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Re: [idm] cog606

24 messages · 16 participants · spans 3 days · search this subject
◇ merged from 2 subjects: cog606 · the honour system
2000-06-04 22:48Rjyan Kidwell Re: [idm] cog606
2000-06-05 12:50Alex Reynolds [idm] the honour system
├─ 2000-06-05 14:46zimbette Re: [idm] the honour system
│ └─ 2000-06-05 17:24[idm] cog606
└─ 2000-06-05 17:25Brian MacDonald Re: [idm] the honour system
2000-06-05 22:05component Re: [idm] cog606
└─ 2000-06-05 22:11zimbette Re: [idm] cog606
└─ 2000-06-05 22:22Brian MacDonald Re: [idm] cog606
2000-06-05 22:56Ron Jeremy Re: [idm] cog606
2000-06-06 01:07Christophe McKeon Re: [idm] cog606
└─ 2000-06-06 18:15Re: [idm] cog606
2000-06-06 18:27F I Re: [idm] cog606
2000-06-06 18:45Christophe McKeon Re: [idm] cog606
└─ 2000-06-06 20:26Re: [idm] cog606
└─ 2000-06-06 21:45zimbette Re: [idm] cog606
2000-06-06 20:46Bill Wright Re: [idm] cog606
└─ 2000-06-06 21:08Josh Davison Re: [idm] cog606
2000-06-06 21:14Ron Jeremy Re: [idm] cog606
2000-06-06 23:21rob salls Re: [idm] cog606
2000-06-07 00:45Steve Oliver Re: [idm] cog606
2000-06-07 16:38rj Re: [idm] cog606
2000-06-07 17:31Rjyan Kidwell Re: [idm] cog606
2000-06-07 17:56Ernesto Ikerd Re: [idm] cog606
2000-06-07 18:53Scott McKeating Re: [idm] cog606
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2000-06-04 22:48Rjyan Kidwell> It really does all boil down to opinion, and in MY opinion the attention > to Kid 606 is
From:
Rjyan Kidwell
To:
component ,
Date:
Sun, 04 Jun 2000 18:48:50 -0400
Subject:
Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <001001bfce77$0f3c3fa0$6725dc80@RES.JHU.EDU>
quoted 2 lines It really does all boil down to opinion, and in MY opinion the attention> It really does all boil down to opinion, and in MY opinion the attention > to Kid 606 isn't warranted.
how many other artists out there now have the breadth of 606? hardly any. maybe the press finds it remarkable that rather than find a pigeonhole and squat in it like most producers, he's making sounds that register all over the map. ALL over the map. and i think it's actually pretty RARE that someone on IDM-list praises 606, save for the wise vangaurds like Lance, Andrew Duke, and etc. it's actually the electronic music press that's picking up on him, in particular mags like the Wire. ie: folks that don't really care about 'IDM.' many people on this list seem to be under the mistaken impression that everything 606 has put out is "gabber" or "noise." these people have obviously only heard a smidgeon of his lengthy discography, and need to get informed before they start generalizing about 606 records. -rk --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-05 12:50Alex Reynolds>Date: Sat, 3 Jun 2000 15:13:28 -0700 (PDT) >From: zimbette <tofu@uci.edu> >Subject: Re: [
From:
Alex Reynolds
To:
Date:
Mon, 5 Jun 2000 08:50:29 -0400
Subject:
[idm] the honour system
permalink · <l0313031fb5614f70e97b@[130.91.128.171]>
quoted 11 lines Date: Sat, 3 Jun 2000 15:13:28 -0700 (PDT)>Date: Sat, 3 Jun 2000 15:13:28 -0700 (PDT) >From: zimbette <tofu@uci.edu> >Subject: Re: [idm] kid606 and such. > >what, so people like myself who like a band are just part of a undesereved >hype machine unless its something you like, in which case it is hype that >is deserved? > >thats silly. > >what makes something hype? and what makes it "deserved"?
tofu, undeserved hype is when you (generic listener, reviewer, etc.) unapologetically promote a release or artist, when in your heart of hearts you know you shouldn't. deserved hype is when you unapologetically promote a release or artist, when you know that a work is so vital it should be heard by as many people as possible. where kid606 (or any artist) fits in this spectrum is up to you, the individual, but keep in mind that the distributed, decentralized format for this list means that we're all on the honour system: any time we cheer on a lemon, it unnecessarily drives another nail into the idm coffin, in the eyes of someone new to this art form. on the other hand, any time we back a winner we get to feel like we're on the cutting edge. i find that an honest balance of critical and positive interpretation works for me. -a. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-05 14:46zimbettei agree, except that i find it absurd when people like something that is a little off the
From:
zimbette
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Alex Reynolds
Cc:
Date:
Mon, 5 Jun 2000 07:46:17 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
Re: [idm] the honour system
Reply to:
[idm] the honour system
permalink · <Pine.SOL.4.05.10006050741440.4493-100000@e4e.oac.uci.edu>
i agree, except that i find it absurd when people like something that is a little off the norm, people refer to it as "hype". im really curious about this kid606 vs hype thing that the fellow from component records commented on because i personally do not see it.. yes, the kid is getting more attention, but none of it seems to be overly "hyped." maybe i missed the rave reviews and the "you must buy this" and the "he schools autechre" -- but really, all i have seen is a grip of idm kids, a few gabber kids and some folks who seem to like neither respond to his work. chris On Mon, 5 Jun 2000, Alex Reynolds wrote:
quoted 38 lines Date: Sat, 3 Jun 2000 15:13:28 -0700 (PDT)> >Date: Sat, 3 Jun 2000 15:13:28 -0700 (PDT) > >From: zimbette <tofu@uci.edu> > >Subject: Re: [idm] kid606 and such. > > > >what, so people like myself who like a band are just part of a undesereved > >hype machine unless its something you like, in which case it is hype that > >is deserved? > > > >thats silly. > > > >what makes something hype? and what makes it "deserved"? > > tofu, > > undeserved hype is when you (generic listener, reviewer, etc.) > unapologetically promote a release or artist, when in your heart of hearts > you know you shouldn't. > > deserved hype is when you unapologetically promote a release or artist, > when you know that a work is so vital it should be heard by as many people > as possible. > > where kid606 (or any artist) fits in this spectrum is up to you, the > individual, but keep in mind that the distributed, decentralized format for > this list means that we're all on the honour system: any time we cheer on a > lemon, it unnecessarily drives another nail into the idm coffin, in the > eyes of someone new to this art form. on the other hand, any time we back a > winner we get to feel like we're on the cutting edge. i find that an honest > balance of critical and positive interpretation works for me. > > -a. > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >
it.s ok to like noise it.s okay to like house it.s okay to like pop "nothing but respect to hello kitty" _we are all lost --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-05 17:24anything@synthesizer.org>i agree, except that i find it absurd when people like something that is a >little off th
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Mon, 5 Jun 2000 10:24:23 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
[idm] cog606
Reply to:
Re: [idm] the honour system
permalink · <Pine.BSF.4.21.0006051005130.16175-100000@shell3.ba.best.com>
quoted 2 lines i agree, except that i find it absurd when people like something that is a>i agree, except that i find it absurd when people like something that is a >little off the norm, people refer to it as "hype".
It's a judgment call, though. It's when "a little off the norm" is the _only requirement_ for something to be described as "worth buying" or "on my top-10 of the year for sure" that the hype shines through as someone talking about an object to be owned and displayed on a mantle/year-end email. A lot of times these are the releases that generate the most controversy on the list: since nobody describes Kid606's music in a meaningful way, the only way to talk about him are these sidetracks into arguments about the color scheme of the vinyl record (for instance).
quoted 4 lines im really curious about this kid606 vs hype thing that the fellow from>im really curious about this kid606 vs hype thing that the fellow from >component records commented on because i personally do not see it.. >yes, the kid is getting more attention, but none of it seems to be overly >"hyped."
"overly?" http://www.apple.com/creative/music/kid606/ -- http://www.synthesizer.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-05 17:25Brian MacDonaldOn Mon, 5 Jun 2000, Alex Reynolds wrote: > tofu, > > undeserved hype is when you (generic
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Brian MacDonald
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Mon, 5 Jun 2000 10:25:01 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
Re: [idm] the honour system
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[idm] the honour system
permalink · <Pine.GSO.3.96.1000605101948.19021E-100000@falco.kuci.uci.edu>
On Mon, 5 Jun 2000, Alex Reynolds wrote:
quoted 9 lines tofu,> tofu, > > undeserved hype is when you (generic listener, reviewer, etc.) > unapologetically promote a release or artist, when in your heart of hearts > you know you shouldn't. > > deserved hype is when you unapologetically promote a release or artist, > when you know that a work is so vital it should be heard by as many people > as possible.
So for the third time, you're basically saying "If I like it, only then does it deserve hype." --- PLEASE REMOVE CARD AND TRY AGAIN --- BIDDY BIDDY BIDDY ---
quoted 8 lines where kid606 (or any artist) fits in this spectrum is up to you, the> where kid606 (or any artist) fits in this spectrum is up to you, the > individual, but keep in mind that the distributed, decentralized format > for this list means that we're all on the honour system: any time we > cheer on a lemon, it unnecessarily drives another nail into the idm > coffin, in the eyes of someone new to this art form. on the other hand, > any time we back a winner we get to feel like we're on the cutting edge. > i find that an honest balance of critical and positive interpretation > works for me.
--- WE ARE ALL WINNERS --- BIDDY BIDDY BIDDY --- ======================================================================= Brian MacDonald <brianm@kuci.org> KUCI 88.9 fM in Irvine, CA -- Orange County ======================================================================= --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-05 22:05componentThe link on the apple site is a prime example of what I'm talking about. I also remember r
From:
component
To:
,
Date:
Mon, 5 Jun 2000 18:05:21 -0400
Subject:
Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <00f301bfcf3a$25682be0$bcbfdfcf@oemcomputer>
The link on the apple site is a prime example of what I'm talking about. I also remember reading in mixer(I think) that Kid606 was a Cali- Aphex Triplet Phenomenon......is that not hype ? Furthermore, to say that its just because it's outside the norm, I'm refering to it as 'hype' is way off base. I listen to alot of out there music and I think alot of it deserves alot more attention than its getting. It bothers me to see stuff like 606 getting mad press and being described as cutting edge. It really does all boil down to opinion, and in MY opinion the attention to Kid 606 isn't warranted. Rob component records www.mindstorm.com/component ----- Original Message ----- From: <anything@synthesizer.org> To: <idm@hyperreal.org> Sent: Monday, June 05, 2000 1:24 PM Subject: [idm] cog606
quoted 1 line i agree, except that i find it absurd when people like something that is> >i agree, except that i find it absurd when people like something that is
a
quoted 28 lines little off the norm, people refer to it as "hype".> >little off the norm, people refer to it as "hype". > > It's a judgment call, though. It's when "a little off the norm" is the > _only requirement_ for something to be described as "worth buying" or "on > my top-10 of the year for sure" that the hype shines through as someone > talking about an object to be owned and displayed on a mantle/year-end > email. A lot of times these are the releases that generate the most > controversy on the list: since nobody describes Kid606's music in a > meaningful way, the only way to talk about him are these sidetracks into > arguments about the color scheme of the vinyl record (for instance). > > >im really curious about this kid606 vs hype thing that the fellow from > >component records commented on because i personally do not see it.. > >yes, the kid is getting more attention, but none of it seems to be overly > >"hyped." > > "overly?" > > http://www.apple.com/creative/music/kid606/ > > -- > http://www.synthesizer.org > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >
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2000-06-05 22:11zimbetteThat's what i was wondering about. Thanks for answering my question :) I think its great t
From:
zimbette
To:
component
Cc:
,
Date:
Mon, 5 Jun 2000 15:11:52 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
Re: [idm] cog606
Reply to:
Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <Pine.SOL.4.05.10006051510050.16718-100000@e4e.oac.uci.edu>
That's what i was wondering about. Thanks for answering my question :) I think its great that any of this music is getting attention, especially the more "noisey" stuff -- but thats just me.. and i dont run a record label :) chris. On Mon, 5 Jun 2000, component wrote:
quoted 5 lines It really does all boil down to opinion, and in MY opinion the attention> It really does all boil down to opinion, and in MY opinion the attention > to Kid 606 isn't warranted. > > Rob > component records
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2000-06-05 22:22Brian MacDonald> On Mon, 5 Jun 2000, component wrote: > > > It really does all boil down to opinion, and
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Brian MacDonald
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Mon, 5 Jun 2000 15:22:16 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
Re: [idm] cog606
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Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <Pine.GSO.3.96.1000605151826.25856D-100000@falco.kuci.uci.edu>
quoted 7 lines On Mon, 5 Jun 2000, component wrote:> On Mon, 5 Jun 2000, component wrote: > > > It really does all boil down to opinion, and in MY opinion the attention > > to Kid 606 isn't warranted. > > > > Rob > > component records
Everything affects everything. Some butterflies trigger hurricanes. Some butterflies trigger an occasional marine layer. Some butterflies get eaten by birds. Some butterflies have all the luck. Some butterflied have all the fame. But the only thing these butterflies ever wanted was some goddamned nectar. ======================================================================= Brian MacDonald <brianm@kuci.org> KUCI 88.9 fM in Irvine, CA -- Orange County ======================================================================= --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-05 22:56Ron Jeremy>From: Rjyan Kidwell <cex@tigerbeat6.com> >how many other artists out there now have the b
From:
Ron Jeremy
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, ,
Date:
Mon, 05 Jun 2000 15:56:56 PDT
Subject:
Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <20000605225656.37053.qmail@hotmail.com>
quoted 2 lines From: Rjyan Kidwell <cex@tigerbeat6.com>>From: Rjyan Kidwell <cex@tigerbeat6.com> >how many other artists out there now have the breadth of 606?
Who cares?
quoted 4 lines hardly any.>hardly any. >maybe the press finds it remarkable that rather than find a pigeonhole and >squat in it like most producers, he's making sounds that register all over >the map. ALL over the map.
The same press would also be reviewing to people like Panacea and ATR, doesn't mean it's unique or good in any way. If some artists were to get a lot of reviews in magazines, it makes me more skeptical of how good it is. Actually that depends on the zine really. Some magazines review good stuff, others review a lot of the crap in certain genres.
quoted 1 line and i think it's actually pretty RARE that someone on IDM-list praises 606,>and i think it's actually pretty RARE that someone on IDM-list praises 606,
He gets mentioned a little more often than you would expect, considering he sucks!
quoted 4 lines save for the wise vangaurds like Lance, Andrew Duke, and etc. it's actually>save for the wise vangaurds like Lance, Andrew Duke, and etc. it's actually >the electronic music press that's picking up on him, in particular mags >like >the Wire. ie: folks that don't really care about 'IDM.'
I thought Wire did review a lot of IDM stuff.
quoted 4 lines many people on this list seem to be under the mistaken impression that>many people on this list seem to be under the mistaken impression that >everything 606 has put out is "gabber" or "noise." these people have >obviously only heard a smidgeon of his lengthy discography, and need to get >informed before they start generalizing about 606 records.
True, I haven't heard everything. Why continue to dig when most of it has been sewage? Haven't got that kind of time to waste on such talentless artists! ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-06 01:07Christophe McKeonThe Kid has done some incredible things, and some things that belong in the garbage pail.
From:
Christophe McKeon
To:
Ron Jeremy
Cc:
, ,
Date:
Mon, 05 Jun 2000 21:07:08 -0400
Subject:
Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <393C4EBB.CEB44BAB@rcn.com>
The Kid has done some incredible things, and some things that belong in the garbage pail. Kind of like Ae, Picasso, Hemingway etc. etc. At least he's pushing envelopes, and not just DSP envelopes. Maybe he doesn't belong on this list, but that might just be to his credit. Regards, Christophe Ron Jeremy wrote:
quoted 43 lines From: Rjyan Kidwell <cex@tigerbeat6.com>> >From: Rjyan Kidwell <cex@tigerbeat6.com> > >how many other artists out there now have the breadth of 606? > > Who cares? > > >hardly any. > >maybe the press finds it remarkable that rather than find a pigeonhole and > >squat in it like most producers, he's making sounds that register all over > >the map. ALL over the map. > > The same press would also be reviewing to people like Panacea and ATR, > doesn't mean it's unique or good in any way. If some artists were to get a > lot of reviews in magazines, it makes me more skeptical of how good it is. > Actually that depends on the zine really. Some magazines review good stuff, > others review a lot of the crap in certain genres. > > >and i think it's actually pretty RARE that someone on IDM-list praises 606, > > He gets mentioned a little more often than you would expect, considering he > sucks! > > >save for the wise vangaurds like Lance, Andrew Duke, and etc. it's actually > >the electronic music press that's picking up on him, in particular mags > >like > >the Wire. ie: folks that don't really care about 'IDM.' > > I thought Wire did review a lot of IDM stuff. > > >many people on this list seem to be under the mistaken impression that > >everything 606 has put out is "gabber" or "noise." these people have > >obviously only heard a smidgeon of his lengthy discography, and need to get > >informed before they start generalizing about 606 records. > > True, I haven't heard everything. Why continue to dig when most of it has > been sewage? Haven't got that kind of time to waste on such talentless > artists! > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
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2000-06-06 18:15anything@synthesizer.org>The Kid has done some incredible things, and some things that belong in the >garbage pail
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Tue, 6 Jun 2000 11:15:16 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
Re: [idm] cog606
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Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <Pine.BSF.4.21.0006061103380.16175-100000@shell3.ba.best.com>
quoted 3 lines The Kid has done some incredible things, and some things that belong in the>The Kid has done some incredible things, and some things that belong in the >garbage pail. Kind of like Ae, Picasso, Hemingway etc. etc. At least he's >pushing envelopes, and not just DSP envelopes.
Thanks for bringing this thread full-circle with a choice selection of unsubstantiated connections, or "hype." Isn't the original poster's earnest question of "what makes him so great" asking for exactly this kind of information? Are the curious ones too clueless and best left that way? Is it impossible to place Kid606 in the company of "acknowledged talents" if pressed for details? -- http://www.synthesizer.org/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-06 18:27F IAnd ask yourself this: If it's Kid606 music selling Kid606 records, why is the opening, dr
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F I
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,
Date:
Tue, 06 Jun 2000 18:27:34 GMT
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Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <20000606182734.43599.qmail@hotmail.com>
And ask yourself this: If it's Kid606 music selling Kid606 records, why is the opening, draw-you-in, make-you-glad-you-bought-it, track on the "20,000 presales" Kid606 Ipecac release---the very first track on the record--why is it by someone else? Why isn't it a Kid606 track?
quoted 26 lines From: anything@synthesizer.org>From: anything@synthesizer.org >To: idm@hyperreal.org >Subject: Re: [idm] cog606 >Date: Tue, 6 Jun 2000 11:15:16 -0700 (PDT) > > >The Kid has done some incredible things, and some things that belong in >the > >garbage pail. Kind of like Ae, Picasso, Hemingway etc. etc. At least he's > >pushing envelopes, and not just DSP envelopes. > >Thanks for bringing this thread full-circle with a choice selection of >unsubstantiated connections, or "hype." Isn't the original poster's >earnest question of "what makes him so great" asking for exactly this kind >of information? Are the curious ones too clueless and best left that way? >Is it impossible to place Kid606 in the company of "acknowledged talents" >if pressed for details? > >-- >http://www.synthesizer.org/ > > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >
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2000-06-06 18:45Christophe McKeonIt's not about "hype". Who gives a fuck about hype. I don't care if Kid 606 gets thrown on
From:
Christophe McKeon
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Cc:
Date:
Tue, 06 Jun 2000 14:45:47 -0400
Subject:
Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <393D46D9.6A6BC2A2@rcn.com>
It's not about "hype". Who gives a fuck about hype. I don't care if Kid 606 gets thrown on the cover of 'Time' bloody magazine. Who cares. My point was that he is making some interesting stuff, and if some of his tracks are duds then that is quite to be expected from somebody willing to go out on a limb with his music. If you or anybody else thinks he sucks, then just don't listen to him. It's that simple. The curious or clueless are none of my concern either. If they listen to music because of hype then that is their own sorry affair isn't it. Fuck the media, the clueless, the hysterical whiners, and let the music 'speak' for itself. I for one trust only my ears, never a single review positive or negative. They are really quite useless, like the Koran translated into Swedish - you never really 'hear' it. Cheers, Christophe P.S. I don't think your last sentence makes any sense, or is it just me? anything@synthesizer.org wrote:
quoted 17 lines The Kid has done some incredible things, and some things that belong in the> >The Kid has done some incredible things, and some things that belong in the > >garbage pail. Kind of like Ae, Picasso, Hemingway etc. etc. At least he's > >pushing envelopes, and not just DSP envelopes. > > Thanks for bringing this thread full-circle with a choice selection of > unsubstantiated connections, or "hype." Isn't the original poster's > earnest question of "what makes him so great" asking for exactly this kind > of information? Are the curious ones too clueless and best left that way? > Is it impossible to place Kid606 in the company of "acknowledged talents" > if pressed for details? > > -- > http://www.synthesizer.org/ > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
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2000-06-06 20:26anything@synthesizer.org>It's not about "hype". Who gives a fuck about hype. I don't care if Kid 606 >gets thrown
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Tue, 6 Jun 2000 13:26:06 -0700 (PDT)
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Re: [idm] cog606
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Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <Pine.BSF.4.21.0006061323320.16175-100000@shell3.ba.best.com>
quoted 11 lines It's not about "hype". Who gives a fuck about hype. I don't care if Ki>It's not about "hype". Who gives a fuck about hype. I don't care if Kid 606 >gets thrown on the cover of 'Time' bloody magazine. Who cares. My point was >that he is making some interesting stuff, and if some of his tracks are duds >then that is quite to be expected from somebody willing to go out on a limb >with his music. If you or anybody else thinks he sucks, then just don't listen >to him. It's that simple. The curious or clueless are none of my concern >either. If they listen to music because of hype then that is their own sorry >affair isn't it. Fuck the media, the clueless, the hysterical whiners, and let >the music 'speak' for itself. I for one trust only my ears, never a single >review positive or negative. They are really quite useless, like the Koran >translated into Swedish - you never really 'hear' it.
Ah, nihilism. The thread is about the qualities that Kid606 exhibits, "why" he's good, rather than "whether" or not he's good. If you're willing to put the best of his work up against Hemingway and Picasso as having similar benefits to those who put up with his lamer tracks, then why not go into a little bit of detail about that, since that's what the original poster is asking for? You might as well say that like someone suffering from Alzheimer's, they have their good days and their bad days. Music never "speaks for itself," it speaks to you and your sense of "good." It's an expression of a person using things like "sounds" and "timing" and "pitch" - among other things - to create an object for contemplation, for deciding if you'd like to spend more time with it. The original poster is only asking why people decide to spend time with Kid606's expressions, as well as spend more money on them. It's quite unrealistic to say that a piece of music (or a person's entire pantheon of expression) says the exact same thing to everyone who is exposed to them, much like how people see different things in Picasso's abstractions and Hemingway's stories. I feel a cold chill when I think of not having any reason to consider how others interpret something, especially when it's something that I truly adore. The only people bringing up any reference to whether he "sucks" or not are those who aren't offering anything to the thread. These might also be those who are most strongly beholden to "hype," since their opinions have no backup outside of themselves. -- http://www.synthesizer.org/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-06 21:45zimbette> The original poster is only asking why people decide to spend time with > Kid606's expre
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zimbette
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Date:
Tue, 6 Jun 2000 14:45:25 -0700 (PDT)
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Re: [idm] cog606
Reply to:
Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <Pine.SOL.4.05.10006061417290.10053-100000@e4e.oac.uci.edu>
quoted 2 lines The original poster is only asking why people decide to spend time with> The original poster is only asking why people decide to spend time with > Kid606's expressions, as well as spend more money on them.
actually -- several people, including myself answered why we like kid606, what attracted us to his music, and what keeps us coming back.
quoted 5 lines It's quite> It's quite > unrealistic to say that a piece of music (or a person's entire pantheon of > expression) says the exact same thing to everyone who is exposed to them, > much like how people see different things in Picasso's abstractions and > Hemingway's stories.
which is why i think this hype thread is bullshit. everyone has their own opinion. and its great if people disagree -- hell, if we all agreed id be forced to a life of MAS releases and Amber. I cannot think of anything more dull. the reason i made a "stink" about the whole hype thing is because of the absurd ways the word "hype" can be thrown around. yes, kid606 got a silly write up in a damn apple magazine. but somehow this is being used as an example that all the praise is "hype" -- which is "unacceptable". but then things that are very cookie cutter idm like arovane (who are one of my absolute fave acts right now by the way and capture a mood i can relate to) are not unacceptable hype, but acceptable hype (or "attention"). im just REALLY sick of people (especially the IDM community, or at least a vocal portion of it on this list) being so closed minded. and i am NOT talking about musical taste -- i could care less what you like and do not like --- by all means, dont change! in fact, i like hearing how people really feel about music.. but when folks start generalizing people's opinions as HYPE because they do not fit the norm (by that respect, this whole list is hype because it is not top 40) -- it just gets old. a little story to back this up: two vocal kids on this list one time grilled me on why i liked noise. they insisted that there is "no way [i] could like something like that" and that i was full of shit and only looking for shock value. now, these were two fellows that i REALLY respect, but it was so annoying that it annoys me still to think about it.. [okay, so not much of a story, but you get the idea] i see this whole HYPE thread in the same way. some people cannot understand how people would like something, and rather than asking [as the original poster actually did], they assume they are part of this "hype" machine that for some reason is REALLY trying to push worthless music over the top and drown out the floods of MAS, Schematic, Early Autechre and Aphex stuff that makes them wiggle... all just to piss someone off. and to me this is all just THAT absurd. that said i will agree that some things have been overhyped ! but i do NOT see kid606 as one of them - and if he was producing stuff fitting for Warp or MAS i think the press would go un-noticed. an example of what i feel was hype: various friends of mine on this list stating things like "lexaunculpt schools autechre" :) (oh, for the record, alex is a personal fave of mine, but i mist certainly do not think he schools anyone). anyway, yes i made generalizations, and spoke in lots of "theys" and "thems" -- but it was the best way for me to express just what annoys me about this list. oh, and the whole trashing on the rave culture is annoying as fuck too, but that just confirms my belief that i am in the company of fellow snobs. thanks for the time, chris. it.s ok to like noise it.s okay to like house it.s okay to like pop "nothing but respect to hello kitty" _we are all lost --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-06 20:46Bill WrightI think a subtle point was missed a while back with the initial posts on the subject. Some
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Bill Wright
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Tue, 06 Jun 2000 16:46:12 -0400
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Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <4.2.2.20000606164215.01b74928@mail.clemson.edu>
I think a subtle point was missed a while back with the initial posts on the subject. Someone mentioned that they had 4-5 releases by Kid 606 but still didn't "get" it. Why did he/she keep on buying Kid 606 records despite the fact that he didn't like what he was hearing? I, on the other hand, stopped on my first one (Don't Sweat The Technics) --though I did like the clothes shopping track, it was funny. The thread is about the qualities that Kid606 exhibits, "why" he's good,
quoted 6 lines rather than "whether" or not he's good. If you're willing to put the b>rather than "whether" or not he's good. If you're willing to put the best >of his work up against Hemingway and Picasso as having similar benefits to >those who put up with his lamer tracks, then why not go into a little bit >of detail about that, since that's what the original poster is asking for? >You might as well say that like someone suffering from Alzheimer's, they >have their good days and their bad days.
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2000-06-06 21:08Josh Davisonon 6/6/00 3:46 PM, Bill Wright at wwright@clemson.edu wrote: > I think a subtle point was
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Josh Davison
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Tue, 06 Jun 2000 16:08:04 -0500
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Re: [idm] cog606
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Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <B562D263.483%yoshi@enteract.com>
on 6/6/00 3:46 PM, Bill Wright at wwright@clemson.edu wrote:
quoted 5 lines I think a subtle point was missed a while back with the initial posts on the> I think a subtle point was missed a while back with the initial posts on the > subject. Someone mentioned that they had 4-5 releases by Kid 606 but still > didn't "get" it. Why did he/she keep on buying Kid 606 records despite the > fact that he didn't like what he was hearing? >
it's possible to not understand why you like something and continue to value it for a number of reasons. i haven't heard any Kid 606 but it's obviously worth checking out due to the fact that his music causes such bipolar reactions. bands like the Locust also seem to have this impact on people too. the music is so far removed from anything else currently produced that there is no context in which to address it. closed minded people immediately dismiss it as "noise" but some people are going to hear something in the music if it's there. if it was actually just shite, nobody would be hyping it, right? well i guess the Prodigy proves this wrong. never mind. it's like picasso or the impressionists or any type of "new" art ... when it first arrives on the scene, nobody understands it, critics slag it, then people start copying it, and it becomes a historical precedent after the fact. boom. you're Monet. personally i think the impressionists were boring, but that's me. when i bought my first aphex twin record (SAW II) i totally didn't understand what the hype was about but i kept listening to the album because i could tell there was something up that wasn't immediately obvious ... granted SAW II is like Aphex's version of Monet, but there's definitely something behind that music. or take Oval. the first time my roommates played that record, i was like "What the fuck? it sounds like a CD skipping for 70 minutes..." then once i got past the initial shock of the surface level of the music, and actually listened to what he was doing, it made more sense. i don't know about you , but i'm going to check out this Kid 606 cat. i think he might be onto something. josh -- String Theory Multiplication Flavored Beverage http://www.enteract.com/~yoshi/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-06 21:14Ron Jeremy>From: anything@synthesizer.org > >Ah, nihilism. > >The thread is about the qualities that
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Ron Jeremy
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,
Date:
Tue, 06 Jun 2000 14:14:42 PDT
Subject:
Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <20000606211442.57680.qmail@hotmail.com>
quoted 9 lines From: anything@synthesizer.org>From: anything@synthesizer.org > >Ah, nihilism. > >The thread is about the qualities that Kid606 exhibits, "why" he's good, >rather than "whether" or not he's good. If you're willing to put the best >of his work up against Hemingway and Picasso as having similar benefits to >those who put up with his lamer tracks, then why not go into a little bit >of detail about that, since that's what the original poster is asking for?
So you would prefer that instead of saying we think is music is utter crap, we would dissect WHY we don't like it? Actually it might be easier to start out with what I like about his tracks....ah..nothing.
quoted 2 lines You might as well say that like someone suffering from Alzheimer's, they>You might as well say that like someone suffering from Alzheimer's, they >have their good days and their bad days.
You are an big analogy kind of guy, I see. Picasso, Hemingway, Alzheimer's, I won't don't you also throw in the kitchen sink in your descriptions. I don't think they help your statements much.
quoted 4 lines Music never "speaks for itself," it speaks to you and your sense of>Music never "speaks for itself," it speaks to you and your sense of >"good." It's an expression of a person using things like "sounds" and >"timing" and "pitch" - among other things - to create an object for >contemplation, for deciding if you'd like to spend more time with it.
Why don't you tell us something we don't already know. What no analogies here? How about comparing Albert Camus and Stravinsky to some bs analogy?
quoted 3 lines The>The >original poster is only asking why people decide to spend time with >Kid606's expressions, as well as spend more money on them.
Yeah, I said I thought it was odd his name pops up pretty often when his tracks suck. Especially, when there is a lot of quality music that barely gets touched up on. Things do get hyped. The argument it's only hype if you don't like it, is bullshit. There are many things I have liked that I have felt to be exaggerated as being a bombshell of a release when it's just alright.
quoted 7 lines It's quite>It's quite >unrealistic to say that a piece of music (or a person's entire pantheon of >expression) says the exact same thing to everyone who is exposed to them, >much like how people see different things in Picasso's abstractions and >Hemingway's stories. I feel a cold chill when I think of not having any >reason to consider how others interpret something, especially when it's >something that I truly adore.
Sure everyone can interpret things a little differently. Obviously, those people that are more familiar with making music might look at things differently from some raver that doesn't know shit. Or someone collecting music for many years might have different views than someone relatively new to a particular style. Olive Garden might be a good restaurant to some that have never had REAL italian food. To some the chicken parmesan might have deep pools of wondrous love, to others it might taste like piss poor of an excuse for Italian food. I know Olive Garden is as "artsy" of an analogy as yours, but it's more fitting IMHO. Kid 606 is OG as in Olive Garden quality, sure some of you might like it, that's fine.
quoted 2 lines The only people bringing up any reference to whether he "sucks" or not >are>The only people bringing up any reference to whether he "sucks" or not >are >those who aren't offering anything to the thread.
Sorry, I didn't want to spend that much time taking Kid 606 apart, he didn't seem like he was worth the time.
quoted 3 lines These might also be>These might also be >those who are most strongly beholden to "hype," since their opinions have >no backup outside of themselves.
I apologize to my fans on the list for not being more hardcore and fucking people up. It has nothing to do with the subject, I'm just not in the mood today. But I will be back :) ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-06 23:21rob sallsDoes anyone notice how long this is going on abotu the kid?? Seems like a ego massage agai
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rob salls
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Tue, 06 Jun 2000 23:21:12 GMT
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Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <20000606232112.81757.qmail@hotmail.com>
Does anyone notice how long this is going on abotu the kid?? Seems like a ego massage again,,, ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-07 00:45Steve OliverRon Jeremy wrote: > Yeah, I said I thought it was odd his name pops up pretty often when >
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Steve Oliver
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[IDM]
Date:
Wed, 7 Jun 2000 01:45:42 +0100
Subject:
Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <BNEKIDAPNHONECMHGKKGIEAFCCAA.stevie@ignition.org.uk>
Ron Jeremy wrote:
quoted 3 lines Yeah, I said I thought it was odd his name pops up pretty often when> Yeah, I said I thought it was odd his name pops up pretty often when > his tracks suck. Especially, when there is a lot of quality music > that barely gets touched up on.
Such as...? Since one of the reasons for having this list is to discuss new and interesting music, and since we seem to have been going round in circles of late, why don't you start some new (and sensible) threads about this mysterious music. I for one, am always on the look out for new material to get my hands on, and I would be very interested to see what you have to offer us. Stevie. www.gram.org.uk www.rewind1000.co.uk np:: Rainmen - 'Rien N'Changera' --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-07 16:38rjhrrrmmm... i think everybody here has expressed their opinion on this, saying why they lik
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rj
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Date:
Wed, 07 Jun 2000 12:38:16 -0400
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Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <393E7A78.5E1F54EF@transelectronic.net>
hrrrmmm... i think everybody here has expressed their opinion on this, saying why they like it, why not, but i don't think anyone really got to the heart of the matter which is: "why kid606's music bothers those that it does". i heard the hype about this character, so i bought the "kid606 and friends". the first track kinda sets the stage for a really campy, tongue in cheek d&b romp, needless to say it wasn't even done by him (remixed my hrvatsky). the rest of the trax take a total different approach. i got totally thrown off. the things on the album are not ground breaking. all of the sounds on there will be common place to anybody that has been doing music on a mac for the past five years. distortion, time stretching, granulation ect. what isn't common place is the fact that it's actually on a record - a whole album full of it, full of common place studio fiddeling. it's a little annoying actually. i guess for those that don't have studios, or haven't ever played around with this stuff it will seem pretty cool ,and it is, but it's no ground breaking achievement. the technology is totally apparent (instead of transparent). on the soccer girl ep, it sounds like he wrote stuff using some sort of "virtual analogue" synth (reaktor or nordlead) and simply degraded it. 16 bit 11k, like 3 different tracks. it's really simple stuff. anybody with a studio can do it, but the point nobody else is the way he (and his team of cohorts) are. also they have an attitude. have you seen the website? demo policy... "our policy is "don't contact us we'll contact you" concerning any demo material, but yes, we do like hearing new stuff, especially if it doesn't suck.... and our general lack of interest in music not by us, our friends or people who are too famous or dead to be our friends any emails received concerning demos will not be responded to..." it goes on and on. it's really easy to dislike a group of individuals that handle themselves that way, but perhaps that's what they want. but listen, i'm not trying to trash them here (and no i'm not trying to be politically correct either). they actually go on to say send it, and they'll get back to you if they like it. also they say their policy is the same as most labels, they are just honest about it. totally true. the point is this, him and his friends are making music they enjoy, and doing it for themselvs, i believe, with a good hearty laugh out loud. they have fun and release it with out worrying what the masses at large will think about it. i have total respect for that. really. i wish more people believed in themselves as much as this bunch. i know this post was all about hype, but isn't that exactly what the initial poster did by posting? another 2 cents for the archives... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-07 17:31Rjyan Kidwell"rj@transelectronic.net" said this re: tigerbeat6 :: > the point is this, him and his frie
From:
Rjyan Kidwell
To:
,
Date:
Wed, 07 Jun 2000 13:31:28 -0400
Subject:
Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <005501bfd0a6$386bca40$6725dc80@RES.JHU.EDU>
"rj@transelectronic.net" said this re: tigerbeat6 ::
quoted 1 line the point is this, him and his friends are making music they enjoy, and> the point is this, him and his friends are making music they enjoy, and
doing it
quoted 1 line for themselvs, i believe, with a good hearty laugh out loud. they have fun> for themselvs, i believe, with a good hearty laugh out loud. they have fun
and
quoted 1 line release it with out worrying what the masses at large will think about> release it with out worrying what the masses at large will think about
it. i have total
quoted 1 line respect for that. really. i wish more people believed in themselves as> respect for that. really. i wish more people believed in themselves as
much as this
quoted 1 line bunch.> bunch.
here's how I like to think of it: electronic music is all about acronyms. now, on one hand you have labels and artists who want to be the CIA. they want to treat IDM (the people on this list) like the great unwashed. they've got their black sunglasses and dark suits and hi-tech gadgets,... they're cool, they're badass. they don't talk to IDM, they don't divulge their great secrets, and behind closed doors they mock the ignorance of IDM. you never see their faces. this has pretty much been the standard for labels. you know what i'm talking about... Skam, Schematic, MAS, etc, etc. but Tigerbeat6 is trying to change that. rather than view IDM as the ignorant public, the great unwashed -- we look at IDM as the slightly unwashed. There are definitely some filthy hicks here, but there's also just some fun, rowdy kids. Sort of like the audience at a wrestling event. Hence, our philosophy: the WWF philosophy of IDM. We see IDM as a capacity-crowd at a WWF pay-per-view event. Sure, some of them are total white trash, but that doesn't mean you can't still have fun with them, enjoying something you both like. The WWF philosophy means yeah, I post to the IDM list. Yeah, we write big long rants on our webpage about our demo policy that is telling you what other labels won't. Yeah, there's a goofy picture of me on the back on my album on tb6. etc, etc. none of that tDR hi-class, nose-up roody-poo monkey crap here, folks. To us, the music isn't some hi-tech commodity that you buy because we tell you to (like the CIAs see it) it's a big shared culture/inside joke, like wrestling is between the fans and the WWF. some people don't get the joke, and those people can eat a bowl of dicks. -the rk --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-07 17:56Ernesto Ikerd>none of that tDR hi-class, nose-up roody-poo monkey crap here, folks. To >us, the music i
From:
Ernesto Ikerd
To:
Rjyan Kidwell , International Damage Machines
Date:
Wed, 07 Jun 2000 12:56:14 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <200006071754.MAA27578@cliffy.lmtas.lmco.com>
quoted 5 lines none of that tDR hi-class, nose-up roody-poo monkey crap here, folks. To>none of that tDR hi-class, nose-up roody-poo monkey crap here, folks. To >us, the music isn't some hi-tech commodity that you buy because we tell you >to (like the CIAs see it) it's a big shared culture/inside joke, like >wrestling is between the fans and the WWF. some people don't get the joke, >and those people can eat a bowl of dicks.
Kidwell 3:16 ;) ernie Ernesto Ikerd, (817) 763-4795 Company Graphics, Dept 17, MZ-4202 Lockheed Martin Aeronautics Company Fort Worth, Texas --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2000-06-07 18:53Scott McKeatingVery cool posting. Refreshing to read something that doesn't smell like it's been up it's
From:
Scott McKeating
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Date:
Wed, 07 Jun 2000 18:53:34 GMT
Subject:
Re: [idm] cog606
permalink · <20000607185334.6196.qmail@hotmail.com>
Very cool posting. Refreshing to read something that doesn't smell like it's been up it's own or someone elses arse. I think on principle I'll check some of their releases out and pop to the website. Plus I'd never dl any of their stuff from Napster either! Scott
quoted 66 lines From: Rjyan Kidwell <cex@tigerbeat6.com>>From: Rjyan Kidwell <cex@tigerbeat6.com> >To: rj@transelectronic.net, idm@hyperreal.org >Subject: Re: [idm] cog606 >Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 13:31:28 -0400 > >"rj@transelectronic.net" said this re: tigerbeat6 :: > > the point is this, him and his friends are making music they enjoy, and >doing it > > for themselvs, i believe, with a good hearty laugh out loud. they have >fun >and > > release it with out worrying what the masses at large will think about >it. i have total > > respect for that. really. i wish more people believed in themselves as >much as this > > bunch. > >here's how I like to think of it: electronic music is all about acronyms. > >now, on one hand you have labels and artists who want to be the CIA. they >want to treat IDM (the people on this list) like the great unwashed. >they've >got their black sunglasses and dark suits and hi-tech gadgets,... they're >cool, they're badass. they don't talk to IDM, they don't divulge their >great >secrets, and behind closed doors they mock the ignorance of IDM. you never >see their faces. > >this has pretty much been the standard for labels. you know what i'm >talking >about... Skam, Schematic, MAS, etc, etc. > >but Tigerbeat6 is trying to change that. rather than view IDM as the >ignorant public, the great unwashed -- we look at IDM as the slightly >unwashed. There are definitely some filthy hicks here, but there's also >just >some fun, rowdy kids. Sort of like the audience at a wrestling event. >Hence, >our philosophy: the WWF philosophy of IDM. We see IDM as a capacity-crowd >at >a WWF pay-per-view event. Sure, some of them are total white trash, but >that >doesn't mean you can't still have fun with them, enjoying something you >both >like. The WWF philosophy means yeah, I post to the IDM list. Yeah, we write >big long rants on our webpage about our demo policy that is telling you >what >other labels won't. Yeah, there's a goofy picture of me on the back on my >album on tb6. etc, etc. > >none of that tDR hi-class, nose-up roody-poo monkey crap here, folks. To >us, the music isn't some hi-tech commodity that you buy because we tell you >to (like the CIAs see it) it's a big shared culture/inside joke, like >wrestling is between the fans and the WWF. some people don't get the joke, >and those people can eat a bowl of dicks. > > >-the rk > > > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >
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