IDM Mailing Archive

hello IDM board, I make music under the name Desolation Wilderness and I've posted some of my songs on the internet. Take a listen if you want and let me know what you think. I've encoded the mp3's at 190 because I feel like the sound quality will suffer too much otherwise. If you have dialup and want smaller files, I'll provide them. http://desolationwilderness.luniac.com/ thanks nic

After listening to your tracks I think you picked a great name for this output...it's refreshing to hear music and sounds with plenty of room to breathe. Great work I enjoyed it immensely! Leslie -----Original Message----- From: nic z [mailto:bankbot1@gmail.com] Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 5:24 PM To: idm@hyperreal.org Subject: [idm] Desolation Wilderness hello IDM board, I make music under the name Desolation Wilderness and I've posted some of my songs on the internet. Take a listen if you want and let me know what you think. I've encoded the mp3's at 190 because I feel like the sound quality will suffer too much otherwise. If you have dialup and want smaller files, I'll provide them. http://desolationwilderness.luniac.com/ thanks nic --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

hi list - steming from a discussion elsewhere, someone asked "what's post glitch" as a progression. obviously, most musical styles have a precursor that's pretty easy to trace in the formation of the new style. what's post glitch? do you have an example? how has glitch informed this new style, and what distinguishes it as being post glitch, as opposed to just glitch? just a ramble, shift8 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies (sorry if there were some, I must have missed them). I'm rather intrigued by this also. -----Original Message----- From: shift8 [mailto:shift8@digitrash.com] Sent: 28 August 2005 06:37 To: idm@hyperreal.org Subject: [idm] post glitch hi list - steming from a discussion elsewhere, someone asked "what's post glitch" as a progression. obviously, most musical styles have a precursor that's pretty easy to trace in the formation of the new style. what's post glitch? do you have an example? how has glitch informed this new style, and what distinguishes it as being post glitch, as opposed to just glitch? just a ramble, shift8 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

ditto -----Original Message----- From: Lee Stacey [mailto:lee@codeaudio.com] Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 12:11 PM To: idm@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies (sorry if there were some, I must have missed them). I'm rather intrigued by this also. -----Original Message----- From: shift8 [mailto:shift8@digitrash.com] Sent: 28 August 2005 06:37 To: idm@hyperreal.org Subject: [idm] post glitch hi list - steming from a discussion elsewhere, someone asked "what's post glitch" as a progression. obviously, most musical styles have a precursor that's pretty easy to trace in the formation of the new style. what's post glitch? do you have an example? how has glitch informed this new style, and what distinguishes it as being post glitch, as opposed to just glitch? just a ramble, shift8 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

Someone explain what glitch is first maybe? Im not sure that I truly know. nate schmold www.neferiu.com www.mantrakid.com -----Original Message----- From: Obed Vento [mailto:ovento@keyleadsonline.com] Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 10:12 AM To: idm@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch ditto -----Original Message----- From: Lee Stacey [mailto:lee@codeaudio.com] Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 12:11 PM To: idm@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies (sorry if there were some, I must have missed them). I'm rather intrigued by this also. -----Original Message----- From: shift8 [mailto:shift8@digitrash.com] Sent: 28 August 2005 06:37 To: idm@hyperreal.org Subject: [idm] post glitch hi list - steming from a discussion elsewhere, someone asked "what's post glitch" as a progression. obviously, most musical styles have a precursor that's pretty easy to trace in the formation of the new style. what's post glitch? do you have an example? how has glitch informed this new style, and what distinguishes it as being post glitch, as opposed to just glitch? just a ramble, shift8 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

In what context have you seen it used? In a way, it just sounds like one of those made-up Hyperbolies, since "glitch" itself isn't really that clearly defined. Its probably not a serious categorization. The only thing I can think of really that you might Use it is when talking about things that incorporate Glitchy elements, but have more song-like elements, Or strong elements of other genres, maybe like some of ellen alien's stuff, or like what exile is doing with d&b. - ctups --- WRECKED electronic music mailorder http://wrecked-distro.com -----Original Message----- From: Obed Vento [mailto:ovento@keyleadsonline.com] Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 12:12 PM To: idm@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch ditto -----Original Message----- From: Lee Stacey [mailto:lee@codeaudio.com] Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 12:11 PM To: idm@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies (sorry if there were some, I must have missed them). I'm rather intrigued by this also. -----Original Message----- From: shift8 [mailto:shift8@digitrash.com] Sent: 28 August 2005 06:37 To: idm@hyperreal.org Subject: [idm] post glitch hi list - steming from a discussion elsewhere, someone asked "what's post glitch" as a progression. obviously, most musical styles have a precursor that's pretty easy to trace in the formation of the new style. what's post glitch? do you have an example? how has glitch informed this new style, and what distinguishes it as being post glitch, as opposed to just glitch? just a ramble, shift8 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

At 18:11 02.09.2005, Lee Stacey wrote:

quoted 2 lines Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies (sorry if

>Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies (sorry if >there were some, I must have missed them).

i've missed it intentionally because thinking of developement of music styles as linear processes is deprecated and you didn't tell what you mean by glitch. the 1920's dadaist performances using defective gramophone players? the 1930's performances by john cage using radios? the 1950's distorted electric guitars? but you want an answer anyway, right? ok - the next big thing (but don't tell your friends) is "scramblism". sven. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

quoted 7 lines i've missed it intentionally because thinking of developement of

> i've missed it intentionally because thinking of developement of > music styles as > linear processes is deprecated and you didn't tell what you mean by glitch. > the 1920's dadaist performances using defective gramophone players? > the 1930's performances by john cage using radios? > the 1950's distorted electric guitars? > but you want an answer anyway, right?

all of those meet the criteria of being production techniques that utilize the asthetic of unintintional results in a musical way, so i guess that's our working definition. part of the reason that i asked the question is because "glitch" really is very difficult to define. you've given a good illustration for "glitch"s evolution. that's pretty cool. but with that, you've kinda negated your first sentence. and it seems the use of that technique is so pervasaive now in idm/ebm/blablabla, i'd almost call it a style, even though the fundaments could come from any of the previous linear progressions of music (genre). and with that, "glitch' could be genrefied as hiphop, ambient, soul, etc. etc. so i kinda understand why you think that evaluating musical styles as a linear process would be depreciated. but then again, if i played a slick rick track, then an edIT track, you would know the difference right away, yet still see the (linear?) progression.

quoted 1 line ok - the next big thing (but don't tell your friends) is "scramblism".

> ok - the next big thing (but don't tell your friends) is "scramblism".

well - we got to find the next next big thing then, 'cause prefuse73 has the '70's soul LP in a blender' thing on lock. ;) -shift8 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

the "glitch" sound seems ot be described right now as having that impression of what people would consider an "error" especially with music playback machines....like the pops, the feel of "skipping" because of sounds intentionally and unnaturally skipping, and so on. I suppose also the turntable sound taken to the extreme? one more thought though: what about that "grating" sound that you can get when you play really fast notes on the drums...if that's done really fast, it gives off the same kind of sound as sometimes how the music sounds when a computer freezes up wihle playing music. also, about kid 606...is he considered glitch? if so, why? a lot of music seems to utilize this stuff but I guess the main thing is using that in dominance. On 9/2/05, shift8 <shift8@digitrash.com> wrote:

quoted 40 lines i've missed it intentionally because thinking of developement of

> > i've missed it intentionally because thinking of developement of > > music styles as > > linear processes is deprecated and you didn't tell what you mean by glitch. > > the 1920's dadaist performances using defective gramophone players? > > the 1930's performances by john cage using radios? > > the 1950's distorted electric guitars? > > but you want an answer anyway, right? > > all of those meet the criteria of being production techniques that > utilize the asthetic of unintintional results in a musical way, so i > guess that's our working definition. > > part of the reason that i asked the question is because "glitch" really > is very difficult to define. you've given a good illustration for > "glitch"s evolution. that's pretty cool. but with that, you've kinda > negated your first sentence. > > and it seems the use of that technique is so pervasaive now in > idm/ebm/blablabla, i'd almost call it a style, even though the > fundaments could come from any of the previous linear progressions of > music (genre). and with that, "glitch' could be genrefied as hiphop, > ambient, soul, etc. etc. so i kinda understand why you think that > evaluating musical styles as a linear process would be depreciated. but > then again, if i played a slick rick track, then an edIT track, you > would know the difference right away, yet still see the (linear?) > progression. > > > ok - the next big thing (but don't tell your friends) is "scramblism". > > well - we got to find the next next big thing then, 'cause prefuse73 has > the '70's soul LP in a blender' thing on lock. ;) > > -shift8 > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > >

-- the rats and the children follow me out of town.....##@%& !$#^*the rats and the children follow me out of. town.... come on kids. Site: http://natewentbaka.ukepile.com/ AIM: summonillusion --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

Glitch the aesthetic celebration of beautiful mistakes thrown up in the process of recording or sound reproduction..... Little clicks and pops, skipping CD sounds (as pioneered by nobukazu takemura amongst others)...... The glitch artist becomes concerned with highlighting the beauty and organic/natural rhythmic possibilities of non-standard / overly corrected timing and generic sounds found in traditional dance music..... Audiobulb Records out often contains works by artists who might be described as post-glitch - in that we use sounds derived from the glitch aesthetic - in the context of other musical aesthetics - in a sense we have assimilated the glitch sound so that it is part of our sound aesthetic rather than all of it..... Here are two tracks from audiobulb that contain elements of the glitch sound - the first one is my work and illustrates the skipping CD effect used to form a disjointed and beautifully broken piece.... http://www.audiobulb.com/exhibition1/AudiobulbRecords-exhibition1-7-room-fascinating_facial_twitch.mp3 http://www.audiobulb.com/exhibition2/AudiobulbRecords-exhibition2-01-diagram_of_suburban_chaos-so_gone.mp3 David @ Audiobulb www.audiobulb.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "mantrakid" <mantrakid@neferiu.com> To: "Obed Vento" <ovento@keyleadsonline.com>; <idm@hyperreal.org> Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 5:24 PM Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch

quoted 66 lines Someone explain what glitch is first maybe?

> Someone explain what glitch is first maybe? > Im not sure that I truly know. > > nate schmold > www.neferiu.com > www.mantrakid.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: Obed Vento [mailto:ovento@keyleadsonline.com] > Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 10:12 AM > To: idm@hyperreal.org > Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch > > > ditto > > -----Original Message----- > From: Lee Stacey [mailto:lee@codeaudio.com] > Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 12:11 PM > To: idm@hyperreal.org > Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch > > Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies (sorry if > there were some, I must have missed them). > > I'm rather intrigued by this also. > > -----Original Message----- > From: shift8 [mailto:shift8@digitrash.com] > Sent: 28 August 2005 06:37 > To: idm@hyperreal.org > Subject: [idm] post glitch > > hi list - steming from a discussion elsewhere, someone asked "what's > post glitch" as a progression. obviously, most musical styles have a > precursor that's pretty easy to trace in the formation of the new style. > what's post glitch? do you have an example? how has glitch informed > this new style, and what distinguishes it as being post glitch, as > opposed to just glitch? > > just a ramble, > > shift8 > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > > > >

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Sorry folks - just read my first paragraph and sounded unclear - I mean't to say...... :) Glitch is an aesthetic celebration of the beautiful mistakes thrown up in the process of recording or sound reproduction..... Little clicks and pops, skipping CD sounds (as pioneered by nobukazu takemura amongst others)...... The glitch artist becomes concerned with highlighting the beauty and organic/natural rhythmic possibilities of non-standard timings and sounds. This is in contrast to the often overly corrected timing and generic sounds found in traditional dance music..... Audiobulb Records out often contains works by artists who might be described as post-glitch - in that we use sounds derived from the glitch aesthetic - in the context of other musical aesthetics - in a sense we have assimilated the glitch sound so that it is part of our sound aesthetic rather than all of it..... Here are two tracks from audiobulb that contain elements of the glitch sound - the first one is my work and illustrates the skipping CD effect used to form a disjointed and beautifully broken piece.... http://www.audiobulb.com/exhibition1/AudiobulbRecords-exhibition1-7-room-fascinating_facial_twitch.mp3 http://www.audiobulb.com/exhibition2/AudiobulbRecords-exhibition2-01-diagram_of_suburban_chaos-so_gone.mp3 David @ Audiobulb www.audiobulb.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "David @ Audiobulb" <dwnewman@clara.co.uk> To: "mantrakid" <mantrakid@neferiu.com>; "Obed Vento" <ovento@keyleadsonline.com>; <idm@hyperreal.org> Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 5:43 PM Subject: Re: [idm] post glitch

quoted 105 lines Glitch the aesthetic celebration of beautiful mistakes thrown up in the

> Glitch the aesthetic celebration of beautiful mistakes thrown up in the > process of recording or sound reproduction..... Little clicks and pops, > skipping CD sounds (as pioneered by nobukazu takemura amongst > others)...... The glitch artist becomes concerned with highlighting the > beauty and organic/natural rhythmic possibilities of non-standard / overly > corrected timing and generic sounds found in traditional dance music..... > > Audiobulb Records out often contains works by artists who might be > described as post-glitch - in that we use sounds derived from the glitch > aesthetic - in the context of other musical aesthetics - in a sense we > have assimilated the glitch sound so that it is part of our sound > aesthetic rather than all of it..... > > Here are two tracks from audiobulb that contain elements of the glitch > sound - the first one is my work and illustrates the skipping CD effect > used to form a disjointed and beautifully broken piece.... > > http://www.audiobulb.com/exhibition1/AudiobulbRecords-exhibition1-7-room-fascinating_facial_twitch.mp3 > > http://www.audiobulb.com/exhibition2/AudiobulbRecords-exhibition2-01-diagram_of_suburban_chaos-so_gone.mp3 > > David @ Audiobulb > www.audiobulb.com > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "mantrakid" <mantrakid@neferiu.com> > To: "Obed Vento" <ovento@keyleadsonline.com>; <idm@hyperreal.org> > Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 5:24 PM > Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch > > >> Someone explain what glitch is first maybe? >> Im not sure that I truly know. >> >> nate schmold >> www.neferiu.com >> www.mantrakid.com >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Obed Vento [mailto:ovento@keyleadsonline.com] >> Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 10:12 AM >> To: idm@hyperreal.org >> Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch >> >> >> ditto >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Lee Stacey [mailto:lee@codeaudio.com] >> Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 12:11 PM >> To: idm@hyperreal.org >> Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch >> >> Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies (sorry if >> there were some, I must have missed them). >> >> I'm rather intrigued by this also. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: shift8 [mailto:shift8@digitrash.com] >> Sent: 28 August 2005 06:37 >> To: idm@hyperreal.org >> Subject: [idm] post glitch >> >> hi list - steming from a discussion elsewhere, someone asked "what's >> post glitch" as a progression. obviously, most musical styles have a >> precursor that's pretty easy to trace in the formation of the new style. >> what's post glitch? do you have an example? how has glitch informed >> this new style, and what distinguishes it as being post glitch, as >> opposed to just glitch? >> >> just a ramble, >> >> shift8 >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >> >> >> >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > > > >

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I'm sure the next big thing will be "Organica" (assuming some student paper hasn't coined the phrase already). This is performed live by nature its self and is only performed and never recorded. I'm telling you, it's already everywhere but it's always flown below the radar of pop culture. <>< Pilchard <>< Tunes by Pilchard: http://pilchard.org/ -----Original Message----- From: sven [mailto:ml.sven@subscience.de] Sent: 02 September 2005 18:13 To: lee@codeaudio.com; idm@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch At 18:11 02.09.2005, Lee Stacey wrote:

quoted 2 lines Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies (sorry if

>Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies (sorry if >there were some, I must have missed them).

i've missed it intentionally because thinking of developement of music styles as linear processes is deprecated and you didn't tell what you mean by glitch. the 1920's dadaist performances using defective gramophone players? the 1930's performances by john cage using radios? the 1950's distorted electric guitars? but you want an answer anyway, right? ok - the next big thing (but don't tell your friends) is "scramblism". sven. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

Erm, John Cage? Anyway, here's my $0.02: We might benefit from separating glitch into a few interlocking aspects: practice, aesthetic and interpretation. Thus, Practice: the use of technological failures and (sometimes) unintentional mistakes for productive/creative purposes. Aesthetic: the valorization of art objects that display/perform their own breakdown. Interpretation: an approach to art objects that seeks out and prioritizes moments of technological failure. With a multi-part definition like this, you can adapt it to fit a wider range of styles as "glitch" in some way. For example, you could argue that mannerist madrigal composer Carlo Gesualdo (1561-1613) produced "glitch" in that his music pushed his modal/ tonal systems to the point of breakdown. Can you tell I'm studying for my comprehensives? LMG Chi-town. On Sep 3, 2005, at 8:20 AM, Lee Stacey wrote:

quoted 48 lines I'm sure the next big thing will be "Organica" (assuming some student

> > I'm sure the next big thing will be "Organica" (assuming some student > paper hasn't coined the phrase already). This is performed live by > nature its self and is only performed and never recorded. > > I'm telling you, it's already everywhere but it's always flown > below the > radar of pop culture. > > <>< Pilchard <>< > Tunes by Pilchard: > http://pilchard.org/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: sven [mailto:ml.sven@subscience.de] > Sent: 02 September 2005 18:13 > To: lee@codeaudio.com; idm@hyperreal.org > Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch > > At 18:11 02.09.2005, Lee Stacey wrote: > >> Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies (sorry if >> there were some, I must have missed them). >> > > i've missed it intentionally because thinking of developement of > music styles as > linear processes is deprecated and you didn't tell what you mean by > glitch. > the 1920's dadaist performances using defective gramophone players? > the 1930's performances by john cage using radios? > the 1950's distorted electric guitars? > but you want an answer anyway, right? > ok - the next big thing (but don't tell your friends) is "scramblism". > > sven. > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > >

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So would we wouldn't group 'computer generated music' into the category as well then? This defeintion seems to exclude that group of music which typically seems to be classified as glitch - even though it is deinetly produced without failures.

quoted 2 lines Interpretation: an approach to art objects that seeks out and

> Interpretation: an approach to art objects that seeks out and > prioritizes moments of technological failure.

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I think that's what makes glitch doesn't exclude 'computer generated music', but instead highlights a sub-group of it. "Glitch" has often been used interchangeably with "post-digital" (although I don't they they're perfectly equivalent), which suggests to me that glitch isn't just about technology, but about a particular attitude towards technology that at once glorifies it and ironizes it. In other words, glitch seems to be what happens when the "honeymoon" with technological perfection passes: rather than reject technology as "empty" or "false" perfection, glitch put the whole notion of audio perfection into question. back to making prickly pear sorbet, LMG On Sep 3, 2005, at 7:28 PM, pulse wrote:

quoted 19 lines So would we wouldn't group 'computer generated music' into the

> So would we wouldn't group 'computer generated music' into the > category as well then? This defeintion seems to exclude that group > of music which typically seems to be classified as glitch - even > though it is deinetly produced without failures. > > >> Interpretation: an approach to art objects that seeks out and >> prioritizes moments of technological failure. >> > > -- > s. > http://www.ArcTone.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > >

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Good observations. For those who haven't seen it, Kim Cascone wrote a kind of overview of the area (in 2000) in terms of 'the aesthetics of failure'. Useful article here:- <http://mitpress.mit.edu/journals/COMJ/CMJ24_4Cascone.pdf> alan --On 03 September 2005 19:53 -0500 Luis-Manuel Garcia <lgarcia@uchicago.edu> wrote:

quoted 41 lines I think that's what makes glitch doesn't exclude 'computer generated

> I think that's what makes glitch doesn't exclude 'computer generated > music', but instead highlights a sub-group of it. "Glitch" has often > been used interchangeably with "post-digital" (although I don't they > they're perfectly equivalent), which suggests to me that glitch isn't > just about technology, but about a particular attitude towards > technology that at once glorifies it and ironizes it. In other words, > glitch seems to be what happens when the "honeymoon" with technological > perfection passes: rather than reject technology as "empty" or "false" > perfection, glitch put the whole notion of audio perfection into > question. > > back to making prickly pear sorbet, > LMG > > On Sep 3, 2005, at 7:28 PM, pulse wrote: > >> So would we wouldn't group 'computer generated music' into the >> category as well then? This defeintion seems to exclude that group >> of music which typically seems to be classified as glitch - even >> though it is deinetly produced without failures. >> >> >>> Interpretation: an approach to art objects that seeks out and >>> prioritizes moments of technological failure. >>> >> >> -- >> s. >> http://www.ArcTone.com >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >> >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >

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I for sure never thought that I would see the name Carlo Gesualdo mentioned on the idml. Very good analysis also. I especially like that in your breakdown "glitch" isn't relegated into the category of "computer music". It illustrates that glitch really is just "the valorization of art objects that display/perform their own breakdown." Would Cage be glitch then also (when he's not performing organica), his prepared piano was essentially a series of intentional mistakes, that was used to "seek out and prioritize moments of technological failure." Will there ever again be a musical form that is truly new? Mark also in Chi-tilla On Saturday, September 3, 2005, at 05:31 PM, Luis-Manuel Garcia wrote:

quoted 85 lines Erm, John Cage?

> Erm, John Cage? > > Anyway, here's my $0.02: > > We might benefit from separating glitch into a few interlocking > aspects: practice, aesthetic and interpretation. > Thus, > > Practice: the use of technological failures and (sometimes) > unintentional mistakes for productive/creative purposes. > > Aesthetic: the valorization of art objects that display/perform their > own breakdown. > > Interpretation: an approach to art objects that seeks out and > prioritizes moments of technological failure. > > With a multi-part definition like this, you can adapt it to fit a > wider range of styles as "glitch" in some way. For example, you could > argue that mannerist madrigal composer Carlo Gesualdo (1561-1613) > produced "glitch" in that his music pushed his modal/tonal systems to > the point of breakdown. > > Can you tell I'm studying for my comprehensives? > > LMG > Chi-town. > > On Sep 3, 2005, at 8:20 AM, Lee Stacey wrote: > >> >> I'm sure the next big thing will be "Organica" (assuming some student >> paper hasn't coined the phrase already). This is performed live by >> nature its self and is only performed and never recorded. >> >> I'm telling you, it's already everywhere but it's always flown below >> the >> radar of pop culture. >> >> <>< Pilchard <>< >> Tunes by Pilchard: >> http://pilchard.org/ >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: sven [mailto:ml.sven@subscience.de] >> Sent: 02 September 2005 18:13 >> To: lee@codeaudio.com; idm@hyperreal.org >> Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch >> >> At 18:11 02.09.2005, Lee Stacey wrote: >> >>> Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies (sorry if >>> there were some, I must have missed them). >>> >> >> i've missed it intentionally because thinking of developement of >> music styles as >> linear processes is deprecated and you didn't tell what you mean by >> glitch. >> the 1920's dadaist performances using defective gramophone players? >> the 1930's performances by john cage using radios? >> the 1950's distorted electric guitars? >> but you want an answer anyway, right? >> ok - the next big thing (but don't tell your friends) is "scramblism". >> >> sven. >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >> >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > >

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Thanks. Gesualdo is surprisingly useful as an example of, well, everything in musical thought. Quite the nutjob, that fellow. Anyway, I could definitely see Cage as performing "glitch" in some of his work, although I'm sure he would've used different terminology. In a sense, a lot of his work performs the breakdown of the concept of music entirely. Luis Chi-ton On Sep 5, 2005, at 3:14 AM, Mark wrote:

quoted 114 lines I for sure never thought that I would see the name Carlo Gesualdo

> I for sure never thought that I would see the name Carlo Gesualdo > mentioned on the idml. Very good analysis also. I especially like > that in your breakdown "glitch" isn't relegated into the category > of "computer music". It illustrates that glitch really is just > "the valorization of art objects that display/perform their own > breakdown." Would Cage be glitch then also (when he's not > performing organica), his prepared piano was essentially a series > of intentional mistakes, that was used to "seek out and prioritize > moments of technological failure." Will there ever again be a > musical form that is truly new? > Mark > also in Chi-tilla > > On Saturday, September 3, 2005, at 05:31 PM, Luis-Manuel Garcia > wrote: > > >> Erm, John Cage? >> >> Anyway, here's my $0.02: >> >> We might benefit from separating glitch into a few interlocking >> aspects: practice, aesthetic and interpretation. >> Thus, >> >> Practice: the use of technological failures and (sometimes) >> unintentional mistakes for productive/creative purposes. >> >> Aesthetic: the valorization of art objects that display/perform >> their own breakdown. >> >> Interpretation: an approach to art objects that seeks out and >> prioritizes moments of technological failure. >> >> With a multi-part definition like this, you can adapt it to fit a >> wider range of styles as "glitch" in some way. For example, you >> could argue that mannerist madrigal composer Carlo Gesualdo >> (1561-1613) produced "glitch" in that his music pushed his modal/ >> tonal systems to the point of breakdown. >> >> Can you tell I'm studying for my comprehensives? >> >> LMG >> Chi-town. >> >> On Sep 3, 2005, at 8:20 AM, Lee Stacey wrote: >> >> >>> >>> I'm sure the next big thing will be "Organica" (assuming some >>> student >>> paper hasn't coined the phrase already). This is performed live by >>> nature its self and is only performed and never recorded. >>> >>> I'm telling you, it's already everywhere but it's always flown >>> below the >>> radar of pop culture. >>> >>> <>< Pilchard <>< >>> Tunes by Pilchard: >>> http://pilchard.org/ >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: sven [mailto:ml.sven@subscience.de] >>> Sent: 02 September 2005 18:13 >>> To: lee@codeaudio.com; idm@hyperreal.org >>> Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch >>> >>> At 18:11 02.09.2005, Lee Stacey wrote: >>> >>> >>>> Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies >>>> (sorry if >>>> there were some, I must have missed them). >>>> >>>> >>> >>> i've missed it intentionally because thinking of developement of >>> music styles as >>> linear processes is deprecated and you didn't tell what you mean by >>> glitch. >>> the 1920's dadaist performances using defective gramophone players? >>> the 1930's performances by john cage using radios? >>> the 1950's distorted electric guitars? >>> but you want an answer anyway, right? >>> ok - the next big thing (but don't tell your friends) is >>> "scramblism". >>> >>> sven. >>> >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> - >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >>> For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >>> >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> - >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >>> For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >> >> >> > >

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Its been done - maybe by andrea polli ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lee Stacey" <lee@codeaudio.com> To: <idm@hyperreal.org> Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2005 2:20 PM Subject: Re: [idm] post glitch

quoted 47 lines I'm sure the next big thing will be "Organica" (assuming some student

> > I'm sure the next big thing will be "Organica" (assuming some student > paper hasn't coined the phrase already). This is performed live by > nature its self and is only performed and never recorded. > > I'm telling you, it's already everywhere but it's always flown below the > radar of pop culture. > > <>< Pilchard <>< > Tunes by Pilchard: > http://pilchard.org/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: sven [mailto:ml.sven@subscience.de] > Sent: 02 September 2005 18:13 > To: lee@codeaudio.com; idm@hyperreal.org > Subject: RE: [idm] post glitch > > At 18:11 02.09.2005, Lee Stacey wrote: >>Pushing this one up again because I didn't see any replies (sorry if >>there were some, I must have missed them). > > i've missed it intentionally because thinking of developement of > music styles as > linear processes is deprecated and you didn't tell what you mean by > glitch. > the 1920's dadaist performances using defective gramophone players? > the 1930's performances by john cage using radios? > the 1950's distorted electric guitars? > but you want an answer anyway, right? > ok - the next big thing (but don't tell your friends) is "scramblism". > > sven. > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > > > >

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quoted 2 lines Practice: the use of technological failures and (sometimes)

> Practice: the use of technological failures and (sometimes) > unintentional mistakes for productive/creative purposes.

It's quite interesting the way that movements in art / movements start off with a theoretical basis which then turns into an aesthtic one - five years ago, maybe, glitch was all about technological failures and mistakes, but these days a lot of music that you'd call glitch that just uses clicks pops and skips as another set of sonic options alongside beats and bleeps. Sort of like the way John Adams and Michael Nyman took the repetition element of minimalism as a way to make interesting but conventional music, without adopting the whole Lamonte Young philosophy. David -- "And then what do they do?" "Er, quadratic equations mostly, sir. Fiendishly difficult ones by all accounts." This message has been checked for viruses but the contents of an attachment may still contain software viruses, which could damage your computer system: you are advised to perform your own checks. Email communications with the University of Nottingham may be monitored as permitted by UK legislation. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org