IDM Mailing Archive

I just want to put in my 2 cents on the AE show in Vancouver. In my opinion, and in those of my fellow concert goers, Autechre were self-indulgent and noisy. It was a real disappointment for me because I am a really big fan. But as is often the case with live electronic acts, Autechre saw fit to completely dissect all of their songs and reassemble the parts into much grungier, less danceable, and in my opinion, less enjoyable tracks. The formula went like this for several songs: Start with a stunning AE beat that causes the whole crowd to go nuts and scream and begin to dance. Layer sound->layer->layer->layer->watch crowd stop dancing and start scratching their heads. Either that or they were I can appreciate that the audience would want to hear artful rearrangement of their songs, but these tracks were beyond the pale in terms of experimentation. They were frequently undanceable (when I say that I don't mean 'they weren't 4/4 I couldn't handbag around the dancefloor whine whine' I mean they were grating and inaccessible when compared to the tens of songs that they have that make you want to wig out). Why don't they play the songs that are full of amazing melodies that everyone loves? Why does a live concert from them (and others, notably Aphex) consist of a sonic middle finger to people that pay good money to hear what they like? The argument goes, "If you just wanted to hear the same music played live, then why not just stay home and crank up your stereo to get the effect?" to which I reply that in this case, Autechre overshot the space where artist and audience meet to have a good time. Oh, and Perfume Tree were boilerplate d'n'b-ethereal woman's voice. Chantal played great tracks, but she didn't mix at all. This review is over.

Did anyone record the ae show in Vancouver? If so, email me to trade.....

Wow I wholeheartedly disagree with every sentiment here! I liked the fact I didn't know what the songs were it made it far more interesting to see what they were going to do rather than "oh this is such and such a song, it's not bad but I have to go to the bathroom" instead I was glued there wondering what was coming up next with every song.... nothing pisses me off more than to go to a show to hear faithful or near faithful reproductions of songs.there is no point with this kind of music as there is never anything interesting to watch, no thought put into stage design etc..... so why not play all new material to keep people interested?It's not like you can sing along like with rock/pop bands.. I'd also venture to say the Vancouver crowd(a few exceptions) NEVER started dancing to stop in the first place, so no love lost...I danced the whole night practically and had a ball even when then rhythmns got completely screwed...(time to rest too) well it's all personal taste I guess but I thoroughly enjoyed the show..but then I love self indulgent and noisy ;-) I don't want them playing to make me happy I want them to do what they want to do that's what I paid my $16 for. :-) spaul np:lee perry-arkology disc2 Neal Thomas wrote:

quoted 38 lines I just want to put in my 2 cents on the AE show in Vancouver. In

> I just want to put in my 2 cents on the AE show in Vancouver. In > my opinion, and in those of my fellow concert goers, Autechre were > self-indulgent and noisy. > > It was a real disappointment for me because I am a really big > fan. But as is often the case with live electronic acts, Autechre saw > fit to completely dissect all of their songs and reassemble the parts > into much grungier, less danceable, and in my opinion, less enjoyable > tracks. > > The formula went like this for several songs: Start with a > stunning AE beat that causes the whole crowd to go nuts and scream and > begin to dance. Layer sound->layer->layer->layer->watch crowd stop > dancing and start scratching their heads. Either that or they were > > I can appreciate that the audience would want to hear artful > rearrangement of their songs, but these tracks were beyond the pale in > terms of experimentation. They were frequently undanceable (when I say > that I don't mean 'they weren't 4/4 I couldn't handbag around the > dancefloor whine whine' I mean they were grating and inaccessible when > compared to the tens of songs that they have that make you want to wig > out). > > Why don't they play the songs that are full of amazing melodies > that everyone loves? Why does a live concert from them (and others, > notably Aphex) consist of a sonic middle finger to people that pay good > money to hear what they like? > > The argument goes, "If you just wanted to hear the same music > played live, then why not just stay home and crank up your stereo to get > the effect?" to which I reply that in this case, Autechre overshot the > space where artist and audience meet to have a good time. > > Oh, and Perfume Tree were boilerplate d'n'b-ethereal woman's > voice. > Chantal played great tracks, but she didn't mix at all. > > This review is over.

I'd say I'd have to agree wholeheartedly with the below comments. I myself saw Autechre in Jan. 96 in NYC, and I too was put off by what I think of as just wanking to fuck with the crowd, i.e. "try and figure out what song _this_ is!!!" I'm sorry, but that's what going to a concert is _not_ about. When you go to a show, you're hoping to enjoy a band's music with people who also enjoy it, a party put on by the band itself. Now I'm no fan of bands that do verbatim renditions of recorded material, I find that fairly uninteresting in itself. But the Orb is a good example of an electronic group that manages to remix their songs for live performance, making them new and exciting, yet keeping them recognizable at the same time. Yet Autechre seems to have decided that in order to be taken seriously "live" they have to completely remake all their songs with virtually nothing remaining from the originals. This may make them feel like they're s00perk00l and may satisfy the trainspotters in the audience, but for the vast majority who's seeking a more visceral thrill, it simply seems pretentious, a bunch of techno-geeks pulling noise out of their arses. I doubt I'd ever go to another one of their so-called live shows. ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: (idm) RE: AE in Vancouver [snip] It was a real disappointment for me because I am a really big fan. But as is often the case with live electronic acts, Autechre saw fit to completely dissect all of their songs and reassemble the parts into much grungier, less danceable, and in my opinion, less enjoyable tracks. The formula went like this for several songs: Start with a stunning AE beat that causes the whole crowd to go nuts and scream and begin to dance. Layer sound->layer->layer->layer->watch crowd stop dancing and start scratching their heads. Either that or they were I can appreciate that the audience would want to hear artful rearrangement of their songs, but these tracks were beyond the pale in terms of experimentation. They were frequently undanceable (when I say that I don't mean 'they weren't 4/4 I couldn't handbag around the dancefloor whine whine' I mean they were grating and inaccessible when compared to the tens of songs that they have that make you want to wig out). Why don't they play the songs that are full of amazing melodies that everyone loves? Why does a live concert from them (and others, notably Aphex) consist of a sonic middle finger to people that pay good money to hear what they like? The argument goes, "If you just wanted to hear the same music played live, then why not just stay home and crank up your stereo to get the effect?" to which I reply that in this case, Autechre overshot the space where artist and audience meet to have a good time. [snip]

quoted 3 lines think of as just wanking to fuck with the crowd, i.e. "try and figure

> think of as just wanking to fuck with the crowd, i.e. "try and figure > out what song _this_ is!!!" I'm sorry, but that's what going to a > concert is _not_ about. When you go to a show, you're hoping to enjoy

autechre long ago established that their live shows are created on the spot every time. eric

This has to be one of the most foolish things I've ever read. Do others here actually feel this way? Are we so very, very addicted to DAT? What exactly do you think live performance is _supposed_ to be? Have you ever seen live improvisation? Did you think that to be pointless, as well? Do you think a person playing an instrument live, and creating that music *as they go* is "wanting to fuck with the crowd"? Live creation is one ofthe most awesome feats of music, in my opinion - live renditions of pre-recorded material are a mere impersonation. While interesting and satisfying in their own way, they offer no challenge to the listener, and except in extrordinary cases, nothing really unique. As for "wanting to satisfy the trainspotters in the audience" et al... merely by stating this kind of nonsense you betray your own eliter-than- elite attitude. Let me guess. You're above all this. YOu want to hear the album really loud at a party? Go throw a party, and play the album really loud. In the meantime, if you'll step away, I would have *gladly* taken your place there. eo, waiting for _her_ turn to see autechre. On Wed, 5 Aug 1998 Kreig.Zimmerman@thehartford.com wrote:

quoted 57 lines I'd say I'd have to agree wholeheartedly with the below comments. I

> I'd say I'd have to agree wholeheartedly with the below comments. I > myself saw Autechre in Jan. 96 in NYC, and I too was put off by what I > think of as just wanking to fuck with the crowd, i.e. "try and figure > out what song _this_ is!!!" I'm sorry, but that's what going to a > concert is _not_ about. When you go to a show, you're hoping to enjoy > a band's music with people who also enjoy it, a party put on by the > band itself. Now I'm no fan of bands that do verbatim renditions of > recorded material, I find that fairly uninteresting in itself. But > the Orb is a good example of an electronic group that manages to remix > their songs for live performance, making them new and exciting, yet > keeping them recognizable at the same time. Yet Autechre seems to > have decided that in order to be taken seriously "live" they have to > completely remake all their songs with virtually nothing remaining > from the originals. This may make them feel like they're s00perk00l > and may satisfy the trainspotters in the audience, but for the vast > majority who's seeking a more visceral thrill, it simply seems > pretentious, a bunch of techno-geeks pulling noise out of their arses. > > I doubt I'd ever go to another one of their so-called live shows. > > > ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ > Subject: (idm) RE: AE in Vancouver > > [snip] > > It was a real disappointment for me because I am a really big > fan. But as is often the case with live electronic acts, Autechre saw > fit to completely dissect all of their songs and reassemble the parts > into much grungier, less danceable, and in my opinion, less enjoyable > tracks. > > The formula went like this for several songs: Start with a > stunning AE beat that causes the whole crowd to go nuts and scream and > begin to dance. Layer sound->layer->layer->layer->watch crowd stop > dancing and start scratching their heads. Either that or they were > > I can appreciate that the audience would want to hear artful > rearrangement of their songs, but these tracks were beyond the pale in > terms of experimentation. They were frequently undanceable (when I say > that I don't mean 'they weren't 4/4 I couldn't handbag around the > dancefloor whine whine' I mean they were grating and inaccessible when > compared to the tens of songs that they have that make you want to wig > out). > > Why don't they play the songs that are full of amazing melodies > that everyone loves? Why does a live concert from them (and others, > notably Aphex) consist of a sonic middle finger to people that pay good > money to hear what they like? > > The argument goes, "If you just wanted to hear the same music > played live, then why not just stay home and crank up your stereo to get > the effect?" to which I reply that in this case, Autechre overshot the > space where artist and audience meet to have a good time. > > [snip] >

-- greyrose@nervosa.sf.ca.us http://www.extortion.com "Millions of human hands at work, billions of minds...a vast network, screaming with life: an organism. A natural organism." - Max Cohen, in the motion picture pi

Kreig.Zimmerman@thehartford.com wrote:

quoted 4 lines I'd say I'd have to agree wholeheartedly with the below comments. I

> I'd say I'd have to agree wholeheartedly with the below comments. I > myself saw Autechre in Jan. 96 in NYC, and I too was put off by what I > think of as just wanking to fuck with the crowd, i.e. "try and figure > out what song _this_ is!!!"

that's the fun of it.

quoted 4 lines I'm sorry, but that's what going to a

> I'm sorry, but that's what going to a > concert is _not_ about. When you go to a show, you're hoping to enjoy > a band's music with people who also enjoy it, a party put on by the > band itself.

well no, that's why _you_ go to a show...that's not why _I_ go. I didn't see unhappy people there, they were just a tad too static.there was still uproarious applause at the end of each "song".

quoted 5 lines Now I'm no fan of bands that do verbatim renditions of

> Now I'm no fan of bands that do verbatim renditions of > recorded material, I find that fairly uninteresting in itself. But > the Orb is a good example of an electronic group that manages to remix > their songs for live performance, making them new and exciting, yet > keeping them recognizable at the same time.

very true they are brilliant live, but that's how _they_ perform.

quoted 7 lines Yet Autechre seems to

> Yet Autechre seems to > have decided that in order to be taken seriously "live" they have to > completely remake all their songs with virtually nothing remaining > from the originals. This may make them feel like they're s00perk00l > and may satisfy the trainspotters in the audience, but for the vast > majority who's seeking a more visceral thrill, it simply seems > pretentious, a bunch of techno-geeks pulling noise out of their arses.

or maybe they like to mix things up a bit to keep it interesting for _them_. again I'll state that I don't want musicians(or any artist) to pander to my needs that's not what art is about. I let them do what they do and enjoy it or not, it's like having a whole new album, what's the complaint?

quoted 3 lines I doubt I'd ever go to another one of their so-called live shows.

> > > I doubt I'd ever go to another one of their so-called live shows.

oh I will I've waited a long time to see them live .....anyway too each thier own.... spaul

quoted 2 lines

> >

quoted 4 lines I'd say I'd have to agree wholeheartedly with the below comments. I

> I'd say I'd have to agree wholeheartedly with the below comments. I > myself saw Autechre in Jan. 96 in NYC, and I too was put off by what I > think of as just wanking to fuck with the crowd, i.e. "try and figure > out what song _this_ is!!!"

what concert is about is up to performer not to audience - hence the distinction between the two. i didn't see them in Vancouver, but Ae show at Vinyl was really good, as was their show at cloudwatch. If you go to a live performance expecting to hear the same tracks you can listen to on cd, why bother to go at all? stay home! save some $$$!

Well, I guess the point is keeping it interesting for them is not necessarily the same as keeping us involved... for a band to be that disregarding of the desires of their audience is pretty off-putting, if you ask me. But it just goes to show why a live techno act is not treated the same as a live band. At any rate, it's not that I want my needs pandered to per se, I'd just like to be given some respect as a fan and be met 50/50. When they do what they do live, it's more like 95/5. And yes it may be like having a whole new album, but can't they do improv _and_ play some things somewhat resembling mainstays? I'd certainly be down with that... I mean, fact is, since almost no djs play any Autechre, how will we ever hear those tracks if not live, from them? That was one of the main reason I went back when... ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: (idm) RE: AE in Vancouver Author: spaul@radical.ca at SMTP Date: 8/6/98 10:27 AM Kreig.Zimmerman@thehartford.com wrote:

quoted 7 lines Yet Autechre seems to

> Yet Autechre seems to > have decided that in order to be taken seriously "live" they have to > completely remake all their songs with virtually nothing remaining > from the originals. This may make them feel like they're s00perk00l > and may satisfy the trainspotters in the audience, but for the vast > majority who's seeking a more visceral thrill, it simply seems > pretentious, a bunch of techno-geeks pulling noise out of their arses.

or maybe they like to mix things up a bit to keep it interesting for _them_. again I'll state that I don't want musicians(or any artist) to pander to my needs that's not what art is about. I let them do what they do and enjoy it or not, it's like having a whole new album, what's the complaint? spaul

ninphil wrote:

quoted 18 lines Well, I guess the point is keeping it interesting for them is not

> > >Well, I guess the point is keeping it interesting for them is not > > necessarily the same as keeping us involved... for a band to be that > > disregarding of the desires of their audience is pretty off-putting, > > if you ask me. But it just goes to show why a live techno act is not > > treated the same as a live band. At any rate, it's not that I want my > > needs pandered to per se, I'd just like to be given some respect as a > > fan and be met 50/50. When they do what they do live, it's more like > > 95/5. And yes it may be > I don't get this complaint...you own the records rght? So you can listen > to those any day...personally watching a show of stuff I've never heard > before is more interesting...not less..."keeping it interesting for > themselves"...that's the best sign . Any artist that persues their own > vision and invites a live audience along with them is fine by me. Don't > be scared...live bands that jam and never play a song the same way once > are the ones who are famous for their live sets...not old wankers who > cane the same old hits the same old way.. > xxxoooo

'cept for the Rolling Stones...

quoted 8 lines Well, I guess the point is keeping it interesting for them is not

>Well, I guess the point is keeping it interesting for them is not > necessarily the same as keeping us involved... for a band to be that > disregarding of the desires of their audience is pretty off-putting, > if you ask me. But it just goes to show why a live techno act is not > treated the same as a live band. At any rate, it's not that I want my > needs pandered to per se, I'd just like to be given some respect as a > fan and be met 50/50. When they do what they do live, it's more like > 95/5. And yes it may be

I don't get this complaint...you own the records rght? So you can listen to those any day...personally watching a show of stuff I've never heard before is more interesting...not less..."keeping it interesting for themselves"...that's the best sign . Any artist that persues their own vision and invites a live audience along with them is fine by me. Don't be scared...live bands that jam and never play a song the same way once are the ones who are famous for their live sets...not old wankers who cane the same old hits the same old way.. xxxoooo ninja phil stealthy not wealthy

Look, Greyrose, before you tear me a new asshole, why don't you re-read the below: On Wed, 5 Aug 1998 Kreig.Zimmerman@thehartford.com wrote:

quoted 1 line band itself. Now I'm no fan of bands that do verbatim renditions of >

> band itself. Now I'm no fan of bands that do verbatim renditions of >

recorded material, I find that fairly uninteresting in itself. But

quoted 1 line the Orb is a good example of an electronic group that manages to remix >

> the Orb is a good example of an electronic group that manages to remix >

their songs for live performance, making them new and exciting, yet

quoted 1 line keeping them recognizable at the same time. Yet Autechre seems to

> keeping them recognizable at the same time. Yet Autechre seems to

I already said, I _love_ improvisation. I mention the Orb as a group that does a good job of improvising live. But I don't see the point of improvising a track out of existence. OK? Call it "foolish", but I really don't need to hear that same old tired-ass "listen to the CD loud dude" argument. I didn't ask the band to play the same exact track. I'm just saying that their improvisation leaves one confused when one had expected to hear at least a friggin melody or two one recognized. I'm done now. ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: (idm) RE: AE in Vancouver Author: greyrose@nervosa.sf.ca.us at SMTP Date: 8/6/98 5:19 PM This has to be one of the most foolish things I've ever read. Do others here actually feel this way? Are we so very, very addicted to DAT? What exactly do you think live performance is _supposed_ to be? Have you ever seen live improvisation? Did you think that to be pointless, as well? Do you think a person playing an instrument [snip] eo, waiting for _her_ turn to see autechre. -- greyrose@nervosa.sf.ca.us http://www.extortion.com "Millions of human hands at work, billions of minds...a vast network, screaming with life: an organism. A natural organism." - Max Cohen, in the motion picture pi

according to the poster I made for this show, it wasthursday, july 30th 1998... with Perfume Tree and DJ Chantal(warp) ;) q ------------------------- quentin rogers http://www.teamlounge.com syntext@teamlounge.com

quoted 19 lines anyone know the date of this gig?

> anyone know the date of this gig? > > thx... > > tom w > > np: bowery electric - lushlife (yowzaa!) > > > ________________________________________________________________ > YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! > Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! > Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: > http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >

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