IDM Mailing Archive

quoted 3 lines and i thought politics in the u.k were going mad! surely to god this

>and i thought politics in the u.k were going mad! surely to god this >ban isn't enforced, is it? it's the craziest thing i've heard in a >long time. almost as crazy as that ae import ban

Many cities in the US are cracking down on public indoor smoking, because of lawsuits from second-hand smoke. Lawyers are making BILLIONS off tobacco lawsuits. Many cities in Texas (like good ol' Austin) are the same way. You cant smoke indoors in public unless you are in a negatively-pressurized room built specifically for the purpose. It makes going out to clubs and shows a real hassle if you smoke. Im sure glad I dont smoke..tobacco. ernie Ernesto Ikerd, (817) 763-4795 Company Graphics, Dept 17, MZ-1156 Lockheed Martin Tactical Aircaft Systems Fort Worth, Texas

quoted 3 lines Many cities in the US are cracking down on public indoor smoking, because

> Many cities in the US are cracking down on public indoor smoking, because > of lawsuits from second-hand smoke. Lawyers are making BILLIONS off > tobacco lawsuits.

As I was just reading the article before this post, a few US smokers might be interested in hearing that a North Carolina judge recently ruled that the 1993 EPA report on which most of the second hand smoke litigation is based was seriously flawed. He declared that the EPA's finding was based on insufficiently rigorous statistical tests and was therefore invalid. The agency, he wrote, "disregarded information and made findings based on selective information ...; deviated from its risk assessment guidelines; failed to disclose important [opposing] findings and reasoning; and left significant questions without answers. Sorry for the off-topic post but at least it's on-thread. :) Latr Daze, The Dave --- Dave Bloom the_dave@msn.com Too bad you can't buy a voodoo globe so that you could make the earth spin real fast and freak everybody out.

Dear beatheads - The U.S. anti-smoking fascism is a bit of a laugh. I recommend that all responsible citizens take up smoking as a metaphorical statement in support of this nation's much-discussed and apparently little-realized freedom. Besides, smoking might actually ameliorate the patriotically reverse-Puritanical American tradition of obesity, not to mention improving one's social life ("Do you have a light, by any chance?"), and offering a convenient excuse for taking more breaks on the job. Whether one's smoking "offends" another is a bit ridiculous in most circumstances. The fashion sense of most people in this provincial metropolis is appallingly offensive, and yet I don't ask people - "Would you change your clothing please? It's giving me a migraine." Although that might in fact be a viable idea... One shouldn't be allowed to call a smokeless place of business which sells you dirty water in a paper cup with a dash of foam and calls it cappucino for $3.50 a "cafe". Last time we walked into an empty to-be-unnamed Seattlish coffee chain and were kindly greeted with "This is a smoke-free environment", we responded "It's also a customer-free environment" and walked. Another point to ponder: if the motivation behind the anti-smoking legislation is truly a concern with _health_, then why wasn't McDonald's banned from the face of this earth? For that matter, cars should be banned as well, as most "drivers" are a hazard to themselves (speaking from recent experience, as a red-light runner has just recently displaced the front portion of my own vehicle to a distance of 20m from the other part, in which I happened to be situated). Evidently the Big Mac lobby, not to mention the auto-making industry, are a bit too powerful, no? Ironic that tobacco built this country, and now it's the devil incarnate. Just after we convinced the rest of the world to inhale, we go and change the rules. Ah, the precociousness of the young nation. It's all big business, nothing whatsoever to do with public health. The business of America is business, or is it litigation? Anyone have a light? Cough, 3 on now: PowerMac fan hum + "Chill Out or Die II"

quoted 11 lines and i thought politics in the u.k were going mad! surely to god this

>>and i thought politics in the u.k were going mad! surely to god this >>ban isn't enforced, is it? it's the craziest thing i've heard in a >>long time. almost as crazy as that ae import ban > >Many cities in the US are cracking down on public indoor smoking, because >of lawsuits from second-hand smoke. Lawyers are making BILLIONS off >tobacco lawsuits. Many cities in Texas (like good ol' Austin) are the >same way. You cant smoke indoors in public unless you are in a >negatively-pressurized room built specifically for the purpose. It makes >going out to clubs and shows a real hassle if you smoke. Im sure glad I >dont smoke..tobacco.

Well, I don't smoke ..'tobacco', but think I'm still gonna have fun messin with some promoters heads with this one, next time I'm ravin it up, I shall take a strident stance at the door " err xcuse me, Mr Promoter, big man in charge, I would just like to ascertain that this venue IS "negatively-pressurized" before I enter, as I do not wish to endanger me healthy bod merely in my giddy propensity for fun times!" "Wot! It isn't?! and you've got the nerve to charge me a tenner for the priviledge! Expect to hear from my lawyer tomorrow!" Hey, Rephresh's Soundshaft has just been refurbished, shall have to check on the door that they have done the job propper, Californians out there be warned, if you ever make it over for one of these, tis the smokiest club I've ever been into in me entire life, you can hardly see for the clouds of dry ice, never mind the whirls of smoke being chuffed away by happy likkle ravers, and 10 paces in, you're stoned without even havin to dodge the bouncers, just from big deep breaths! "Positively-no presh" rooms are wot we want, & think the Rephlex lads will happily oblige. :) Alessandra

quoted 1 line The fashion sense of most people in this provincial metropolis is appallingly offensive, a

>The fashion sense of most people in this provincial metropolis is appallingly offensive, and yet I don't ask people - "Would you change your clothing please? It's giving me a migraine."

It is quite obvious why this never happens, not for the principle of it but for the practicality, that is, it is obviously easier to take a couple steps away than to change one's outfit. Besides, while your beef with clothing is an aesthetic issue concerned with your personal tastes, for most opposed to smoking it is an instinctual or knee-jerk reaction. I smell smoke, I feel nauseous, but I've never asked strangers to put out their cancer sticks ( :D ) I find an easier solution to your smoke-free "cafe" situation by killing two birds (that is, no smoking and high prices) with one stone--I don't drink coffee. It makes the whole thing easier.

quoted 1 line why wasn't McDonald's banned from the face of this earth?...cars should be banne

>why wasn't McDonald's banned from the face of this earth?...cars should be banned as well, as most "drivers" are a hazard to themselves...

The reason for these two things not being banned is simple, and again based on utility: the ease of automobile travel and the convenience of McDonalds greatly outweigh their hazardous qualities. And for McDonalds, few people really care about how gross their food is. The others are either ignorant or don't care. Tobacco didn't build this country, cotton did. I can imagine a court case in the near future where a plantation-slave descendant sues the government for allowing slavery to be legal, thus preventing the birth (by early death of his ancestors) of hundreds of his relatives. A case where someone sues for damages against someone who never existed, that seems all too probable nowadays. And Coolidge was wrong. The business of America is money, any goddamn way you can get your grubby mitts on it. Could you not stand upwind of me? --Geoff on now: the amazing "Brace Yourself" EP

I thought I'd add my 2 cents to this thread: Almost all of my friends smoke. I don't. I have no choice but to put up with it. For the most part, they are pretty conscientious and don't smoke inside my house, etc. I just live with my clothes smelling like smoke and being affected by allergies and asthma from smoke. I find it very interesting that most people who smoke don't realize they smell like smoke and make things (like cars) reek of the stuff. When I try to explain to someone who smokes that when I go out to a club and come home I feel like I want to take a shower because of the way I smell, they just don't get it. I would be overjoyed if the world was a smokeless place. I'd feel and smell better--as would a lot of other people. As to whether second hand smoke causes people to become ill...some evidence *does* support this. It has been statistically shown (for many years now) that children who grow up in households where their parent's smoke have a higher incedence of respiratory problems and illnesses. People who smoke aren't bad people (or else why would I put up with it), they just have no control over their addiction to nicotine and need cigarettes as a crutch to deal with social situations. I often envy my friends who smoke when they are in a new social situation. The cigarette gives them something to do and relaxes them (and can also stimulate some interaction). Whereas all I can do it twiddle my fingers. I think eventually, cigarette smoking will become less and less prevalent. I have found as I'm getting older that society tends to segregate older smokers into the "lower classes of society". I.e., it is often viewed that highly successful business people do not smoke. Blue collar workers do. (BTW, this is not my opinion necessarily, I'm just reflecting what I've heard and observed). -Jeremy

this thread will now magically dis-appear amp idm-owner

Please Stop it, I dont't give a damn, It has nothing to to with music .... np: Xangadix -- Maximilien Lincourt, B. info., Software developer "2d or not 2d" ToonBoom Technologies Inc. phone 514 278 86 66 7, Laurier East fax 514 278 26 66 Montreal, Canada mailto:max@toonboom.com H2T 1E4 http://www.toonboom.com

Get lost with this crap.. Last week i was near to beeing firewalled for being "off-topic" concerning a (i admit a very little bit off-topic but still in the vein of...) discussion about a (for my oppinion) fake Aphex Twin soundfile... And now what happens....everyone starts posting stuff about this smoke thing..

quoted 14 lines ----------

>---------- >> The U.S. anti-smoking fascism is a bit of a laugh. >> I recommend that all responsible citizens take up smoking as a >> metaphorical statement in support of this nation's much-discussed >> and apparently little-realized freedom. >> > >Whoaa, for a minute there, I thought I was on the >alt.tobacco.useless.discussion newgroup... > >And sorry for my non-IDM post too >YES, Sorrry for mine too :) > >

From: "Zenon M. Feszczak" <feszczak@sas.upenn.edu>

quoted 5 lines Whether one's smoking "offends" another is a bit ridiculous in most

> Whether one's smoking "offends" another is a bit ridiculous in most > circumstances. The fashion sense of most people in this provincial > metropolis is appallingly offensive, and yet I don't ask people - "Would > you change your clothing please? It's giving me a migraine." Although > that might in fact be a viable idea...

heh. Actually, my clothing smells quite offensive after going to a pub/club/whatever. Although at my old uni, they instituted a no smoking rule in the bar, though you could smoke outside on the balcony (this is Sydney, OK?), and many did, and not entirely tobacco, either. Nice not coming home smelling like the Marlboro Man though. Though since most of the people who go out are going to abuse their bodies in some way, whether it be partaking of noxious substances or ruining their hearing or ameliorating their sanity, it does seem a little harsh to ban smoking in such establishments (and it's heading that way in Australia too). Then again, I still hate smelly clothes. Ban the gruddamn cancer sticks! Yeah! Ummm... IDM content. Right... I saw a Yo La Tengo 2CD with "Loving" or something in the title in the local record emporium. This worth getting? -- Graham the Happy Scum God sends the meat http://www.mpx.com.au/~gths (or Graham H Freeman) and the Devil Cooks mailto:gths@flat-earth.org Yet another inappropriate quote fragment follows ... ... hey hey hey!