IDM Mailing Archive

OMG I can't believe you compared beethoven and britney spears!!!!!!!! BLASPHEEMER!!!!!! look, I think that most critics would agree that while the level of exerimentation and creativity in the fringes of music has increased as of late, the quality of the majority of music has been suffering... Don't give me that "quality is subjective" bullshit cause we all know britney spears SUCKS and beethoven DOESNT. If people "gravitate towards mediocrity" do you think that is part of human nature and hence unchangeable? I don't. I think it is a symptom of rampant consumerism, short attention spans caused by TV and other perfectly obvious causes that can be dealt with.... Can you name me an amazing musician that has no background in traditional music and who also wasn't some extremely odd case of idiot savant like genius? As you said, it is all mathematics, so what about teaching the math behind music to prospective musicians??? as far as stepping outside the boundries... I think you answered that for yourself... but it is more like how can you step outside the boundries when you can't speak the language... I mean, in terms of literature... is this art: lkjlkj l llkj lkj l lkj lk0sdfsdfsdjlkjcv lklkasflkjasasds lkadsfljk jlkasflk l7089ljkwefljlk -9-as ????? helll no it's not art and I don't care if you think it is... it is random garbage... otherwise I could proclaim that my next work of art is everything that happens between 5:05am and 5:10 am within a 100 cubic foot space in the middle of arizona tomorrow. To make art with words you have to speak a language... learning the language is not limiting but freeing. You are not taught to be creative, just how to make your creativity real, relevant, and communicable so that others can understand it. All musical systems everywhere whether it is asian, western, indian etc... have octaves, fifths, fourths, scales, etc... and the mathematical formulas apply to all of them though some may have fewer or more tones than others.... These mathematical patterns are not inventions of old-men, but were co-invented by the biological evolution of sensory organs and perception combined with the physics of sound vibrations through the air or other media. Music theory is the language that musicians everywhere need to know, and whether they are born knowing it or learn it from a book or by practicing an instrument or composing on their computers, all of the good musicians will know it and be fluent with it. I am not saying that it can't be learned from just composing on your computer, just that almost all of the people who try this route end up lacking in quality and wondering why. The reason is that they aren't dedicated enough to improving their knowledge and that's why there is so much crap music out there... Playing a traditional instrument and taking lessons can provide the discipline and motivation which somehow magically ends up conveying the necessary knowledge required to produce quality music, even in genres and idioms never before heard. If you are saying that future music won't use tones, harmony, scales, time signitures, triplets, syncopation, modes, modulation etc... then forget I ever said anything and go back to "charting new territory" I personally won't be interested in listening to that and will resign myself to curmudgeonhood. the more things change, the more they stay the same.... matt loathing wrote:

quoted 31 lines I completely disagree with that line of thinking.

> > I completely disagree with that line of thinking. > First off...using pop music as a focal point for your > argument towards classical technique training does not > make any sense....since Ms. Spears and many other "pop > stars" became famous not because of their training but > because...as rule humans especially americans > gravitate towards mediocrity.... > > Second of all...what does not make any sense to me is > the idea that people should be "taught" how to be > creative. > > Creativity is all about stepping outside of > boundaries. > And please don't tell me you have to "learn" the > boundaries so you are able to adequately step outside > of them because that's a load of crap. > > Classical music and technique is nothing but a bunch > of mathematics and you don't need to learn classical > music to put together amazing compositions or to play > amazing music..... > If needing to learn anything about classical music is > imperative is maybe the concept that most classical > composers were making pop music for their time. > So perhaps we can equate that Beethoven was just > another Brittany Spears!! > > Matt Loathing >

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