IDM Mailing Archive

2000-05-01 03:31kurt"John Bush" wrote: >[...]there's definitely a pattern in >Britain regarding the lusher sid

From:: kurt <supine@bway.net>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.org>
Date:: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:31:01 -0400
Subject:: [idm] LTJ Bukem, was 'D&B/Lush Melodies'

"John Bush" wrote:

quoted 7 lines [...]there's definitely a pattern in

>[...]there's definitely a pattern in >Britain regarding the lusher side of drum'n'bass. It started in the >mid-'70s with jazz-funk-lite and fusion -- i.e. Roy Ayers, Lonnie Liston >Smith, etc. -- which was huge in Britain, then cycled through rare-groove in >the '80s, and acid jazz in the '80s and '90s. I'm sure quite a few >junglists listened to (or were indirectly exposed to) fusion, quiet storm, >and the breezier side of jazz while they were growing up...

that kind of explains a few things that had been perplexing me. recently I'd been scratching my head over the new LTJ Bukem 'Journey Inwards' because so much of it sounds like jazz-funk-lite. And I'd been straining to get with the vibe, all the while thinking, "but...who...likes...lite...jazz?" (answer: boring people, usually.) perhaps I'll get my retro-fetish-irony-filter cued to the right setting after awhile. Anyway, somebody had spoken of 'lush melodies' but I wonder if in fact any drum and bass has lush melodies. I've heard lush harmonic textures, maybe some evocative chord changes, but few melodies to speak of beyond some little riffs. kurt --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

2000-05-10 04:48Mitch StargroveKurt yes, it does get a bit lame and sappy too bad when so much of Bukem's work has been g

From:: Mitch Stargrove <Mitch@DancingDNA.com>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.org>
Cc:: kurt <supine@bway.net>
Date:: Tue, 9 May 2000 21:48:20 -0700
Subject:: Re: [idm] LTJ Bukem, was 'D&B/Lush Melodies' - and wimpy jazz
Reply to:: [idm] LTJ Bukem, was 'D&B/Lush Melodies'

Kurt yes, it does get a bit lame and sappy too bad when so much of Bukem's work has been great I really started to worry a few years ago when I saw one CD claiming the strong "jazz" influence from the presence of the sax player form the Average White Band! Albert Ayler would jump back into the river! I never wanted to listen to the kind of jazz Bukem and many others are emulating back in the 70s - it just never had the power to hold me that the first generation fusion or the avant garde did DJ Cam knows his Coltrane and ColdCut seem to know just about everything but I would love to see more useof Coltrane and Dolphy's intense riffs and extended solo clips, let alone Art Ensemble and SunRa; Mingus could be so fantastic if you want forceful streams of sound and what about McLaughlin or Larry Young! James Hardway does use some real jazz elements in a d&b setting Red Snapper can also be very tasty and in a different vein when I think of Tortoise i often remember the large Coltrane poster they had/have in their studio Mitch

quoted 29 lines "John Bush" wrote:

>"John Bush" wrote: > >>[...]there's definitely a pattern in >>Britain regarding the lusher side of drum'n'bass. It started in the >>mid-'70s with jazz-funk-lite and fusion -- i.e. Roy Ayers, Lonnie Liston >>Smith, etc. -- which was huge in Britain, then cycled through rare-groove in >>the '80s, and acid jazz in the '80s and '90s. I'm sure quite a few >>junglists listened to (or were indirectly exposed to) fusion, quiet storm, >>and the breezier side of jazz while they were growing up... > >that kind of explains a few things that had been perplexing me. >recently I'd been scratching my head over the new LTJ Bukem 'Journey >Inwards' because so much of it sounds like jazz-funk-lite. And I'd >been straining to get with the vibe, all the while thinking, >"but...who...likes...lite...jazz?" (answer: boring people, usually.) > >perhaps I'll get my retro-fetish-irony-filter cued to the right >setting after awhile. > >Anyway, somebody had spoken of 'lush melodies' but I wonder if in >fact any drum and bass has lush melodies. I've heard lush harmonic >textures, maybe some evocative chord changes, but few melodies to >speak of beyond some little riffs. > >kurt > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org >For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

-- * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Mitch Stargrove <Mitch@DancingDNA.com> * * * * * "Every man and every woman is a star". * * * * * --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

2000-05-10 14:00drift wood--- Mitch Stargrove <Mitch@DancingDNA.com> wrote: > > > yes, it does get a bit lame and sa

From:: drift wood <sequential_circus@yahoo.co.uk>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.org>
Date:: Wed, 10 May 2000 15:00:27 +0100 (BST)
Subject:: Re: [idm] LTJ Bukem, was 'D&B/Lush Melodies' - and wimpy jazz

--- Mitch Stargrove <Mitch@DancingDNA.com> wrote: >

quoted 11 lines yes, it does get a bit lame and sappy

> > yes, it does get a bit lame and sappy > too bad when so much of Bukem's work has been great > I really started to worry a few years ago when I saw one CD claiming > the strong "jazz" influence from the presence of the sax player form > the Average White Band! Albert Ayler would jump back into the river! > > I never wanted to listen to the kind of jazz Bukem and many others > are emulating back in the 70s - it just never had the power to hold > me that the first generation fusion or the avant garde did >

Just thought I'd like to defend Jazz Funk a bit from some unwarranted slurs....yeah we all know the rent-a-jazz-funk cliches off by heart (when I came out of the tube at Piccadilly on Saturday there was a Jazz Funk band busking!) but every music has its cliches including IDM. The main reason for Jazz Funks popularity in the UK was its success on the dancefloor. DJ's such as Colin Curtis in Blackpool championed this music as a respite from the growing inanity of the Northern Soul scene. The stuff played included obscure stuff from Japan as well as the established players from the US. Anyway, when the rare groove scene started in London in the 80's soundsystems such as Soul to Soul and Mastermind would still play some of the classics by Roy Ayers, Lonnie Liston Smith etc. Of course, many of the main players on the London music scene in the 90's such as Bukem and 4 Hero used to attend such gatherings and hence the continued influence of the music. It was good to dance to, it had good beats - hence it's longevity. OK, Bukem has been quoted as saying Lonnie Liston Smith is one of his musical heroes. I agree that Lonnie has produced a fair amount of fusion shite (esp on the later CBS albums) but then how can you totally dismiss a man that released the classic 'Expansions'? His work with others such as Gato Barbieri on Flying Dutchman also merits mention. It's ridiculous to dismiss all sampling of Jazz as a slur against creativity. Lets face it, the whole reason sampling works because it does not respect the source. It could be a drum sample from a Dolly Parton record or a snippet of a Miles Davis trumpet solo. What does it matter? If they are ingredients of a fresh creation then so what? Anyway, the 4 Hero version of Naiima (spelling?) by Coltrane is great. Taking the sax part is Chris Bowden, who has worked with Mark & Dego previously. Worth checking out when it finally appears. Matt. ____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

Re: [idm] LTJ Bukem, was 'D&B/Lush Melodies' - and wimpy jazz