IDM Mailing Archive

1994-09-09 23:54Jon Drukmanpseudo IDM-times Not really an IDM Times, but close enough for a look and feel lawsuit. Th

From:: Jon Drukman <jon@opcode.com>
To:: IDM <idm@hyperreal.com>
Date:: Fri, 9 Sep 1994 16:54:41 PDT
Subject:: pseudo IDM-times

pseudo IDM-times Not really an IDM Times, but close enough for a look and feel lawsuit. The Drum Club - Drums Are Dangerous Instinct EX 286 This is more like what I expected from a band named Drum Club, ie: lots of drums. The title cut starts it off in grand fashion with a slew of polyrhythms, digeridoos, 303s and some repetitive yet not annoying vocals. Odd melodies. Hooky yet off-kilter. I like that. Unfortunately, it gets a little dull as the album progresses until everything is just simple two-note progressions (oxymoron?) and some hand drum samples. "Reefer", the mandatory Slow Track, takes things on a predictably stony path, with lazy dub bass and echoplexed reggae vocal snips. Not bad, but could be better. Orbital - Snivilisation FFRR 697 124 027-2 snivilisation is definitely the best orbital album yet. but that's not saying a lot since i don't particularly like the other two anyway. however, this one is at least varied enough to hold my interest, most of the time. the "jungle influence" is just a few chopped up breakbeats, not hard enough to be annoying, thankfully. in fact, most of this album isn't even particularly danceable. the faster stuff with beats is a little too self-consciously tricky to work well on the floor. suppose we'll have to wait for the inevitable slew of big-name remixes for that. (not that i mind, the underworld mix of lush was worth waiting for. love them guitars.) they've got a singer on a few tracks and she works really well. they don't use straight verse/chorus stuff anyway, lots of chopped up and manipulated vocals. one final note: the cover art is really great. And now a special report: INSTINCT AMBIENT featuring musings on Omicron "Acrocosm" (EX 289), Seti (EX 287) and Terre Thaemlitz' "Tranquilizer" (EX 283). This whole "ambient" thing is getting to be really annoying. "Just take a load of synths, tape down a few keys making weird pulsing noises and leave the room for 75 minutes while the DAT runs." Bingo, instant album. Seti is particularly guilty of this. The textures change, true enough, through the course of the album, and every once in a while a beat pops up, but overall it sounds empty, like two guys messing around without a clear concept or direction. Let's just make some noise, as long as it's electronic, it'll sell. Even the cover looks cheap and quick - a pixelized photo of a radio telescope dish. Terre Thaemlitz is fortunately not in the same category. Some of his tracks miss the mark for me, and I'm not exactly sure what the mad runs up and down the keyboard are doing in an album with pillows and clouds on the cover, but the bullseyes are great. "Hovering Glows" is a particular favorite - weird noises, rhythm loops, incomprehensible muttering voices. It sounds like there was some thought or at least a general idea in action. Ambience is supposed to be "a tint, an environment" and too often today's ambient releases just don't have any sense of place or time. Nods to Thaemlitz for conjuring up a bizarre and highly personal space. Omicron's "Acrocosm" is not similarly blessed, however. Empty electronic noodling, cold and academic. What's the point? I've got a synth and I'm gonna lean on it. Swirls, twangs, bleeps and bloops. No feeling though. Soundwise, it's impersonal. You can throw together the sounds used on this album in ten minutes with a suitably intuitive analog synthesizer. Well, it was bound to happen. Ambient is the "hot" thing this week. You're gonna be deluged with ambient discs and most of them are going to suck hard. As always, caveat emptor. ONE FROM THE CUTOUT BINS: Source - Organized Noise R&S rs93005cd How did I miss this one first time around? This is a classy record. Hard yet melodic, melodic yet original, trancy yet not boring. Taking ideas from Kraftwerk, Detroit, 70's euro-synth-wank and UPDATING it. Yes, by god, this actually shows some sign of being able to move on from its reference points. I'm quite pleased. Cut-out price: $4.99

1994-09-10 00:35ccastge@prism.gatech.edu> This whole "ambient" thing is getting to be really annoying. "Just take a > load of synt

From:: <ccastge@prism.gatech.edu>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.com>
Date:: Fri, 9 Sep 1994 20:35:47 -0400 (EDT)
Subject:: music making
Reply to:: pseudo IDM-times

quoted 6 lines This whole "ambient" thing is getting to be really annoying. "Just take a

> This whole "ambient" thing is getting to be really annoying. "Just take a > load of synths, tape down a few keys making weird pulsing noises and leave > the room for 75 minutes while the DAT runs." Bingo, instant album. Seti is > particularly guilty of this. The textures change, true enough, through the > course of the album, and every once in a while a beat pops up, but overall > it sounds empty, like two guys messing around without a clear concept or

I've found this to be quite true... that's why I shy away from anything lavbelled 'ambient' nowadays, unless I've at least seen mention of it on this list (or uk-dance). I hope you all don't mind me taking a brief bit of space to ramble... My whole approach to music making is pretty simplistic. I've got a Kawai K-11 keyboard, and a Gravis Ultrasound. I've d/l lots of samples from ftp sites for the K2000 and EPS synths, converted them to Gus, and thrown away most of them. I basically sit down, try to make some interesting sounds on my keyboard, and then come back later and see if I can fit them in somewhere. I do know how to read music, and know basic chord structures, but I don't think that knowing how to make technically correct music gives anyone an advantage, only experience does that. I'm basically just trying to experience as much music as I can, and whenever I come up with a nice sounding tune that I think people will like, I'll let them hear it. What do the music makers among us out there do? Do you take every minute at the keys seriously, and try your damndest to get something to sound perfect, or do you dabble around a bit, and when it sounds 'right', call it a tune? I'd be interested to hear how other people approach making music... of course, if this is completely off topic, please let me know. -- ccastge@prism.gatech.edu | All of us get lost in the darkness, a.k.a., Guy Elden Jr. | Dreamers learn to steer by the stars... Neil Peart ---->| All of us do time in the gutter, of RUSH | Dreamers turn to look at the cars...

1994-09-10 01:00javina@imap1.asu.edu> I'd be interested to hear how other people approach making music... of > course, if this

From:: <javina@imap1.asu.edu>
To:: <ccastge@prism.gatech.edu>
Cc:: <idm@hyperreal.com>
Date:: Fri, 09 Sep 1994 18:00:46 -0700 (MST)
Subject:: Re: music making
Reply to:: music making

quoted 2 lines I'd be interested to hear how other people approach making music... of

> I'd be interested to hear how other people approach making music... of > course, if this is completely off topic, please let me know.

i, myself have a very complicated setup...an acoustic guitar and a .46 mm jim dunlop pick "the white fire" i really try to get a lot of percussive feel in my instrumentals sometimes along the lines of richie havens... if i can only get my hands on a drum machine maybe i can 4-track some interesting soundscapes... jav =>

1994-09-10 01:47Mad GilOn Fri, 9 Sep 1994 ccastge@prism.gatech.edu wrote: > > This whole "ambient" thing is getti

From:: Mad Gil <cyberpun@wam.umd.edu>
To:: Intelligent Dance Music <idm@hyperreal.com>
Date:: Fri, 9 Sep 1994 21:47:36 -0400 (EDT)
Subject:: Re: music making
Reply to:: music making

On Fri, 9 Sep 1994 ccastge@prism.gatech.edu wrote:

quoted 10 lines This whole "ambient" thing is getting to be really annoying. "Just take a

> > This whole "ambient" thing is getting to be really annoying. "Just take a > > load of synths, tape down a few keys making weird pulsing noises and leave > > the room for 75 minutes while the DAT runs." Bingo, instant album. Seti is > > particularly guilty of this. The textures change, true enough, through the > > course of the album, and every once in a while a beat pops up, but overall > > it sounds empty, like two guys messing around without a clear concept or > > I've found this to be quite true... that's why I shy away from anything > lavbelled 'ambient' nowadays, unless I've at least seen mention of it on > this list (or uk-dance).

I think, and wish there could be clear distinction to the marketers of 'ambient' music. Where real ambient ends, and ambient house picks up. At lweast to me there is a huge difference between the two, at least in concept . Also, this type of 'leave the room full of synths just play loops' can be VERY effective, even at the most minimal state eg: steve roach. I think just like anything, there are going to be those that like this music and some that don't. The more experimental, and the more an artist strays from conventional song structures, the less people that will accept it. The problem the way i see it is that 'ambient' music has a huge potential for marketing. If you ever go into a doctors office and hear that damned 'light-music-station' playing, well that could very well be replaced by ambient music. Maybe not to such an extreme, but I think the potential is there. And this stuff is still underground, and still experimental, and has so much potential from an artistic standpoint and marketing standpoint. - I'm not familiar with the group that you mentioned 'seti?' but has anyone here listened to the new autocreation? I flipped through it, and was very unimpressed, but it's that very 'loopy' music that you just have to sit to and absorb(over and over). not like a 2:30 popsong that you can tell if it's good within 30 seconds of listening to.

quoted 20 lines I hope you all don't mind me taking a brief bit of space to ramble...

> > I hope you all don't mind me taking a brief bit of space to ramble... > > I basically sit down, try to make some interesting sounds on my keyboard, > and then come back later and see if I can fit them in somewhere. > > I do know how to read music, and know basic chord structures, but I don't > think that knowing how to make technically correct music gives anyone an > advantage, only experience does that. I'm basically just trying to > experience as much music as I can, and whenever I come up with a nice > sounding tune that I think people will like, I'll let them hear it. > > What do the music makers among us out there do? Do you take every minute at > the keys seriously, and try your damndest to get something to sound > perfect, or do you dabble around a bit, and when it sounds 'right', call it > a tune? > > I'd be interested to hear how other people approach making music... of > course, if this is completely off topic, please let me know. >

First off, I think I have a very musical backround, routed in traditional theory. There's alot i don't know, however. But I think because of this, I have to fight to create 'dance/techno/ambient' music because it's so unmusical innature. What seems to emerge from this is very melodic music, with solid harmonies. though again, i have to fight to make sure they do not become the prominent element in the song, as that's not the point of this kind of music. It seems to me, the right type of sound will inspire some loop, or some musical line. I will then improvise on top of that loop, and more and more to the loop, untill the original idea is gone. but usually, there is some link back to the begining thought. I think also the sequencer has a lot to do with what your music sounds like. oh- one other thing, the drums come last. i think the percussion is very secondary, no matter how detailed it is. I know this goes against some people's beliefs totally, but i'm just expressing my opinion, and this will answer a lot about my musical tastes and feelings. But I doo agree 100% that it's only experience that builds a creative mind, rather than education. You can teach someone everything there is to know about theory, but although their music might be 'perfect', it might be heartless and in the end, a failure.

quoted 7 lines --

> > -- > ccastge@prism.gatech.edu | All of us get lost in the darkness, > a.k.a., Guy Elden Jr. | Dreamers learn to steer by the stars... > Neil Peart ---->| All of us do time in the gutter, > of RUSH | Dreamers turn to look at the cars... >

Gil Yaker cyberpun@wam.umd.edu Chief Engineer, WMUC Radio AM 650 kHz / FM 88.1 MHz college park, md

1994-09-10 02:08James LumbOn Fri, 9 Sep 1994 ccastge@prism.gatech.edu wrote: > > This whole "ambient" thing is getti

From:: James Lumb <jlumb@netcom.com>
To:: <ccastge@prism.gatech.edu>
Cc:: <idm@hyperreal.com>
Date:: Fri, 9 Sep 1994 19:08:01 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:: Re: music making
Reply to:: music making

On Fri, 9 Sep 1994 ccastge@prism.gatech.edu wrote:

quoted 2 lines This whole "ambient" thing is getting to be really annoying. "Just take a

> > This whole "ambient" thing is getting to be really annoying. "Just take a > > load of synths, tape down a few keys making weird pulsing noises...

Uninspired music, as a whole, is annoying. Perhaps you should check out "Ambient Volume 1: A brief History of Ambient" on Virgin. It's a bargain (2 CDs). You get Amorphous Androgynous, Eno, Fripp, and Sylvian in the same package. Ambient has been around for about a century as art music. I think its important to realize that a lot of IDM composers cite early non-techno ambient as an influence.

quoted 4 lines What do the music makers among us out there do? Do you take every minute at

> What do the music makers among us out there do? Do you take every minute at > the keys seriously, and try your damndest to get something to sound > perfect, or do you dabble around a bit, and when it sounds 'right', call it > a tune?

You cant force inspiration, but when you finally get it the music seems to take over. I'm never really *satisfied* with a mix. I have this sneaking suspician that I would just sort of explode if everything turned out perfect. Last nite I was positive that the remixes I was working on were all wrong, but they sounded OK this morning. I think it must have been a bad enchilada. James Lumb Electric Skychurch jlumb@netcom.com

1994-09-10 02:36ccastge@prism.gatech.edu> Uninspired music, as a whole, is annoying. Perhaps you should check > out "Ambient Volum

From:: <ccastge@prism.gatech.edu>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.com>
Date:: Fri, 9 Sep 1994 22:36:10 -0400 (EDT)
Subject:: Re: music making
Reply to:: Re: music making

quoted 4 lines Uninspired music, as a whole, is annoying. Perhaps you should check

> Uninspired music, as a whole, is annoying. Perhaps you should check > out "Ambient Volume 1: A brief History of Ambient" on Virgin. It's a > bargain (2 CDs). You get Amorphous Androgynous, Eno, Fripp, and > Sylvian in the same package.

I have Ambient 3, The Music Of Changes, the one with the FSOL mix of Darshana by Sylvian/Fripp... I think it's the best ambient comp I've got... Aside from the FSOL and Eno tracks, I'd have to say that one of my favorites from this comp is on the 2nd CD: Mustt Mustt, by Nusrat Fateh Ali Khan.. the thing that strikes me about this track is the way the vocals make up a good part of the melody... I've heard plenty of songs with ethnic instruments, but very few of them contain vocals. It stands out among all the other tracks in that respect, and is one of my favorites because of it. I also think it'd sound really nice if they'd do away with the bass and hi-hats, and maybe use a tom or two for the drum part... just something simple and emphasize the vocals as much as possible. If you haven't gotten this comp yet, and are looking for a wide range of music to listen to, I highly recommend it! -- ccastge@prism.gatech.edu | All of us get lost in the darkness, a.k.a., Guy Elden Jr. | Dreamers learn to steer by the stars... Neil Peart ---->| All of us do time in the gutter, of RUSH | Dreamers turn to look at the cars...

1994-09-10 01:03Greg Earle>Not really an IDM Times, but close enough for a look and feel lawsuit. ... >ONE FROM THE

From:: Greg Earle <earle@isolar.Tujunga.CA.US>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.com>
Date:: Fri, 09 Sep 1994 18:03:40 -0700
Subject:: Source (Re: pseudo IDM-times)
Reply to:: pseudo IDM-times

quoted 1 line Not really an IDM Times, but close enough for a look and feel lawsuit.

>Not really an IDM Times, but close enough for a look and feel lawsuit.

...

quoted 6 lines ONE FROM THE CUTOUT BINS:

>ONE FROM THE CUTOUT BINS: > >Source - Organized Noise >R&S RS93005cd > >How did I miss this one first time around?

Maybe because I was the one acting like a squealing pig about how great it was, and you thought "Yuck, ol' Greg doesn't even appreciate Da Funk, how on earth could this thing he's crowing about be any good" (-: (-: (-: Or maybe because you looked at the cover, like I did originally, and thought "Bleedin' Hippie" ... and put it back? (-: Not only is this great but Robert Leiner's "Visions of The Past" is pretty cool too. He was also a lot of fun to chat with and he's a great DJ to boot. I wish he'd come back and play again, hopefully with a working Mac and Cubase this time ... - Greg

1994-09-10 00:36Mohsen GamshadIMO the stuff put out by Instinct is always hit-and-miss, probably more miss than hit. The

From:: Mohsen Gamshad <gamshad@tcs.com>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.com>, <jon@opcode.com>
Date:: Fri, 9 Sep 94 17:36:37 PDT
Subject:: Re: pseudo IDM-times

IMO the stuff put out by Instinct is always hit-and-miss, probably more miss than hit. The only things that Instinct has had success with are the compilations. Mohsen