Tim Gill writes:
quoted 4 lines It's not that the music sounds bad. I'm saying it is invalid as music> It's not that the music sounds bad. I'm saying it is invalid as music
> because a monkey could do the same with the same machines, pressing random
> buttons gets you a nice sounding song. In other words, there's nothing
> special about it.
yeah, but if you put that monkey in a tank, and give him a record
deal, then watch out! he could be bigger than the SPICE GIRLS.
quoted 2 lines Good point. But I also have the right to view that art, and have an opinion> Good point. But I also have the right to view that art, and have an opinion
> that it means nothing. That it is senseless.
ah, in that case you set yourself up as an art critic. and personally
i don't put much stock in critics.
quoted 2 lines This all comes down to what you believe art IS. And each person has their> This all comes down to what you believe art IS. And each person has their
> own definition.
i think we need to arrive at one that is mutually satisfying, or our
critical dialogues will suffer. a review that you write will be
useless to me unless i know what your standards for art are.
quoted 5 lines You have broadened your definition so that Art can be anything. So,> You have broadened your definition so that Art can be anything. So,
> for you, this synth is vlaid because there is a person who sat down
> and sais "I want to make some music." I have a more particular
> view, I think. Art has to be something that only the person that
> creates it could have created...all art should be a first...
nate harrison provided a very good response to this, i just have to
say that i totally agree with him.
quoted 4 lines Well, I don't buy your argument. In my opinion the Rebirth is VERY> Well, I don't buy your argument. In my opinion the Rebirth is VERY
> limited in the amount of sounds and emotions that can come out of
> it. In fact, it is very emotionless...it's main variance is amount
> of intensity.
i have to disagree. i think it is possible to write LOTS of different
styles of music with just a 303 and a drum machine. just because you
can't visualize doesn't mean it can't be done, it just means your
musical sensibilities are confined more by the equipment. i used to
do all my music with a casio cz-101 and a cheap korg drum machine, and
i created lots of different stuff. it was ludicrously difficult but
one of the things that defines good art for me is knowing that the
artist can transcend the limits of the gear.
roger miller (the mission of burma guitarist, not the king of the road
guy) used to do a show called "maximum electric piano" where the
entire thing was sounds from one yamaha electric baby grand. he used
an electroharmonix 16 second delay loop to build up huge walls of
sound, or repeating rhythms, and then do crazy solos over the top
through distortion pedals. it was pretty amazing.
quoted 2 lines With the Rebirth, you don't need talent. As I've said, a monkey> With the Rebirth, you don't need talent. As I've said, a monkey
> could do it.
time for you to put up or shut up, i think. please, produce this
incredible monkey already. tell you what, we'll have him cut some
demos, i'll put them on the net, and we'll open it up to a vote. if
the majority of people who listen like it, i'll put his record out.
jimg/skoop wrote:
quoted 1 line Yeah, true...but until it happens, all's there is is the mouse.> Yeah, true...but until it happens, all's there is is the mouse.
as someone else pointed out, they are already working on the next
Rebirth, which will not be limited to the mouse.
quoted 4 lines And frankly, though I don't know why, the concept of using a> And frankly, though I don't know why, the concept of using a
> computer (as in "desktop pc", not synthesizer) to make music doesn't
> sit well with me. Probably because I spend all day at work staring
> at them...
well, this is just a silly artificial distinction. the processors in
my gear are incredibly similar to the processors in my computer. in
fact, the k2000 (my main axe) has a motorola 68000 series as its main
cpu, same chip that was in all the pre-powerpc macintoshes.
all we're talking about is a different interface. and personally i'd
rather have it all on my mac screen where it can be manipulated with
mouse & keyboard, than sit hunched over that tiny little LCD display,
paging through menus with buttons and knobs. in fact, there are
programs which basically replace the synth's panel with nice big on
screen graphic displays. tweaking a synth envelope with a mouse sure
beats using arrow keys!
quoted 2 lines personally i find watching someone twiddling the knobs on the 303 to>>personally i find watching someone twiddling the knobs on the 303 to
>>be about as boring as a guitar solo.quoted 1 line So how do you perform live? (Just curious)>So how do you perform live? (Just curious)
i don't. precisely because i haven't thought of a way to do it that i
would find interesting, if i were in the audience watching me. no
dancing teddy bears for me, thanks.
chris graves wrote:
quoted 4 lines regarding all this premade sample stuff (rebirth, etc). sure, i> regarding all this premade sample stuff (rebirth, etc). sure, i
> like some of the sounds it makes... but how can an artist feel good
> about the music he made if none of the samples are his own? [sample
> creation is part of the process (unless you are quite lame).]
first off, rebirth is mostly doing modelling. no samples. (well, the
808 sounds are samples, but the 303 section is all modelled). does it
make a difference? i don't know, the model is that of a real 303, and
is almost 100% identical... so there's the whole question of "why
emulate something that already exists"... well, from propellerheads
point of view "because people will pay for it". i personally wish
they would put more knobs on it than are on the real 303 so we can
make some truly warped noises, by manipulating the model at a lower
level. version 2.0, maybe?
but, we are straight back to the "does art have to be original or does
it have to be good" debate... obviously for some people original ==
good. i can live with that, but i also think that you can kick
serious ass with an 808 and a 303 if you put some thought into it.
0 (zero) wrote:
quoted 1 line Why dont people just get ONE synth and a frigging four track!> Why dont people just get ONE synth and a frigging four track!
cos it's more convenient to have lots of synths? i mean, yeah, you
can do a lot with one synth & a tape deck but it's easier when you
have LOTS of stuff happening at once. i basically write all my music
with all my gear running into the mixer and record it live to DAT.
it's nice to be able to hear the entire thing at once.
sorry for the length of this post. (not really)
np: ed rush - technology. an excellent example of the power of
recontextualizing, actually. this track is filled with lots of old
belgian style 1992 rave noises, but reworked into a techstep
framework. despite using cliched & played sounds, they don't sound
cliched in the new context. that, to me, is really exciting.
--
Jon Drukman jsd@gamespot.com SpotMedia Communications
...I was an infinitely hot and dense dot...