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Re: (idm) Second Opinions

11 messages · 9 participants · spans 4 days · search this subject
1996-04-28 05:05Miles Egan (idm) Second Opinions
1996-04-29 17:32Jon Burrell Re: (idm) Second Opinions
└─ 1996-04-30 02:31Miles Egan Re: (idm) Second Opinions
├─ 1996-04-30 03:53jabberwalqee Re: (idm) Second Opinions
└─ 1996-04-30 14:33Kent Williams Re: (idm) Second Opinions
1996-04-29 18:01Tim Zeigler Re: (idm) Second Opinions
└─ 1996-05-01 14:35Rob Thorley Re: (idm) Second Opinions
1996-04-30 04:25Aran M. Parillo Re: (idm) Second Opinions
1996-04-30 05:31Aran Parillo Re: (idm) Second Opinions
1996-05-01 06:01GD Re: (idm) Second Opinions
└─ 1996-05-01 17:16Phil Downey Re: (idm) Second Opinions
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1996-04-28 05:05Miles EganDJ Teep - Sewer Sound 60 and Pocket Bass C-60 (from the Treehouse, natch!) At the top of t
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Sat, 27 Apr 1996 22:05:24 -0700 (PDT)
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(idm) Second Opinions
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DJ Teep - Sewer Sound 60 and Pocket Bass C-60 (from the Treehouse, natch!) At the top of the menu for Teep's psychedelic breakfast is fresh hot jam on electro. These demonstrate what a DJ with the killer instinct is capable of with the right ammunition. Teep splices his vinyl with the kind of loving care that only a true beat head understands. Both tapes head straight for the heart of 90's electro-funk and bite down like a bulldog. If there's any justice the next JDJ CD will be our very own Aran Parillo. Subtropic - Homebrew CD (Reflective) This is my pick of the recent rash of "intelligent jungle" hybrids. Solid, varied rhythm programming and a fat, fat bass end brighten up yet another feather in Reflective's cap. The emphasis here is on the beats; samples and synth accents really help flesh out the sound rather than drowning it in saccharine swirls or wailing house diva like, say, T-Power or 4-Hero. This ought to knock some of the naysayers off their fence. T-Power - The Self-Evident Truth of an Intuitive Mind CD (SOUR) It's difficult to guess what inspired all the hype surrounding this album. It's certainly a very competent record, but it's also so sugary that listening past the first three tracks is an act of real self-abuse. Beats take a back seat to all kinds of cliched synthesizer noodling and fruity samples. Much of this would be better categorized as dub rather than jungle. Proceed at your own risk if you must but you're much better off with Subtropic or Plug. Kinesthesia - Empathy Box CD (Rephlex) It's difficult to avoid comparisons to Aphex. These almost classically melodic compositions evoke a fiercely lonely, melancholy atmosphere that gradually dissolves into disjointed mechanical ambiance. I can't put my finger on it, but there's something eerily masochistic and tragic informing this music. Like most other Rephlex, _Empathy Box_ builds a unique intensity with its careful, introspective restraint. Now that Grant and Richard are actually releasing records is there anything standing between them and complete IDM domination? Journeys by DJ Coldcut CD (JDJ? What label is this?) There are moments of brilliance on this CD, but too often Black and More spoil the groove in an effort to impress with their eclecticism. In ranging from acid to jungle to ambient to hip-hop and on Coldcut dilute their focus and fumble their best mixes. Ironically, the strongest segment of the disk is mixed from Coldcut's own material. Mixing the Jedi Knights' "Noddy Holder" into Plastikman is a stroke of genius, I'll admit. This *will* probably send you scurrying out to find half of the 34 records dropped into the mix, although almost certainly not Jello Biafra. Jedi Knights - New School Science CD (Universal Language/Evolution) _New School Science_ is as fun as it is goofy. The excellent "Noddy Holder" and "May the Funk Be With You" are reprised from the Clear EP, but the rest of the album is much lighter and brighter. The softcore electro-porn of "Science Friction" clanks on for a long ten minutes before the shift, but "Human Blancmage" and "Solina (the Ascenscion)" recall Reload's prettiest moments with much cleaner production and an undeniable funk. The lush, ambient "Afterlife" wraps things up and raises my hopes for the new Global Comm. album. Various - Objets D'Art 92::95 2CD (New Electronica) A superb compilation from start to finish. The tracks from Balil and Elegy stand out in an exceptional pack. If you have any interest at all in early Black Dog or the first A.I., you need this. LFO - Advance CD (Warp) _Advance_ is doomed to disappoint all the longtime LFO zealots, but, heard without preconceptions, it's an accomplished, imaginative record with plenty of ear candy for those with systems capable of reproducing it. This could be more accurately described as a Bell solo record; eight of the twelve tracks are credited to him alone. The industrial crunch of "Tied Up" breaks with the gentle, playful and melodic personality of the rest of the album. Bell's legendary attention to detail shows in the rich clean textures and in compositions with elegant structure and flow. This will surely be one of the top albums of '96. Various - It's All Becoming Clear CD (Clear) This welcome compilation draws from the increasingly rare Clear EPs to paint a gorgeous picture of an increasingly progressive label. Clear is quickly outgrowing it's retro-electro roots. The surprise standouts here are the Gregory Fleckner Quartet tracks, which skillfully bridge jazz and funk with electronics in a startlingly distinctive style. The new Plaid mix of "Angry Dolphin" infuses a heavy hip-hop energy and makes me even more impatient for their new album. The Clatterbox tracks are annoying, but they're easy to avoid on a CD. The wraparound package is clever. Muslimgauze - Islamaphobia 2CD (Staalplaat) There's no denying that Bryn has absorbed a considerable Mu-Ziq/Aphex influence. What's surprising is how seamlessly he's incorporated it and how much sense it makes in fusion with Arabic percussion styles. The mood of both disks is spontaneous and improvisational, with short tracks and a deliciously grungy mix. Rhythmic structures are more open, with a loose kinetic surge that propels these tracks into a free dynamic inconceivable on previous albums. This is probably his finest work to date. Dandy Jack - Dandy Jack and the Cosmic Trousers CD (Rather Interesting) As a mostly dance-oriented record on a predominantly ambient label, this is probably doomed to neglect. This is a shame; Dandy Jack has matched Atom Heart's inspired experimentalism with a fascinating, idiosyncratic record infinitely more sophisticated than his earlier work with Victor Sol as Xjacks. Like most of Rather Interesting's output, this is difficult to classify. There are tenuous links to house, electro, and old-school IDM, but each track is stamped with Dandy Jack's curious musical personality. The album is beat-oriented, but much more suited to careful home listening than the barbarities of the dance floor. The soulful, longing "Loa" captures a human warmth rare in this genre. Anyone with a taste for daring electronica should try these trousers on. Herbalizer - Remedies CD (Ninja Tune) The London Funk Allstars' album is too depressingly poor to review. This one falters dangerously in the middle but compensates by sandwiching its rotten core with the most ferocious hip-hop on the label. At their best, the Herbalizers downplay their labelmates' jazz obsessions and head straight for the big booming beat. The results can be astonishing. Play "Up 4 the Get Downs" for all your friends that think Wu-Tang is the only thing happening in hip-hop in '96. Various - Flexistentialism 2CD (Ninja Tune) _Flexistentialism_ is a bit of a let down. Several tracks are repeated from recent albums and many of the new tracks are mired in a lightweight hip-hop jazz that's more square than dope. Like Coldcut's mix CD, too much effort is expended in absorbing every trendy style and too little in composing tracks with real punch. That said, there's also good new stuff from DJ Food and 9 Lazy 9, as well as an Luke Vibert's utterly brilliant "Get Your Head Down." This will give newcomers a good idea of what's up at Ninja Tune these days, but you're better off buying the DJ Food, Funky Porcini, and 9 Lazy 9 albums and dodging the rest. It's hard to imagine what people find so exiting about the Squarepusher remix. I hope his own material is a bit more coherent.
1996-04-29 17:32Jon BurrellIt's all about opinions, I guess, but I can't go along with some of this. Hope you don't t
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Jon Burrell
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Mon, 29 Apr 96 18:32 BST-1
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Re: (idm) Second Opinions
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It's all about opinions, I guess, but I can't go along with some of this. Hope you don't think I'm having a go but....
quoted 9 lines Subtropic - Homebrew CD (Reflective)> Subtropic - Homebrew CD (Reflective) > This is my pick of the recent rash of "intelligent jungle" > hybrids. Solid, varied rhythm programming and a fat, fat bass end > brighten up yet another feather in Reflective's cap. The emphasis here > is > on the beats; samples and synth accents really help flesh out the sound > rather than drowning it in saccharine swirls or wailing house diva like, > say, T-Power or 4-Hero. This ought to knock some of the naysayers off > their fence.
It eludes me how this could be considered a 'best of class' release. It's not a bad album by any stretch of the imagination, but really lacks the imagination, inventiveness and fire in the belly of much of the stuff I'm hearing. We've had this debate on the list before and produced long lists of better things to spend your pennies on so I'll leave it at that.
quoted 8 lines T-Power - The Self-Evident Truth of an Intuitive Mind CD (SOUR)> T-Power - The Self-Evident Truth of an Intuitive Mind CD (SOUR) > It's difficult to guess what inspired all the hype surrounding > this album. It's certainly a very competent record, but it's also so > sugary that listening past the first three tracks is an act of real > self-abuse. Beats take a back seat to all kinds of cliched synthesizer > noodling and fruity samples. Much of this would be better categorized > as dub rather than jungle. Proceed at your own risk if you must but > you're much better off with Subtropic or Plug.
What hype ? This is ambient jungle (for want of a tag) at its best. Quality production makes the beats and 'noodles' work so well. I don't really see the direct comparison with (the indeed excellent) Plug which is seriously in yer face and experimental.
quoted 8 lines Journeys by DJ Coldcut CD (JDJ? What label is this?)> Journeys by DJ Coldcut CD (JDJ? What label is this?) > There are moments of brilliance on this CD, but too often Black > and More spoil the groove in an effort to impress with their > eclecticism. In ranging from acid to jungle to ambient to hip-hop and > on Coldcut dilute their focus and fumble their best mixes. Ironically, > the strongest segment of the disk is mixed from Coldcut's own material. > Mixing the Jedi Knights' "Noddy Holder" into Plastikman is a stroke of > genius, I'll admit. This *will* probably send you scurrying out to
find > half of the 34 records dropped into the mix, although almost certainly > not Jello Biafra. No one comes close to mixing like these boys. This is probably the finest mix CD ever !!
quoted 3 lines Various - Flexistentialism 2CD (Ninja Tune)> Various - Flexistentialism 2CD (Ninja Tune) > It's hard to imagine what people find so exiting about the Squarepusher > remix. I hope his own material is a bit more coherent.
FFS, the slow down to the cheesy bit and the way the beats cut back in make for one of the idm moments of the year so far. It's nearly summer, open your windows, play this LOUD ! Jon Burrell - cage rattled :) OnNow: Orbital - In Sides (forgive and forget for The Box single, eh ? )
1996-04-30 02:31Miles EganOn Mon, 29 Apr 1996, Jon Burrell wrote: > > Subtropic - Homebrew CD (Reflective) > It elud
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Mon, 29 Apr 1996 19:31:22 -0700 (PDT)
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On Mon, 29 Apr 1996, Jon Burrell wrote:
quoted 6 lines Subtropic - Homebrew CD (Reflective)> > Subtropic - Homebrew CD (Reflective) > It eludes me how this could be considered a 'best of class' release. It's > not a bad album by any stretch of the imagination, but really lacks the > imagination, inventiveness and fire in the belly of much of the stuff I'm > hearing. We've had this debate on the list before and produced long lists > of better things to spend your pennies on so I'll leave it at that.
True. I've heard most of them, however, and I'm still much more impressed with Subtropic. The Plug album will probably unseat it, but this is easily the pick of the bunch I've heard.
quoted 5 lines T-Power - The Self-Evident Truth of an Intuitive Mind CD (SOUR)> > T-Power - The Self-Evident Truth of an Intuitive Mind CD (SOUR) > What hype ? This is ambient jungle (for want of a tag) at its best. > Quality production makes the beats and 'noodles' work so well. I don't > really see the direct comparison with (the indeed excellent) Plug which > is seriously in yer face and experimental.
I can't remember how many times I was promised that this album was going to force me to change all my opinions of jungle. The entire album is extremely *competent*, but it's also cheesier than gouda. Replace the breaks in "Circle" with your standard four-on-the-floor and you've got just another ho-hum trance record that nobody with a clue would bother themselves with these days. I can easily imagine pushing a shopping cart around K-Mart to the opening strains of "Trapezium." The second half of the album IS less sugary and a bit more interesting. I like the idea of a smart IDM/jungle hybrid, but this just isn't it. I've just drifted into the section of "Octagon" with the sampled strings and shakuhachi. Deep Forest drum n' bass anyone? I've got to shut this off now...
quoted 4 lines Journeys by DJ Coldcut CD (JDJ? What label is this?)> > Journeys by DJ Coldcut CD (JDJ? What label is this?) > > No one comes close to mixing like these boys. This is probably the finest > mix CD ever !!
You've heard them all, then? I wasn't trying to criticize this on technical grounds. My point was that they try to cover too much ground and shift gears every time they work their way into a good groove.
quoted 4 lines Various - Flexistentialism 2CD (Ninja Tune)> > Various - Flexistentialism 2CD (Ninja Tune) > FFS, the slow down to the cheesy bit and the way the beats cut back in > make for one of the idm moments of the year so far. It's nearly summer, > open your windows, play this LOUD !
I like the drum n' bass at the beginning, although it doesn't sound qualitatively different from the rest of this stuff I've heard. However, the "jazzy" bit in the middle really is in poor taste. (up on the soapbox) Why is it that whenever an electronic musician borrows from jazz it's always the corny middle-of-the-road boring lounge jazz that no real jazz head has taken seriously since my father was in diapers? Luke Vibert can appropriate this style to good *deliberate* ironic effect, but everybody else seems to think they're really jamming. I'd like to hear somebody take a good whiff of Albert Ayler or Cecil Taylor up their sampler. Why doesn't somebody take some chances?!?!
quoted 1 line OnNow: Orbital - In Sides (forgive and forget for The Box single, eh ? )> OnNow: Orbital - In Sides (forgive and forget for The Box single, eh ? )
So, it's out, I take it? How is it? On: Yoni - Spirit of Adventure Off: T-Power
1996-04-30 03:53jabberwalqee> (up on the soapbox) > > Why is it that whenever an electronic musician borrows from jazz
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jabberwalqee
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Mon, 29 Apr 1996 23:53:23 -0400 (EDT)
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quoted 9 lines (up on the soapbox)> (up on the soapbox) > > Why is it that whenever an electronic musician borrows from jazz it's > always the corny middle-of-the-road boring lounge jazz that no real jazz > head has taken seriously since my father was in diapers? Luke Vibert can > appropriate this style to good *deliberate* ironic effect, but everybody > else seems to think they're really jamming. I'd like to hear somebody > take a good whiff of Albert Ayler or Cecil Taylor up their sampler. Why > doesn't somebody take some chances?!?!
i whole heartedly agree, this predominating lounge jazz style is some very very weak shit. how about throwing in a little Bix Beiderbecke or Kid Memphis? something that actually stomps imhomelette, j
1996-04-30 14:33Kent WilliamsOn Mon, 29 Apr 1996, Miles Egan wrote: > > Why is it that whenever an electronic musician
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Kent Williams
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Tue, 30 Apr 1996 09:33:27 -0500 (CDT)
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On Mon, 29 Apr 1996, Miles Egan wrote:
quoted 9 lines Why is it that whenever an electronic musician borrows from jazz it's> > Why is it that whenever an electronic musician borrows from jazz it's > always the corny middle-of-the-road boring lounge jazz that no real jazz > head has taken seriously since my father was in diapers? Luke Vibert can > appropriate this style to good *deliberate* ironic effect, but everybody > else seems to think they're really jamming. I'd like to hear somebody > take a good whiff of Albert Ayler or Cecil Taylor up their sampler. Why > doesn't somebody take some chances?!?! >
Because they're not really concerned with jazz, have never listened seriously to jazz, and don't understand the discipline. Mostly they use their computer sequencers to do transpositions for them, rather than learn to play on the black and white keys at the same time. It's a matter of settling for jazz-like rather than jazz. If you want to sound 'jazz-like' you can do it without much though. Just add the major seventh to your chords (a major seventh is the note right below the root note of the chord. For example, C major is CEG, and C Major 7 is CEGB). Then if you transpose up a half step, you sound very jazzlike. I've resisted acid jazz as a trend as well because I have a lot of the blue note records from the late 60's/early 70's that the style is based on, and they just don't measure up. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Unintentional Internet Humor (and I'm not making this up!): "Could someone please define 'AMBIENT' (This question is completly rhetorical)" -- some guy called 'JPM' "Why my source is crazy? He play without my hands, and don't hold down the presets, he change it when he wants, I don't try to use it in any mode, he starts the sequence or the arpeggiators, who can explain me my source crazy?" - Daniele Viali Kent Williams kent@inav.net (319) 338 6053 (home) (319) 626 6700 x 219 (work) (319) 626 3489 (fax)
1996-04-29 18:01Tim Zeigler> > Journeys by DJ Coldcut CD (JDJ? What label is this?) > > There are moments of brillian
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Tim Zeigler
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Mon, 29 Apr 1996 18:01:22 +0000
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Re: (idm) Second Opinions
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quoted 7 lines Journeys by DJ Coldcut CD (JDJ? What label is this?)> > Journeys by DJ Coldcut CD (JDJ? What label is this?) > > There are moments of brilliance on this CD, but too often Black > > and More spoil the groove in an effort to impress with their > > eclecticism. In ranging from acid to jungle to ambient to hip-hop > > No one comes close to mixing like these boys. This is probably the finest > mix CD ever !!
I'm suspecting that the DJ's on this list probably appreciate this disc more so than us normal folk :-) I found it meandering all over the place and lacking the ebb and flow I usually look for in a good release. Is this also true with _Tone Tales from Tomorrow Too_?
quoted 7 lines Various - Flexistentialism 2CD (Ninja Tune)> > Various - Flexistentialism 2CD (Ninja Tune) > > It's hard to imagine what people find so exiting about the Squarepusher > > remix. I hope his own material is a bit more coherent. > > FFS, the slow down to the cheesy bit and the way the beats cut back in > make for one of the idm moments of the year so far. It's nearly summer, > open your windows, play this LOUD !
I too couldn't understand the hype over the Squarepusher track. I'm hoping that his other material is beyond what's here.
1996-05-01 14:35Rob ThorleyOn Mon, 29 Apr 1996, Tim Zeigler wrote: > > > > Journeys by DJ Coldcut CD (JDJ? What label
From:
Rob Thorley
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Tim Zeigler
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Wed, 1 May 1996 15:35:51 +0100 (BST)
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Re: (idm) Second Opinions
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On Mon, 29 Apr 1996, Tim Zeigler wrote:
quoted 9 lines Journeys by DJ Coldcut CD (JDJ? What label is this?)> > > > Journeys by DJ Coldcut CD (JDJ? What label is this?) > > > There are moments of brilliance on this CD, but too often Black > > > and More spoil the groove in an effort to impress with their > > > eclecticism. In ranging from acid to jungle to ambient to hip-hop > I'm suspecting that the DJ's on this list probably appreciate this > disc more so than us normal folk :-) I found it meandering all > over the place and lacking the ebb and flow I usually look for in a > good release.
in some places i reckoned the mixing sucked - especially going from fast to slow, ie. into ambient. But it's a good head trip, and the way plastikman is mixed in is orgasmic. Rob.
1996-04-30 04:25Aran M. Parillomiles postulates.. >If there's any justice the next JDJ CD will be our very own Aran Paril
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Aran M. Parillo
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Mon, 29 Apr 1996 23:25:42 -0500
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Re: (idm) Second Opinions
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miles postulates..
quoted 1 line If there's any justice the next JDJ CD will be our very own Aran Parillo.>If there's any justice the next JDJ CD will be our very own Aran Parillo.
I'll settle for just the next BLECH warp mixed tape ...ahem ...G! Actually I should take this opportunity to mention the next mixed tape coming out from under the Rorschach Tekniques LTD umbrella is a "SIDE EACH" 90 minute mix by matthew lehrer and me titled SPY vs SPY. Cassettes will be black and white of course and I'm still fleshing out the artwork but you MAD Magazine fans know it's going to be the BOMB. bhoom it! Teep on now: q - chastic (RELAX! it's only art 2 cd)
1996-04-30 05:31Aran Parillo>Why is it that whenever an electronic musician borrows from jazz it's >always the corny m
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Aran Parillo
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Tue, 30 Apr 1996 00:31:35 -0500
Subject:
Re: (idm) Second Opinions
permalink · <v02140b03adab5362c682@[18.162.0.98]>
quoted 3 lines Why is it that whenever an electronic musician borrows from jazz it's>Why is it that whenever an electronic musician borrows from jazz it's >always the corny middle-of-the-road boring lounge jazz that no real jazz >head has taken seriously [use of the word diaper deleted]
Um, does Fruitopia have anything to do with this?
quoted 1 line a good whiff of Albert Ayler or Cecil Taylor up their sampler.>a good whiff of Albert Ayler or Cecil Taylor up their sampler.
I think it's usually pretty much clear who can really play and who's fronting.
quoted 1 line Whydoesn't somebody take some chances?!?!>Whydoesn't somebody take some chances?!?!
Whoopie! Teep on now: beats upon beats non stop
1996-05-01 06:01GDKent Williams wrote: > > Why is it that whenever an electronic musician borrows from jazz
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GD
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Date:
Wed, 01 May 1996 01:01:49 -0500
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Re: (idm) Second Opinions
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Kent Williams wrote:
quoted 7 lines Why is it that whenever an electronic musician borrows from jazz it's> > Why is it that whenever an electronic musician borrows from jazz it's > > always the corny middle-of-the-road boring lounge jazz that no real jazz > > head has taken seriously since my father was in diapers? Luke Vibert can > > appropriate this style to good *deliberate* ironic effect, but everybody > > else seems to think they're really jamming. I'd like to hear somebody > > take a good whiff of Albert Ayler or Cecil Taylor up their sampler. Why > > doesn't somebody take some chances?!?!
Hmmm...it seems to me that Luke Vibert really digs some jazz himself (check the sax section bit on the Plug remix of the recent Jammin' Unit 12") - he doesn't always seem to be employing irony in his choice of samples. Some of Throbbing Pouch does have some of that cheeky George Benson-style jazzak, though...
quoted 5 lines If you want to sound 'jazz-like' you can do it without much though. Just> If you want to sound 'jazz-like' you can do it without much though. Just > add the major seventh to your chords (a major seventh is the note right > below the root note of the chord. For example, C major is CEG, and C Major 7 > is CEGB). Then if you transpose up a half step, you sound very > jazzlike.
Major 7? Shirley you mean C7 (with a flat 7 as the top note (C E G Bb), that's really more of a jazz thang. Major 7ths have quite a hymn-like, majestic sense to them, especially if you double the 7th e.g. BEGB/C... GD
1996-05-01 17:16Phil DowneyOn Wed, 1 May 1996, GD wrote: > Kent Williams wrote: > > > > If you want to sound 'jazz-li
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Wed, 1 May 1996 13:16:12 -0400 (EDT)
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On Wed, 1 May 1996, GD wrote:
quoted 15 lines Kent Williams wrote:> Kent Williams wrote: > > > > If you want to sound 'jazz-like' you can do it without much though. Just > > add the major seventh to your chords (a major seventh is the note right > > below the root note of the chord. For example, C major is CEG, and C Major 7 > > is CEGB). Then if you transpose up a half step, you sound very > > jazzlike. > > Major 7? Shirley you mean C7 (with a flat 7 as the top note (C E G Bb), that's really > more of a jazz thang. Major 7ths have quite a hymn-like, majestic sense to them, > especially if you double the 7th e.g. BEGB/C... > > GD >
No, I believe Kent does mean Cmaj7. (Not that Kent can't speak for himself.) But the Cmaj7 has been used for many a moon in jazz. The C7 is actually more of a blues chord. (see any blues record ;)). The Cmaj7 has quite a broken feel to it, and is quite unlike the C7 chord. C7 does sound quite majestic. To see this look at the chorus of 'Shake it Up' by the Beatles, or for a more idm approach listen to Grandmaster Flash's sample of the Beatles on 'White Lines'. (or some other track of his, maybe the Message.) obidm: Count me in on the 'LOVE IT' side of Orbital's the Box. Wonderful rhythms, with a very Latin feel to it. Also, the Orbital album kicks. Don't get my own copy (ltd. edition box) till next week, but the short review is : Green album rhythms, with very lush melodies. Essential. Phil Downey