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Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive

9 messages · 5 participants · spans 1 day · search this subject
2004-03-10 16:55chthonic Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
└─ 2004-03-10 18:12Eggy Toast Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
2004-03-10 18:21chthonic Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
2004-03-10 19:54seeklektek Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
├─ 2004-03-10 20:11max0666 Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
└─ 2004-03-10 20:30max0666 Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
2004-03-10 20:40chthonic Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
2004-03-10 21:00seeklektek Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
2004-03-11 20:52kurt h. Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
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2004-03-10 16:55chthonic---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "Eggy Toast" <eggy@eg
From:
chthonic
To:
Date:
Wed, 10 Mar 2004 08:55:13 -0800
Subject:
Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
permalink · <200403100855.AA8650902@chthonicstreams.com>
---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "Eggy Toast" <eggy@eggtastic.com>
quoted 1 line Progressiveness for its own sake is sometimes just that - and>> Progressiveness for its own sake is sometimes just that - and
gives you
quoted 4 lines nothing else.>> nothing else. > >of course. ever heard of musique concrete? amazingly >progressive stuff, but really, really dull.
would you include descendents of those techniques in your assessment, such as nurse with wound? this reminds me of something a friend said: "seminal" means "it sucks but they did it first" funny but not always true. d. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2004-03-10 18:12Eggy Toastchthonic said: > ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- > From: "E
From:
Eggy Toast
To:
Date:
Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:12:17 -0500 (EST)
Subject:
Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
Reply to:
Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
permalink · <52383.128.220.50.51.1078942337.squirrel@www.eggtastic.com>
chthonic said:
quoted 12 lines ---------- Original Message ----------------------------------> ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- > From: "Eggy Toast" <eggy@eggtastic.com> > >>> Progressiveness for its own sake is sometimes just that - and > gives you >>> nothing else. >> >>of course. ever heard of musique concrete? amazingly >>progressive stuff, but really, really dull. > > would you include descendents of those techniques in your > assessment, such as nurse with wound?
from what i've heard, yep. matmost stuff is the same way -- a lot of it has some good groove to it, but just because they sample crazy things doesn't make the music automatically better. derek -- eggytoast.com : eggtastic.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2004-03-10 18:21chthoniceggy remarked: >>>of course. ever heard of musique concrete? amazingly >>>progressive stuf
From:
chthonic
To:
Date:
Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:21:29 -0800
Subject:
Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
permalink · <200403101021.AA20119688@chthonicstreams.com>
eggy remarked:
quoted 7 lines of course. ever heard of musique concrete? amazingly>>>of course. ever heard of musique concrete? amazingly >>>progressive stuff, but really, really dull. >> >> would you include descendents of those techniques in your >> assessment, such as nurse with wound? > >from what i've heard, yep. matmost stuff is the same way -- a lot
of it
quoted 1 line has some good groove to it, but just because they sample crazy>has some good groove to it, but just because they sample crazy
things
quoted 1 line doesn't make the music automatically better.>doesn't make the music automatically better.
well, it's not a question of better (to me anyway). it's just another option. imo, the best "musique concrete"-style NWW is stuff like 'homotopy to marie' and 'large ladies with cake in the oven'. unlike the original MC i've herard, stapleton has a sense of humor and a great ear for the absurd and surreal. MC seemed dead set on creating sound pieces out of noise simply because it hadn't been done before, a very academic approach that isn't very enjoyable to listen to, i agree. but someone had to do it first. also, i think 'the sylvie and babs hi-fi companion' was a precursor to what people now call "plunderphonics". d. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2004-03-10 19:54seeklektek----- Original Message ----- From: "chthonic" > also, i think 'the sylvie and babs hi-fi c
From:
seeklektek
To:
Date:
Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:54:28 -0800
Subject:
Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
permalink · <07ae01c406d9$81db4f80$2765aa43@obelisk>
----- Original Message ----- From: "chthonic"
quoted 2 lines also, i think 'the sylvie and babs hi-fi companion' was a precursor> also, i think 'the sylvie and babs hi-fi companion' was a precursor > to what people now call "plunderphonics".
Nah. John Oswald was doing the Mystery Tapes way before any of that Stapleton stuff. btw, Foetus was in on the Sylvian Babs High Thigh Comepullashun. seek --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2004-03-10 20:11max0666on 3/10/04 1:54 PM, seeklektek at eclectics@comcast.net wrote: > ----- Original Message --
From:
max0666
To:
seeklektek ,
Date:
Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:11:59 -0600
Subject:
Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
Reply to:
Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
permalink · <BC74D2AF.407%max0666@cox.net>
on 3/10/04 1:54 PM, seeklektek at eclectics@comcast.net wrote:
quoted 17 lines ----- Original Message -----> ----- Original Message ----- > From: "chthonic" >> also, i think 'the sylvie and babs hi-fi companion' was a precursor >> to what people now call "plunderphonics". > > > Nah. John Oswald was doing the Mystery Tapes > way before any of that Stapleton stuff. > > btw, Foetus was in on the Sylvian Babs High Thigh Comepullashun. > > seek > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >
AAAHH but for sure, Sylvie and Babs is one thing that goes in my pyramid. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2004-03-10 20:30max0666on 3/10/04 1:54 PM, seeklektek at eclectics@comcast.net wrote: > ----- Original Message --
From:
max0666
To:
seeklektek ,
Date:
Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:30:36 -0600
Subject:
Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
Reply to:
Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
permalink · <BC74D70C.412%max0666@cox.net>
on 3/10/04 1:54 PM, seeklektek at eclectics@comcast.net wrote:
quoted 10 lines ----- Original Message -----> ----- Original Message ----- > From: "chthonic" >> also, i think 'the sylvie and babs hi-fi companion' was a precursor >> to what people now call "plunderphonics". > > > Nah. John Oswald was doing the Mystery Tapes > way before any of that Stapleton stuff. > > btw, Foetus was in on the Sylvian Babs High Thigh Comepullashun.
Also Sylvie and Babs was a collaborative effort among a bunch of folk....stitched together by Stapleton. His "collage" style, on the other hand, comes primarily from constantly re-warping his own stuff. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2004-03-10 20:40chthonic---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: max0666 <max0666@cox.
From:
chthonic
To:
Date:
Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:40:38 -0800
Subject:
Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
permalink · <200403101240.AA26411154@chthonicstreams.com>
---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: max0666 <max0666@cox.net> Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:30:36 -0600
quoted 2 lines Also Sylvie and Babs was a collaborative effort among a bunch of>Also Sylvie and Babs was a collaborative effort among a bunch of >folk....stitched together by Stapleton. His "collage" style, on the
other
quoted 1 line hand, comes primarily from constantly re-warping his own stuff.>hand, comes primarily from constantly re-warping his own stuff.
a lot of NWW that uses the collage/editing style has other people on it. thirlwell remarked that he only turned up for a few sessions but would find that bits of what he did were used on various albums for years. d. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2004-03-10 21:00seeklektek----- Original Message ----- From: "max0666" > > From: "chthonic" > >> also, i think 'the
From:
seeklektek
To:
Date:
Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:00:56 -0800
Subject:
Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
permalink · <08db01c406e2$c89bb640$2765aa43@obelisk>
----- Original Message ----- From: "max0666"
quoted 3 lines From: "chthonic"> > From: "chthonic" > >> also, i think 'the sylvie and babs hi-fi companion' was a precursor > >> to what people now call "plunderphonics".
quoted 3 lines Nah. John Oswald was doing the Mystery Tapes> > Nah. John Oswald was doing the Mystery Tapes > > way before any of that Stapleton stuff. > > btw, Foetus was in on the Sylvian Babs High Thigh Comepullashun.
quoted 2 lines Also Sylvie and Babs was a collaborative effort among a bunch of> Also Sylvie and Babs was a collaborative effort among a bunch of > folk....
Break the Mighty Wind. ;) seek np: more Mahir --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2004-03-11 20:52kurt h.> > very interesting thought, and related to my IDM complexity thread, > > maybe? Because
From:
kurt h.
To:
Date:
Thu, 11 Mar 2004 15:52:39 -0500
Subject:
Re: [idm] Ultraprogressive
permalink · <p0602040ebc7681ccdcd4@[192.168.2.106]>
quoted 7 lines very interesting thought, and related to my IDM complexity thread,> > very interesting thought, and related to my IDM complexity thread, > > maybe? Because that's what I though when I started that discussion: > > Progressiveness for its own sake is sometimes just that - and gives you > > nothing else. > >of course. ever heard of musique concrete? amazingly progressive stuff, >but really, really dull.
""complexity" [...] when it moves or astounds us - we tend to find other words for it. Having heard a piece, we don't say, "Heavens, that was complex!" unless we were frankly puzzled by it. We are more likely to say "that was beautiful," or "that was impressive," or "astonishing," and so forth. In other words, the sensation of successfully deployed complexity is aesthetically "transferred" to some other mode of description. "It is mainly this transference, I think, that gives "complexity" its artistic prestige. Taken by itself it might not suggest much more than Karl Kraus's sardonic comment on the "new music" of his day: that it was like a young woman who compensates her lack of natural attractions with a perfect mastery of Sanskrit. And to tell the truth, a certain self-deceptive narcissism can all too easily reside within the notion of "complexity." But that's its vice, not its virtue - and I doubt whether there is any significant aesthetic category that does not have scope for both." from "On Complexity" by Richard Toop http://www.muw.edu/frc/complexity.htm --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org