F/
To:
Arthur B. Purvis , idm@hyperreal.org
Date:
Sun, 28 Dec 1997 03:06:32 +0000
Subject:
Re: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
permalink · <34A5C237.5AA0049@virgin.net>
quoted 15 lines I whole-heartedly agree. Any kind of ignoration (is that a word?)> > I whole-heartedly agree. Any kind of ignoration (is that a word?) > based on something > > as totalitarian as a concept (Adorno (he-he)) is use- and worthless. > Forget about > > "Techno" and "Rock". What does it sound like? Any good? Are they > using guitars!? Oh > > my God...but...what the...it rules! (this could be the reaction of a > person fixated > > on Techno upon hearing My Bloody Valentine for the first time). > > "Loveless" is better than anything ever called IDM or techno. "To > Here > Knows When" is quite possibly the greatest 4 1/2 minutes of music in > the > history of the art form. That is all I will say.
youre not alone there ;-D(rones)
quoted 8 lines I had little use for free jazz, but I knew there had to be _something_> I had little use for free jazz, but I knew there had to be _something_ > > great in there, and eventually, I found Cecil Taylor and earlier > Ornette > Coleman, and my digging through tons of shit was rewarded. Just keep > looking... Same goes for country, folk, qawwali, African musics, etc. > > There is great music hidden in so many places.
i saw this guy on a videotape of 'the greatest jazz pianists'... ... a crazy looking man in a tracksuit..... who looked homeless!... but did the crazyiest things with a piano.... i think the footage was late seventies.. is that cecil taylor?... i was in no state to remember names.... if so id love to hear plenty more. Steve
1997-12-28 03:23Arthur B. Purvis> > I had little use for free jazz, but I knew there had to be _something_ > > great in th
From:
Arthur B. Purvis
To:
Steve /k/./F/
Cc:
idm@hyperreal.org
Date:
Sat, 27 Dec 1997 22:23:24 -0500 (EST)
Subject:
Re: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
Reply to:
Re: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
permalink · <Pine.GSO.3.95.971227221707.27115A-100000@sunlab3.princeton.edu>
quoted 5 lines I had little use for free jazz, but I knew there had to be _something_> > I had little use for free jazz, but I knew there had to be _something_ > > great in there, and eventually, I found Cecil Taylor and earlier > > Ornette Coleman, and my digging through tons of shit was rewarded. > > Just keep looking... Same goes for country, folk, qawwali, African > > musics, etc.
quoted 5 lines i saw this guy on a videotape of 'the greatest jazz pianists'... ... a> i saw this guy on a videotape of 'the greatest jazz pianists'... ... a > crazy looking man in a tracksuit..... who looked homeless!... but did > the crazyiest things with a piano.... i think the footage was late > seventies.. is that cecil taylor?... i was in no state to remember > names.... if so id love to hear plenty more.
I can't guarantee it, but that sounds like Cecil Taylor... listening to him is kind of like just banging on a piano at random intervals, but much better somehow. Kind of an inexplicable listening experience. Although he did do some more "normal" music, he is far more famous for being crazy (given that it said "greatest jazz pianists" and he is by far the most famous crazy jazz _pianist_ it was also prolly him). He's put out a _lot_ of records; I've only heard a couple, and they were mostly on Impulse! I'd just listen before you buy to see what you're getting (sorry, can't give titles, I'm away from my source for jazz music here at home). --- the humble arthur purvis set his hand hereto.
1997-12-29 01:29Oeivind IdsoeArthur B. Purvis wrote: > I have had this argument enough times to acknowledge that the wi
From:
Oeivind Idsoe
To:
Date:
Mon, 29 Dec 1997 02:29:03 +0100
Subject:
Re: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
permalink · <34A6FCDF.11C79878@online.no>
Arthur B. Purvis wrote:
quoted 5 lines I have had this argument enough times to acknowledge that the wire is not> I have had this argument enough times to acknowledge that the wire is not > a total evil at all, because the fact remains that it is a glossy magazine > with a large circulation with Steven Stapleton on the cover (it only took > them 15 years to notice him, too! - this is the basis of my > dissatisfaction).
As has been said by a couple of other guys: The Wire fifteen years ago, althought I don't think it existed at that time, was a completely different Wire from the one we know today. They have a different editor (which is quite young, by the way, only 24-25 years old from what I've heard (which makes him 15 at the beginnings of NWW)), a different layout, a completely different agenda, and so 'naturally' they couldn't cover Stapleton from the time at which he began his musics. How is a magazine as independent as The Wire supposed to be responsible -- and cover in retrospect! -- things that started way before its time; how *can* you hold this against them? I just don't get it. (besides, this "who did what first" is only the incarnation of copyfright infringement issues, which again relates back to the capitalisation of music -- so I think we should more or less forget about it. ;)
quoted 5 lines with the wire. My main problem with them is this: they claim to be the> with the wire. My main problem with them is this: they claim to be the > last bastion of experimental/avant-garde music, while they refuse to > actually go out and look for new music. They wait for the music to "come > to them" as it were. They never write about a band that's just started up > with no commercial or "credible" backing. They just sit on their asses.
I'm sure this may be true in some cases ("music coming to them"), but, as a person who actually *knows* someone who works at The Wire (to everyone: please don't throw cheap shots at me for this one - the person I know started working there after I sent The Wire my subscription), I can assure you that these people don't "just sit on their asses". They work very hard to put out a magazine, and with such a limited amount of resources as these people actually have, they have to prioritize and therefore can't spend too much time looking up obscure bands who make weird noises by rubbing a burnt harmonica on remains from a dog (sorry, cheap shot. couldn't resist). Besides, it's downright impossible to cover bands that have just started up. Can you imagine the number of post-avant garde people who would run down the staff of The Wire asking for some cover on their latest project? Commercial backing or not, artists somehow has to 'prove' themselves in one way or the other, and I think The Wire is doing a damn good job picking out the interesting stuff. In addition, who you may or may not know varies from person to person. Personally, I have been introduced to *so* many great musicians/artists/composers/sound artists through The Wire that I'm forever greatful (but that's just me being servile).
quoted 2 lines created their own scene while everyone else paid no attention,> created their own scene while everyone else paid no attention, > _especially_ the "new music" rags.
"Scenes" are overrated and numbing. Break away.
quoted 3 lines Why does the Wire, to this day, ignore Aube and only write about Merzbow,> Why does the Wire, to this day, ignore Aube and only write about Merzbow, > Violent Onsen Geisha, and a few others, when Aube is infinitely more > interesting than all of them?
Please explain *why* Aube is infinitely more interesting than all of them, and then how this explanation becomes universal. Seriously, though, The Wire is an opinion, not a matter of fact. I can't really say more than that.
quoted 5 lines To clarify: When I say "arty" I mean the kind of people who will de facto> To clarify: When I say "arty" I mean the kind of people who will de facto > think anything "musique concrete" or "electroacoustic" or "free jazz" is > the bee's fucking knees, and will laugh contemptuously at bands called > "skinny puppy," "Nirvana," etc. etc. I have no inherent problems with > "artiness."
Not sure what "bee's fucking knees" means, but I'm sure I agree with you. All de facto people are mostly boring. I like Stocky (that's Stockhausen to some people) and Nirvana and Björk and Autechre and Xenakis and...and...etc. Although you did pick some bad examples; musique concrete and electroacoustic is hardly ever featured in The Wire, and they seem to have a very hostile attitude towards composers within these genres. BTW, do you hate musiq.concr. and elec.acoust.? Because I could point you to some fantastic releases that I'm sure you would love (Pierre Henry, Bernard Parmeggiani, Xenakis, Jonty Harrison, Dennis Smalley...and the list goes on).
quoted 4 lines whatever). And it certainly doesn't mean I agree with everything they say.> > whatever). And it certainly doesn't mean I agree with everything they say. > > But the problem is that a _LOT_ of people do. Even worse, they think they > know everything about experimental music when in fact they know jack shit.
You're blaming people's ignorance on a magazine, which is kind of reversing the whole causality. The Wire can't possible be blamed for the eventual ignorant readers they may have, although I'm sure they're out there.
quoted 2 lines despite their claims to knowledge. It's not like SP is particularly> despite their claims to knowledge. It's not like SP is particularly > obscure; they sold > 50,000 copies or so of their final album.
If they sold 50 000 copies of their album it's probably not that good. (just kidding).
quoted 3 lines See above, but you honestly can't find anything artsy about MoM or Alec> See above, but you honestly can't find anything artsy about MoM or Alec > Empire? What about artistic goofiness and "rebellion?" These are equally > as artistically valid as pretension.
I'm not sure I'm following you here, but I can't guarantee you that I find nothing pretentiously arty about neither Mouse On Mars nor Alec Empire. These people have way too much humour in their music to ever be considered pretentious! (case in point: a while ago I catched Mouse On Mars hosting a program on a basically shi*ty German mtv-like station called Viva, and these two people giggle and laugh so much that I think you would have to re-evaluate your opinion on them quite considerably. The same goes for Alec Empire, I think (if you read the AE interview in the previous issue of The Wire you will see that this is mentioned in connection with the photo shoot they did for the article)) Conclusion: pretentious people usually don't have a sense of humour (notice Basil Fawlty in Fawlty Towers -- *the* incarnation of pretentiousness).
quoted 3 lines "Loveless" is better than anything ever called IDM or techno. "To Here> "Loveless" is better than anything ever called IDM or techno. "To Here > Knows When" is quite possibly the greatest 4 1/2 minutes of music in the > history of the art form. That is all I will say.
Personally I don't like such dualities or "either-ors", because they pretend that there is One way of listening to music, instead of realizing that there are several different plateaus on which music can be inhaled. I find it meaningless to claim that Loveless is somehow superiour to fx. electronic music, because I don't listen to MBV the same way I listen to fx. Xenakis or Higher Intelligence Agency. I listen with my head, perhaps. Or my heart. Or with both. Or with my body. Or with my body and my head...etc.etc. Hierarchizing the way you do is impossible for me, because even though Loveless is one fantastic piece of work, it's not music that I can always listen to, no matter what -- none of the CDs in my collection are. Of course, this doesn't mean that I don't have preferences, but making huge generalizations in the absolute sense that you seem to be doing feels kinda...wrong.
quoted 1 line There is great music hidden in so many places.> There is great music hidden in so many places.
This is so true...but you really have to look hard sometimes. /Oeivind/
1997-12-29 02:33Brian & Sharon BeuchawFirst, Peter Hollo asks: > OK, just out of interest, how long has The Wire been around for
From:
Brian & Sharon Beuchaw
To:
Date:
Sun, 28 Dec 1997 20:33:07 -0600 (CST)
Subject:
Re: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
Reply to:
Re: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
permalink · <Pine.BSI.3.95.971228202037.541B-100000@enteract.com>
First, Peter Hollo asks:
quoted 1 line OK, just out of interest, how long has The Wire been around for then?> OK, just out of interest, how long has The Wire been around for then?
Back in issue 124 (May 94 - the earliest one I've got), it says it's published 11 times/year, so that'd make it a little over 11 years old in 5/94, so approximately since the beginning of 1983. Then Oeivind Idsoe said:
quoted 3 lines Although you did pick some bad examples; musique concrete and> Although you did pick some bad examples; musique concrete and > electroacoustic is hardly ever featured in The Wire, and they seem to > have a very hostile attitude towards composers within these genres.
You're right, they don't feautre it much, but they didn't seem hostile when they did an article on Jerome Noetinger's Metamkine series of CDs or in the Pierre Henry article (altho Henry was a bit hostile towards some of today's electronic artists, but let's not get into that) or in some of the reviews that I've read (RLW's work _tulpas_, and some others that I can't remember right now, but can look up if anybody wants). I think The Wire's hostility depends on who's doing the writing/interviewing/reviewing, not on a specific genre..... cya brian -------------------------------------------------------- "The most dementing of all modern sins: the inability to distinguish excellence from success." - David Hare
1997-12-29 02:05Oeivind IdsoeOeivind Idsoe wrote: > I'm not sure I'm following you here, but I can't guarantee you that
From:
Oeivind Idsoe
To:
Date:
Mon, 29 Dec 1997 03:05:48 +0100
Subject:
Re: (idm) The Wire etc. etc.
permalink · <34A7057C.20D503C9@online.no>
Oeivind Idsoe wrote:
quoted 3 lines I'm not sure I'm following you here, but I can't guarantee you that I find > I'm not sure I'm following you here, but I can't guarantee you that I find nothing > pretentiously arty about neither Mouse On Mars nor Alec Empire. These people have way too > much humour in their music to ever be considered pretentious!
Seems like I'm creating my own negative dialectic here...I did, of course, mean to say "I *can* guarantee you that I find nothing pretentious...blah.blah.blah". Seems like the line-wrapping thing's been screwed again. Sigh. /Oeivind/