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[idm] re: napster (copyright death?)

5 messages · 4 participants · spans 2 days · search this subject
◇ merged from 2 subjects: napster · napster (copyright death?)
2001-02-13 21:50...(Sunsp0t)... Re: Re: [idm] re: napster
└─ 2001-02-13 22:39Jeff/Ninja Tune Re: [idm] re: napster
2001-02-15 19:37JK [idm] re: napster (copyright death?)
└─ 2001-02-15 22:06Jeff/Ninja Tune Re: [idm] re: napster (copyright death?)
2001-02-16 07:36philippe petit [idm] re: napster (copyright death?)
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2001-02-13 21:50...(Sunsp0t)...> >Believe it or not, there are releases on Warp selling less than 1000 >copies. ..and the
From:
...(Sunsp0t)...
To:
Bill Wright
Cc:
idm@hyperreal.org
Date:
Tue, 13 Feb 2001 16:50:6 -0500
Subject:
Re: Re: [idm] re: napster
permalink · <200102132150.NAA15152@swan.prod.itd.earthlink.net>
quoted 3 lines Believe it or not, there are releases on Warp selling less than 1000> >Believe it or not, there are releases on Warp selling less than 1000 >copies.
..and they should be THANKING Napster for providing the ultimate exposure campaign they've ever had. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2001-02-13 22:39Jeff/Ninja TuneReading to much into the whole thing. It's just another form of distribution that probably
From:
Jeff/Ninja Tune
Cc:
idm@hyperreal.org
Date:
Tue, 13 Feb 2001 17:39:26 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] re: napster
Reply to:
Re: Re: [idm] re: napster
permalink · <B6AF21C3.41F4%jeff@ninjatune.net>
Reading to much into the whole thing. It's just another form of distribution that probably won't rock the boat much more then it has already has (which has been significant but hasn't exactly killed record/cd sales).VHS didn't kill off the movie theatre. You know when you see a trailer for a mediocre movie and say "that's a rental", well mediocre records will be "that's a download". As a record label owner I sat on the fence with Napster. I could appreciate it on a lot of levels, but thought that the glorification of what it supposedly "stood for" was pretty lame. How was it again that all record labels became "bad people" yet Napster was "cool". I don't have a CEO. I didn't sell my company to BMG (Although in fairness a lot of people seemed to be able to figure out there was a difference between labels like Ninja and labels like Universal). That's bit harsh and I'm sure the Napster people are okay people, but I was a bit miffed at public reaction to a lot of things.. I think they could have gone about the whole thing a lot better and managed to survive. Oh well we'll see what happens. Sorry to drag it out again. Think I'll go home and crank out some Slim Gailard 78's on the 'ol Victorolo Jeff on 2/13/01 4:00 PM, ...(Sunsp0t)... at sunspot@subdimension.com wrote:
quoted 39 lines At 2/13/01 10:27:00 AM you wrote:> At 2/13/01 10:27:00 AM you wrote: >> Could you kindly repeat all this (bullshit) to the 99.5% of "idm"/indie >> artists who work dayjobs to support themselves so that they can continue to >> make (good) music for your enjoyment? > > > > I see, so when the the automobile came out, we should have suppressed it for > the sake of the horse-carraige drivers, eh? > > > I think you just don't realize, that making music is not a way to make money > anymore. At least it won't be. ..And if you step back and look, it really > never was. I'm sure I offended many of your with that statement, but.... > > > > The INEVITABLE change in music (and most if not all other forms of > intellectual property) will be both good and bad. Good, because all the > half-assed rockstars will be quickly weeded out, leaving people who truly make > music for music's sake. Bad because the equipment and expenses needed to make > a record will hinder talented people from creating. > > Perhaps the "revolution" greratest asset has been to shed light on the true > bastards of the industry - the record label moguls themselves. Artificially > inflated prices, and obvious trust policies are only now being exposed to the > public. > > As we have seen with the drug war legislation is simply not effective when > even just 10% (picked the number out of the air, but the point is clear) of > the population disobeys it. > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >
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2001-02-15 19:37JKI think that, regardless of the moral dillema created by services such as napster, the rea
From:
JK
To:
Date:
Thu, 15 Feb 2001 13:37:03 -0600
Subject:
[idm] re: napster (copyright death?)
permalink · <3A8C2FDF.AA3BE60A@swbell.net>
I think that, regardless of the moral dillema created by services such as napster, the reality is that they're here, and are going to stay here. Ever since it's conception it has seemed to me that napster was a foreshadowing of the imminent death of the idea of "intellectual property" in the conventional sense, and even more so since the birth of gnutella and other central serverless ptop sharing networks. I'm not sure what this means for all the artists out there. For one thing, the non-indie music labels are going to have to figure out that after tasting free music, people aren't going to go back to paying 20$ a pop for cd's just because napster's gone. The people in the music industry are going to have to make it worth it to the consumer to purchase the cd, and recieve everything that goes along with it, case, sleeve etc. etc. Whether this is achieved by a lower price, using dvd format to store more work, or whatever is for the industry at large to figure out. As far as indie labels go, however, i hope most people on the list and elsewhere will realize that the folks are not rich, they make music because they love to do it, and if you like their stuff, you should always support them by PURCHASING an album(as painfull as that may be). So.... whatever, take that as you will. cdin --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2001-02-15 22:06Jeff/Ninja TuneAbout the whole "prices to high" comment that regularly gets kicked around in Napster disc
From:
Jeff/Ninja Tune
To:
Date:
Thu, 15 Feb 2001 17:06:51 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] re: napster (copyright death?)
Reply to:
[idm] re: napster (copyright death?)
permalink · <B6B1B8EF.4308%jeff@ninjatune.net>
About the whole "prices to high" comment that regularly gets kicked around in Napster discussions, here's a story... When we released our 3CD Xen Cuts box we made every effort to keep the price really cheap. We decided we wanted to have a really nice set but to keep it as cheap as possible so that hardcore Ninja fans who would already own all the rare stuff in the set wouldn't feel cheated. So I set the price at 18.98 US for 3CD box. Pretty sweet considering that's the list price for most major label 1CD releases. So I'm in a record store about 2 weeks after it's been released and I'm asking a person there how it's selling. They tell me it's selling well but they'd thought it would have been doing better. When I ask what the problem is they tell me a lot of people have been picking it up, looking at the price and thinking it's not worth owning because it's to cheap for 3CD's, ie. they don't think something that cheap is worth owning. People are scared of a deal as they don't think they're getting there money's worth. He told me they probably would have sold a lot more if it was $5 more. So what the fuck. Where's the fine line between free and to expensive. We try and make a set that looks great, has tons of stuff on it, and is cheap and it turns out people "don't trust something that cheap". Anyway I just thought it was quite funny considering all the talk that was going on at that time about "labels needing to respond by making things cheaper". Jeff on 2/15/01 2:37 PM, JK at k-rad@swbell.net wrote:
quoted 22 lines The>The > people in the music > industry are going to have to make it worth it to the consumer to purchase the > cd, and recieve > everything that goes along with it, case, sleeve etc. etc. Whether this is > achieved by a lower price, > using dvd format to store more work, or whatever is for the industry at large > to figure out. > As far as indie labels go, however, i hope most people on the list and > elsewhere will realize that > the folks are not rich, they make music because they love to do it, and if you > like their stuff, you > should always support them by PURCHASING an album(as painfull as that may be). > So.... whatever, take that as you will. > > cdin > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >
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2001-02-16 07:36philippe petitSo what the fuck. Where's the fine line between free and to expensive. We try and make a s
From:
philippe petit
To:
Date:
Fri, 16 Feb 2001 08:36:10 +0100
Subject:
[idm] re: napster (copyright death?)
permalink · <3A8CD86A.CAD81619@wanadoo.fr>
So what the fuck. Where's the fine line between free and to expensive. We try and make a set that looks great, has tons of stuff on it, and is cheap and it turns out people "don't trust something that cheap". Anyway I just thought it was quite funny considering all the talk that was going on at that time about "labels needing to respond by making things cheaper". Jeff interesting and it reminds me of people who only attend shows promoted with full-color massive posters, and would never go see a band whose poster has been xeroxed...philippe ************************************************************** http://www.bip-hop.com unconventional sound adventures, adventurous & creative electronica... ************************************************************** TENNIS : europe on horseback [bleep 03] TENNIS is Benge and Si-{cut}.db. An on-going London based collaboration exploring digital and electro-acoustic sounds and rhythms combined with 21st century audio software. "Europe on Horseback", and shows a progression of the "Tennis sound" into a harder more digital/glitchy but accesible rhythmic realm, with dub and german influences to the fore. BiP-HOp Generation v. 2 [bleep 02] 20 exclusive tracks, 70+ mns of music and comes in a 6 page Digipack including a booklet w/ infos on each musician AROVANE / BERNARD FLEISCHMANN / WARMDESK / KÖHN / WANG INC. / LAURENT PERNICE BiP-HOp Generation v.1 [bleep 01] v. 1 offers 74 mns of music and comes in a 6 page Digipack including a booklet w/ infos on each musician : MARUMARI / SCHNEIDER TM / PHONEM / GOEM / ULTRA MILKMAIDS / MASSIMO ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------