IDM Mailing Archive

2003-11-25 20:50chthonic---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "Eggy Toast" <eggy@eg

From:: chthonic <chthonic@chthonicstreams.com>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.org>
Date:: Tue, 25 Nov 2003 12:50:25 -0800
Subject:: Re: [idm] ubiquitous sony

---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "Eggy Toast" <eggy@eggtastic.com> Reply-To: eggy@eggtastic.com Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2003 15:33:18 -0500 (EST)

quoted 2 lines It's little wonder we haven't seen them try to build houses and

>It's little wonder we haven't seen them try to build houses and >apartments to house the artists in question, forcing them to live

there

quoted 1 line and pay rent, giving even more money back to Sony ;D

>and pay rent, giving even more money back to Sony ;D

does sony own any recording studios? that would hit the artists two ways at once. a lot of bands move into a studio (such as the house where both the cure and radiohead recorded albums). if sony (or any other label) owned any of those, they'd be making the money back that was spent making the album as well as housing them. not to mention the in-house chef... d. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

2003-11-25 23:58Aaron Trumm> does sony own any recording studios? that would hit the artists > two ways at once. a lo

From:: Aaron Trumm <aaron@nquit.com>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.org>
Date:: Tue, 25 Nov 2003 17:58:12 -0600
Subject:: Re: [idm] ubiquitous sony

quoted 6 lines does sony own any recording studios? that would hit the artists

> does sony own any recording studios? that would hit the artists > two ways at once. a lot of bands move into a studio (such as the > house where both the cure and radiohead recorded albums). if > sony (or any other label) owned any of those, they'd be making the > money back that was spent making the album as well as housing > them. not to mention the in-house chef...

Sony has its own studios, yes, as do a lot of labels. I don't suppose the artists get charged for studio time, per se, but I do suppose that in some cases, if Sony funds your recording, they do so by sending you to their studio...this probably depends on the project and artist in question. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

2003-11-26 01:54chthonic streams"Aaron Trumm" <aaron@nquit.com> > > does sony own any recording studios? that would hit th

From:: chthonic streams <chthonic@chthonicstreams.com>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.org>
Date:: Tue, 25 Nov 2003 20:54:38 -0500
Subject:: Re: [idm] ubiquitous sony
Reply to:: Re: [idm] ubiquitous sony

"Aaron Trumm" <aaron@nquit.com>

quoted 11 lines does sony own any recording studios? that would hit the artists

> > does sony own any recording studios? that would hit the artists >> two ways at once. a lot of bands move into a studio (such as the >> house where both the cure and radiohead recorded albums). if >> sony (or any other label) owned any of those, they'd be making the >> money back that was spent making the album as well as housing >> them. not to mention the in-house chef... > >Sony has its own studios, yes, as do a lot of labels. I don't suppose the >artists get charged for studio time, per se, but I do suppose that in some >cases, if Sony funds your recording, they do so by sending you to their >studio...this probably depends on the project and artist in question.

oh, i beg to differ. a label doesn't run its studios for free. it's a business, and anyone who has the money can book time. just because an artist is on one of their labels doesn't mean they're going to let them have a free ride. what if, they can argue, another client wanted to book that time? then they've lost that money. so everyone pays. especially because a lot of major labels own any number of subsidiary labels - all technically separate companies. they'll charge the artist's advance against royalties. the money goes out and comes right back in the company. this happens in all kinds of different businesses. d. -- http://www.chthonicstreams.com http://www.dreamintodust.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

2003-11-26 10:10john tuffenThis is all very interesting, but nothing new... Thinking of the various 'philanthropic' f

From:: john tuffen <john@namke.com>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.org>
Date:: Wed, 26 Nov 2003 10:10:20 +0000
Subject:: Re: [idm] ubiquitous sony
Reply to:: Re: [idm] ubiquitous sony

This is all very interesting, but nothing new... Thinking of the various 'philanthropic' factory owners in the 18th/19th/20th century in the UK (Salt, Rowntree, Crittall... - there are no doubt others) who were applauded for providing housing (and, in some cases, building villages close to the workplace (Salt -> Saltaire, Bradford; Rowntree -> New Earswick, York; Crittall -> Silver End, Essex)). Some might say that these philanthropic ventures were very selfish - the workers work in the factories, then have to pay their employers rent... Of course, in the above cases, housing was quite often pretty shitty and the workers were actually getting a good deal; with regard to Sony and it's studios, perhaps beneficial rates apply? Perhaps better engineers/producers get involved that otherwise would be out of the band's reach..?? john.. Quoting chthonic streams <chthonic@chthonicstreams.com>:

quoted 39 lines "Aaron Trumm" <aaron@nquit.com>

> "Aaron Trumm" <aaron@nquit.com> > > > > > does sony own any recording studios? that would hit the artists > >> two ways at once. a lot of bands move into a studio (such as the > >> house where both the cure and radiohead recorded albums). if > >> sony (or any other label) owned any of those, they'd be making the > >> money back that was spent making the album as well as housing > >> them. not to mention the in-house chef... > > > >Sony has its own studios, yes, as do a lot of labels. I don't suppose the > >artists get charged for studio time, per se, but I do suppose that in some > >cases, if Sony funds your recording, they do so by sending you to their > >studio...this probably depends on the project and artist in question. > > oh, i beg to differ. a label doesn't run its studios for free. it's > a business, and anyone who has the money can book time. just because > an artist is on one of their labels doesn't mean they're going to let > them have a free ride. what if, they can argue, another client > wanted to book that time? then they've lost that money. so everyone > pays. especially because a lot of major labels own any number of > subsidiary labels - all technically separate companies. they'll > charge the artist's advance against royalties. the money goes out > and comes right back in the company. this happens in all kinds of > different businesses. > > > d. > > -- > > http://www.chthonicstreams.com > http://www.dreamintodust.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > >

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2003-11-26 07:11Aaron Trumm> oh, i beg to differ. a label doesn't run its studios for free. it's > a business, and an

From:: Aaron Trumm <aaron@nquit.com>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.org>, chthonic streams <chthonic@chthonicstreams.com>
Date:: Wed, 26 Nov 2003 01:11:12 -0600
Subject:: Re: [idm] ubiquitous sony

quoted 10 lines oh, i beg to differ. a label doesn't run its studios for free. it's

> oh, i beg to differ. a label doesn't run its studios for free. it's > a business, and anyone who has the money can book time. just because > an artist is on one of their labels doesn't mean they're going to let > them have a free ride. what if, they can argue, another client > wanted to book that time? then they've lost that money. so everyone > pays. especially because a lot of major labels own any number of > subsidiary labels - all technically separate companies. they'll > charge the artist's advance against royalties. the money goes out > and comes right back in the company. this happens in all kinds of > different businesses.

well, yeah, of course they don't just spend the money, they'll want to recoup it directly on a given project. although it is conceivable that an artist or a small label with enough clout and a good enough lawyer could manage to negotiate a contract where the funds for the record are not recoupable - but even without that, you're not likely to pay rate out of pocket if you're on the label like you said, the way it usually works is, the label funds the album project, and this cost is recoupable later on out of the artist's share of album sales, which basically means that the label gives you the opportunity that you wouldn't have had, but they stick you with the risk. so in the wash, you've funded the record. another way that it's done sometimes is the label will give a bigger advance and expect the artist to fund the record. and of course then there's P&D deals, where the artist or smaller label takes full responsibility for funding recording, and then the bigger label handles pressing, promotion and distribution (and, unless you've really got a bad lawyer :), gives you a larger percentage of sales) now this where I don't have a clear understanding - does Sony pay itself for studio time? Knowing a bit about how Shell Oil works (my girlfriend works there :) ), I would say that in fact, yes it does. At Shell, one department will come to my girlfriend's department and pay them for their time, and in fact, her department has to compete for their business, as they have full freedom to buy the services outside of the company. Obviously any contract with any set of agreements is possible. I don't suppose it's necessarily true, however, that anyone with money can book time in any studio. I imagine there are plenty of private commercial quality studios that are not open for business. I say this because my studio (not commercial quality *laugh*) is not open for business, and I know other people who basically feel the same way. (I do not, by the way, charge myself for studio time :) ). anyway, I guess it's sort of stupid to conjecture about what they do as if they didn't exist and we couldn't just ASK them. But since that's a bit inconveinent right NOW, we discuss a little --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

2003-11-27 14:36nethedExcuse me for jumping in late in the streams - the Major label structure can be a beast to

From:: nethed <nethed@ninjatune.net>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.org>
Date:: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 14:36:17 +0000
Subject:: Re: [idm] ubiquitous sony
Reply to:: Re: [idm] ubiquitous sony

Excuse me for jumping in late in the streams - the Major label structure can be a beast to decipher. The major publishing companies (at least in the UK) all at one time had recording studios for demoing songs, etc. Some have closed, and I understood Sony's in the UK was in process of closing this year if it hasn't already. I think Universal may still have their studio running in the UK. Publishers - including independent ones - and labels also have affiliate deals with studios they've worked with so that if they dont have a study, they may have a "writing room" in a studio somewhere on a retainer that can be used. When a record label and/or a publisher puts you in the studio there is always a charge for the time and services, ie, engineer, etc. And depending on what the deal is, at some point this will appear against an advance and in some instances you might even have trouble accessing the masters depending on what agreement you put your signature on and how much money you've got upfront. And because a recording studio bears the name Sony recording that doesnt necessarily have anything to do with Sony Music or Sony Music Publishing or Sony Playstation or Sony Walkman. Here's a kind of interesting resource on how things run but it does have a UK bias: http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio1/onemusic At 1:11 am -0600 26/11/03, Aaron Trumm wrote:

quoted 49 lines oh, i beg to differ. a label doesn't run its studios for free. it's

> > oh, i beg to differ. a label doesn't run its studios for free. it's >> a business, and anyone who has the money can book time. just because >> an artist is on one of their labels doesn't mean they're going to let >> them have a free ride. what if, they can argue, another client >> wanted to book that time? then they've lost that money. so everyone >> pays. especially because a lot of major labels own any number of >> subsidiary labels - all technically separate companies. they'll >> charge the artist's advance against royalties. the money goes out >> and comes right back in the company. this happens in all kinds of >> different businesses. > >well, yeah, of course they don't just spend the money, they'll want to >recoup it directly on a given project. although it is conceivable that an >artist or a small label with enough clout and a good enough lawyer could >manage to negotiate a contract where the funds for the record are not >recoupable - but even without that, you're not likely to pay rate out of >pocket if you're on the label > >like you said, the way it usually works is, the label funds the album >project, and this cost is recoupable later on out of the artist's share of >album sales, which basically means that the label gives you the opportunity >that you wouldn't have had, but they stick you with the risk. so in the >wash, you've funded the record. another way that it's done sometimes is the >label will give a bigger advance and expect the artist to fund the record. >and of course then there's P&D deals, where the artist or smaller label >takes full responsibility for funding recording, and then the bigger label >handles pressing, promotion and distribution (and, unless you've really got >a bad lawyer :), gives you a larger percentage of sales) > >now this where I don't have a clear understanding - does Sony pay itself for >studio time? Knowing a bit about how Shell Oil works (my girlfriend works >there :) ), I would say that in fact, yes it does. At Shell, one department >will come to my girlfriend's department and pay them for their time, and in >fact, her department has to compete for their business, as they have full >freedom to buy the services outside of the company. > >Obviously any contract with any set of agreements is possible. > >I don't suppose it's necessarily true, however, that anyone with money can >book time in any studio. I imagine there are plenty of private commercial >quality studios that are not open for business. I say this because my >studio (not commercial quality *laugh*) is not open for business, and I know >other people who basically feel the same way. (I do not, by the way, charge >myself for studio time :) ). > >anyway, I guess it's sort of stupid to conjecture about what they do as if >they didn't exist and we couldn't just ASK them. But since that's a bit >inconveinent right NOW, we discuss a little >

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2003-11-27 15:47arc.anonimoTo: nettime-lat@nettime.org Subject: [nettime-lat] // MUTEK_México Música, sonido y Nuevas

From:: arc.anonimo <arcangel@unosunosyunosceros.com>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.org>
Date:: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 09:47:15 -0600
Subject:: [idm] mutek mexico >
Reply to:: Re: [idm] ubiquitous sony

To: nettime-lat@nettime.org Subject: [nettime-lat] // MUTEK_México Música, sonido y Nuevas Tecnologías / Montreal http://www.mutek.ca México DF, Noviembre, 28 y 29, 2003 // Sedes: _Laboratorio de Arte Alameda, Museo Tamayo de Arte Contemporáneo y Universidad del Claustro de Sor Juana _Universidad del Claustro de Sor Juana: Izazaga no. 92, Centro Histórico T. 5130-3300 _Museo Tamayo de Arte Contemporáneo: Paseo de la Reforma y Gandhi S/N T. 5286-6519 _Laboratorio de Arte Alameda: Dr. Mora no. 7 Centro Histórico T. 5510-2793 / 5512-2079 ] // Viernes 28 de noviembre: MUTEK__Intersección paneles y conferencias _Coctél Inaugural MUTEK DF 12:00 hrs. @ Laboratorio Arte Alameda Conferencias y panel de discusión : Vanguardia y periferia, la música experimental en el contexto de Latinoamérica + Carlos Prieto : moderador + Ejival [Static Discos] + Alain Mongeau [Festival MUTEK] + Manrico Montero [Igloo Música] + Ernesto Priego [Seminario Políticas de la Memoria / UNAM] 14:00 hrs. / nave prinicipal digital jamm session _conflux: intervención de audio e imagen + [ Deadbeat vs Manrico Montero / www.zonadefault.com vs www.nuzita.net ] Entrada libre / cupo limitado // MUTEK__Diurno Redefiniendo la experiencia sonora y musical a través de la tecnología digital, la improvisación y la experimentación electroacústica. Cyberlounge : Foro Sonoro_ Inmerso 17:00 hrs. @ Museo Tamayo + Manuel Rocha México / visuales: M. Rocha + Alex Casales México visuales: A. Casales + Ghiz aka Mario de Vega [Igloo Música] México / visuales: Laura Carmona [ www.p-u-a.org ] + Tim Hecker [Alien 8, Fat Cat, Force Inc., Mille Plateaux] / visuales: arc.byn Entrada libre / cupo limitado // Sábado 29 de noviembre MUTEK__Intersección paneles y conferencias 12:00 hrs @ Laboratorio Arte Alameda _Conferencias y panel de discusión: El lugar de la voz humana en la música digital + Carlos Prieto : moderador + Inti Meza Villarino [Formas CNA] + Álvaro Ruiz [Igloo Música] + Tim Hecker [Alien 8, Fat Cat, Force Inc., Mille Plateaux] + Marc Leclair aka Akufen [Trapez, Force Inc., Perlon, Musique Risquée] + [ Demostración y procesamiento digital de voz en tiempo real por Álvaro Ruiz y Marc Leclair ] 14:00 hrs. / nave prinicipal digital jamm session _conflux: intervención de audio e imagen + [ Álvaro Ruiz vs Tim Hecker / ivan abreu - www.espaciosinaire.com vs. arcángel constantini - www.unosunosyunosceros.com ] Entrada libre / cupo limitado // MUTEK__Diurno Redifiniendo la experiencia sonora y musical a través de la tecnología digital, la improvisación y la experimentación @ Cyberlounge : Foro Sonoro_ Inmerso 17:00 hrs / Museo Tamayo. + Alejandro Morse México [Igloo Música] visuales: miguel mendoza [ www.porlotanto.com ] + Manrico Montero México [Igloo Música] visuales guillermo amato [inova] + Arthur Henry Fork México [Igloo Música] visuales: ark.factor.Y + Skoltz Kolgen Montreal [Line, MUTEK_Rec] visuales: skoltz kolgen Entrada libre / cupo limitado // MUTEK__Nocturno Reformulando la experiencia clásica del tecno, la pista de baile transformada en campo de experimentación, un nuevo horizonte de disfrute. 21:00 hrs. @ Universidad del Claustro de Sor Juana + Carlos Garcia México [Konfort] + Duopandamix México [Static] + The Mole and the starchy root machine Montreal [MUTEK] + Plug México [Filtro] + Sutekh USA [Context, Force Inc.] + Mike Shannon Montreal [Cynosure, Force Inc.] + Deadbeat Montreal [Scape, Revolver] + Cultfilter México + Champion Montreal [MUTEK_Rec] + Fax México (Static) + Akufen Montreal [Trapez, Force Inc., Perlon, Musique Risquée] + Crackhaus Montreal [Onitor] + Egg Montreal [MUTEK_Rec] + Zofa México [Konfort] // intervenciones visuales en tiempo real por: + www.redcaiman.org + proyecto indigo + fernando llanos - www.fllanos.com + ricardo rendón - www.zonadefault.com + antonio dominguez - www.nuzita.net + alfredo salomon + mircea turcan - www.sincretic.com + willy amato + ricardo loria - www.mediamatica.com.mx + Rodrigo Tovar + arc. - www.unosunosyunosceros.com + // $150.00 Pesos. Incluye Cocktail de bienvenida. + http://www.mutek.ca http://www.mutek.cl http://www.igloomusica.com http://www.imecamusic.com http://www.museotamayo.org http://www.artealameda.inba.gob.mx http://www.ucsj.edu.mx http://www.radioglobal.org/mutek _______________________________________________ Nettime-lat mailing list Nettime-lat@nettime.org http://amsterdam.nettime.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/nettime-lat --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

2003-11-27 15:19nethedcool hot mexican idm. wish there was time to book a flight nH At 9:47 am -0600 27/11/03, a

From:: nethed <nethed@ninjatune.net>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.org>
Date:: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 15:19:11 +0000
Subject:: Re: [idm] mutek mexico >
Reply to:: [idm] mutek mexico >

cool hot mexican idm. wish there was time to book a flight nH At 9:47 am -0600 27/11/03, arc.anonimo wrote:

quoted 154 lines To: nettime-lat@nettime.org

>To: nettime-lat@nettime.org >Subject: [nettime-lat] > >// MUTEK_México > >Música, sonido y Nuevas Tecnologías / Montreal > >http://www.mutek.ca > >México DF, Noviembre, 28 y 29, 2003 > >// Sedes: > >_Laboratorio de Arte Alameda, Museo Tamayo de Arte Contemporáneo y >Universidad del Claustro de Sor Juana > >_Universidad del Claustro de Sor Juana: >Izazaga no. 92, Centro Histórico T. 5130-3300 > >_Museo Tamayo de Arte Contemporáneo: >Paseo de la Reforma y Gandhi S/N T. 5286-6519 > >_Laboratorio de Arte Alameda: >Dr. Mora no. 7 Centro Histórico T. 5510-2793 / 5512-2079 ] > >// Viernes 28 de noviembre: > >MUTEK__Intersección paneles y conferencias > >_Coctél Inaugural MUTEK DF 12:00 hrs. @ Laboratorio Arte Alameda > >Conferencias y panel de discusión : Vanguardia y periferia, >la música experimental en el contexto de Latinoamérica > >+ Carlos Prieto : moderador >+ Ejival [Static Discos] >+ Alain Mongeau [Festival MUTEK] >+ Manrico Montero [Igloo Música] >+ Ernesto Priego [Seminario Políticas de la Memoria / UNAM] > >14:00 hrs. / nave prinicipal digital jamm session > >_conflux: intervención de audio e imagen > >+ [ Deadbeat vs Manrico Montero / www.zonadefault.com vs www.nuzita.net ] > >Entrada libre / cupo limitado > > >// MUTEK__Diurno Redefiniendo la experiencia sonora y musical a través >de la tecnología digital, la improvisación y la experimentación >electroacústica. > >Cyberlounge : Foro Sonoro_ Inmerso 17:00 hrs. @ Museo Tamayo > >+ Manuel Rocha México / visuales: M. Rocha >+ Alex Casales México visuales: A. Casales >+ Ghiz aka Mario de Vega [Igloo Música] México / visuales: Laura >Carmona [ www.p-u-a.org ] >+ Tim Hecker [Alien 8, Fat Cat, Force Inc., Mille Plateaux] / >visuales: arc.byn > >Entrada libre / cupo limitado > > >// Sábado 29 de noviembre > > >MUTEK__Intersección paneles y conferencias 12:00 hrs @ Laboratorio >Arte Alameda > >_Conferencias y panel de discusión: El lugar de la voz humana en la >música digital > >+ Carlos Prieto : moderador >+ Inti Meza Villarino [Formas CNA] >+ Álvaro Ruiz [Igloo Música] >+ Tim Hecker [Alien 8, Fat Cat, Force Inc., Mille Plateaux] >+ Marc Leclair aka Akufen [Trapez, Force Inc., Perlon, Musique Risquée] > >+ [ Demostración y procesamiento digital de voz en tiempo real por >Álvaro Ruiz y Marc Leclair ] > >14:00 hrs. / nave prinicipal digital jamm session > >_conflux: intervención de audio e imagen > >+ [ Álvaro Ruiz vs Tim Hecker / ivan abreu - www.espaciosinaire.com vs. >arcángel constantini - www.unosunosyunosceros.com ] > >Entrada libre / cupo limitado > > >// MUTEK__Diurno Redifiniendo la experiencia sonora y musical a través >de la tecnología digital, la improvisación y la experimentación @ >Cyberlounge : Foro Sonoro_ Inmerso 17:00 hrs / Museo Tamayo. > >+ Alejandro Morse México [Igloo Música] visuales: miguel mendoza [ >www.porlotanto.com ] >+ Manrico Montero México [Igloo Música] visuales guillermo amato [inova] >+ Arthur Henry Fork México [Igloo Música] visuales: ark.factor.Y >+ Skoltz Kolgen Montreal [Line, MUTEK_Rec] visuales: skoltz kolgen > >Entrada libre / cupo limitado > >// MUTEK__Nocturno Reformulando la experiencia clásica del tecno, la >pista de baile transformada en campo de experimentación, un nuevo >horizonte de disfrute. 21:00 hrs. @ Universidad del Claustro de Sor >Juana > >+ Carlos Garcia México [Konfort] >+ Duopandamix México [Static] >+ The Mole and the starchy root machine Montreal [MUTEK] >+ Plug México [Filtro] >+ Sutekh USA [Context, Force Inc.] >+ Mike Shannon Montreal [Cynosure, Force Inc.] >+ Deadbeat Montreal [Scape, Revolver] >+ Cultfilter México >+ Champion Montreal [MUTEK_Rec] >+ Fax México (Static) >+ Akufen Montreal [Trapez, Force Inc., Perlon, Musique Risquée] >+ Crackhaus Montreal [Onitor] >+ Egg Montreal [MUTEK_Rec] >+ Zofa México [Konfort] > >// intervenciones visuales en tiempo real por: > >+ www.redcaiman.org >+ proyecto indigo >+ fernando llanos - www.fllanos.com >+ ricardo rendón - www.zonadefault.com >+ antonio dominguez - www.nuzita.net >+ alfredo salomon >+ mircea turcan - www.sincretic.com >+ willy amato >+ ricardo loria - www.mediamatica.com.mx >+ Rodrigo Tovar >+ arc. - www.unosunosyunosceros.com > >+ > >// $150.00 Pesos. Incluye Cocktail de bienvenida. > >+ > >http://www.mutek.ca >http://www.mutek.cl >http://www.igloomusica.com >http://www.imecamusic.com >http://www.museotamayo.org >http://www.artealameda.inba.gob.mx >http://www.ucsj.edu.mx >http://www.radioglobal.org/mutek >_______________________________________________

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2003-11-27 15:17chthonic streams"Aaron Trumm" <aaron@nquit.com> wrote: >well, yeah, of course they don't just spend the mo

From:: chthonic streams <chthonic@chthonicstreams.com>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.org>
Date:: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 10:17:38 -0500
Subject:: Re: [idm] ubiquitous sony (O/T)
Reply to:: Re: [idm] ubiquitous sony

"Aaron Trumm" <aaron@nquit.com> wrote:

quoted 6 lines well, yeah, of course they don't just spend the money, they'll want to

>well, yeah, of course they don't just spend the money, they'll want to >recoup it directly on a given project. although it is conceivable that an >artist or a small label with enough clout and a good enough lawyer could >manage to negotiate a contract where the funds for the record are not >recoupable - but even without that, you're not likely to pay rate out of >pocket if you're on the label

right, i wasn't suggesting an artist pays out of pocket for a label-owned studio. it's charged against future royalties, the old indentured servant or loan slave deal. the only time an artist pays out of pocket for studio time is if they make the album outside of a label deal (i.e. before they sign), or it's in their contract that they're responsible for simply making the album and handing in the master.

quoted 6 lines now this where I don't have a clear understanding - does Sony pay itself for

>now this where I don't have a clear understanding - does Sony pay itself for >studio time? Knowing a bit about how Shell Oil works (my girlfriend works >there :) ), I would say that in fact, yes it does. At Shell, one department >will come to my girlfriend's department and pay them for their time, and in >fact, her department has to compete for their business, as they have full >freedom to buy the services outside of the company.

this is what i was talking about. each small company is on the books as its own corporation. if sony creates a video department and incorporates it as a separate company, or buys another video company, and one of their music artists makes a video with that company, the artist is charged against royalties to make the video, and the money changes hands within the company. so essentially the artist's album costs less for the company to make, because they're getting back most of the cost of making it through one of their subsidiary companies. and now they have something they can sell and make even more money from, and give the artist a pitiful percentage because the company is the one who took the financial risk. of course, as you mention, eventually some contracts can be renegotiated, but usually not until they're fulfilled and it's time for a new one, unless something is really illegal or can be proven unfair, which is hard to do.

quoted 3 lines I don't suppose it's necessarily true, however, that anyone with money can

>I don't suppose it's necessarily true, however, that anyone with money can >book time in any studio. I imagine there are plenty of private commercial >quality studios that are not open for business.

entirely possible. or it may just be so heavily booked that no one can get in, or so prohibitively expensive (upwards of $200/hr) that only major players book time. d. -- http://www.chthonicstreams.com http://www.dreamintodust.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org

Re: [idm] ubiquitous sony