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[idm] Apple's new online music-buying system

14 messages · 9 participants · spans 3 days · search this subject
◇ merged from 4 subjects: apple's new online music-buying system · edgey / thoughtbludgeon questions · idm-l greatest hits · itunes not copy-to-folder (was re: [idm] apple's new online music-buying system)
2003-04-29 02:35Aaron D Meyers [idm] IDM-L Greatest Hits
├─ 2003-04-29 07:55Mark E. Fleschler Re: [idm] IDM-L Greatest Hits
│ └─ 2003-04-29 08:17William Samuels [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
│ └─ 2003-04-29 13:25Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
│ └─ 2003-04-29 16:21wallace winfrey Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
│ ├─ 2003-04-29 16:31Brett Dietsch Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
│ │ └─ 2003-04-29 17:16[idm] iTunes not copy-to-folder (was Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system)
│ └─ 2003-04-29 17:11Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
│ ├─ 2003-04-29 17:30EggyToast Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
│ │ └─ 2003-04-29 17:34Brett Dietsch Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
│ └─ 2003-04-29 17:32wallace winfrey Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
│ └─ 2003-04-29 17:41wallace winfrey Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
└─ 2003-05-01 18:35David Seruyange [idm] Edgey / ThoughtBludgeon Questions
2003-04-29 18:16Rusty H. Hodge Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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2003-04-29 02:35Aaron D MeyersSo I was poking around some saved email folder and I found an old post from the list about
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Aaron D Meyers
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Mon, 28 Apr 2003 22:35:05 -0400
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[idm] IDM-L Greatest Hits
permalink · <51b062c51ac277.51ac27751b062c@homemail.nyu.edu>
So I was poking around some saved email folder and I found an old post from the list about two years ago or so that I'd apparently chosen to save. It's a real winner: http://idm.skylab.org//200102/msg00466.html Nice prose there, Mike. Anyone else have any good ones? Remember the time Autechre quit the list for good with that lengthy diatribe? Fun times. -Aaron --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-04-29 07:55Mark E. Fleschleri joined the list in 98, so i'm relative newbie. what was the subject for the infamous aut
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Mark E. Fleschler
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Aaron D Meyers
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Tue, 29 Apr 2003 00:55:07 -0700 (PDT)
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Re: [idm] IDM-L Greatest Hits
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[idm] IDM-L Greatest Hits
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i joined the list in 98, so i'm relative newbie. what was the subject for the infamous autechre post? i'd love to read it. i do remember that plaid/black dog spat. i shamelessly posted that as a news item for pitchfork when i was haplessly contributing for them back in the day. -mark On Mon, 28 Apr 2003, Aaron D Meyers wrote:
quoted 13 lines So I was poking around some saved email folder and I found an old post from the list about> So I was poking around some saved email folder and I found an old post from the list about two years ago or so that I'd apparently chosen to save. It's a real winner: > > http://idm.skylab.org//200102/msg00466.html > > Nice prose there, Mike. Anyone else have any good ones? Remember the time Autechre quit the list for good with that lengthy diatribe? Fun times. > > -Aaron > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org >
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2003-04-29 08:17William SamuelsI thought some list members might find this interesting. --- --- Apple CEO Steve Jobs unve
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William Samuels
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Tue, 29 Apr 2003 01:17:11 -0700 (PDT)
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[idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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Re: [idm] IDM-L Greatest Hits
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I thought some list members might find this interesting. --- --- Apple CEO Steve Jobs unveils the iTunes service Monday in San Francisco. http://salon.com/tech/feature/2003/04/29/itunes/index.html I have seen the future of music and its name is iTunes Apple's new online music-buying system is everything Napster promised to be -- cheap, easy and, best of all, legal. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. http://search.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-04-29 13:25adam@damek.orgYeah, I was trying to pay pretty close attention to that yesterday. I'm a long-time PC use
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Tue, 29 Apr 2003 08:25:33 -0500 (CDT)
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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[idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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Yeah, I was trying to pay pretty close attention to that yesterday. I'm a long-time PC user, but recently I've been considering switching to Mac within the next year or so. I'm not sure how I feel about this whole thing. I shouldn't be *too* concerned about iTunes, because it's not the only media player for the Mac, but it would be convenient to just use iTunes because it's free and it's the default, so... I have a couple concerns. 1) for the past two years, all of my music has been in Ogg Vorbis format. Apple shows no interest in making it easy for geeks like me (admittedly a minority) to switch. Vorbis is free and I can't see what the obstacles are to adding Vorbis support to iTunes and, more importantly, to iPod. For me to switch, currently I would be forced to re-rip and encode all of my CDs, particularly if I want to get an iPod, which I do. This would be a major pain. 2) OK, so forget that, and assume I am willing to re-do my whole music collection. I'm not going back to MP3, that would be stupid. I'm used to the smaller file sizes and better quality of Ogg, and so I'd want to use the AAC format Apple is championing. I can accept that iTunes is going to restrict my usage of the AAC files I purchase and download from the iTunes Store. But what about music I import? Will my own music be similarly restricted? I mean, does iTunes 4 restrict the copying, sharing and burning of all AAC files, or only those downloaded from the iTunes Store? 3) AAC isn't quite standardized yet. Yes, it's an MPEG standard, but there are differeing implementations, and there's no standard, accepted way of tagging the files. Will Apple's Quicktime implementation quickly become the standard because of their store, or will AAC music created on a Mac not play on Windows and other machines? Should I bite the bullet and go back to MP3 because it's so portable? (This would be solved for me if they just supported Ogg Vorbis as an option.) So anyway, I guess I'm not expecting answers from the list, I just wanted to vent. Apple's announcements yesterday seem great for current Apple/iTunes/iPod users, and will probably attract people who are still using MP3 and have no problem with it, but it makes the switch decision more difficult and complicated in general. Even if all your music is still in MP3, if you start using Apple's AAC, are your music files as sharable? Switching to Apple is already a sacrifice in some areas, like gaming (here's hoping Half-Life 2 is available, because I really do want a Mac, and I want to play that game). This limitation on digital music on the Mac makes the switch dilemma just more confusing and troublesome. -Adam Quoting William Samuels <w_technoir@yahoo.com>:
quoted 28 lines I thought some list members might find this> I thought some list members might find this > interesting. > > --- --- > > Apple CEO Steve Jobs unveils the iTunes service Monday > in San Francisco. > > http://salon.com/tech/feature/2003/04/29/itunes/index.html > > I have seen the future of music and its name is iTunes > Apple's new online music-buying system is everything > Napster promised to be -- cheap, easy and, best of > all, legal. > > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo. > http://search.yahoo.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org > For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org > >
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2003-04-29 16:21wallace winfreyOn Tue, 29 Apr 2003 adam@damek.org wrote: > 1) for the past two years, all of my music has
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wallace winfrey
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Tue, 29 Apr 2003 10:21:38 -0600 (MDT)
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
permalink · <Pine.LNX.4.44.0304291009450.6020-100000@utopia.booyaka.com>
On Tue, 29 Apr 2003 adam@damek.org wrote:
quoted 7 lines 1) for the past two years, all of my music has been in Ogg Vorbis> 1) for the past two years, all of my music has been in Ogg Vorbis > format. Apple shows no interest in making it easy for geeks like me > (admittedly a minority) to switch. Vorbis is free and I can't see what > the obstacles are to adding Vorbis support to iTunes and, more > importantly, to iPod. For me to switch, currently I would be forced to > re-rip and encode all of my CDs, particularly if I want to get an iPod, > which I do. This would be a major pain.
Why get an iPod then? Let function follow form. Your collection is in Ogg format, get an Ogg-compatible player: http://neurosaudio.com/ If you want to play your Ogg files in iTunes, there's a plugin available: http://www.macosxhints.com/article.php?story=20021103065300430
quoted 4 lines But what about music I import? Will my own music be similarly> But what about music I import? Will my own music be similarly > restricted? I mean, does iTunes 4 restrict the copying, sharing and > burning of all AAC files, or only those downloaded from the iTunes > Store?
I don't believe iTunes4 is now limited to AAC format.
quoted 3 lines Will Apple's Quicktime implementation quickly become the standard> Will Apple's Quicktime implementation quickly become the standard > because of their store, or will AAC music created on a Mac not play on > Windows and other machines?
The QuickTime player for Windows supports this format, and I even think an iTunes for Windows is coming out.
quoted 2 lines This limitation on digital music on the Mac makes the switch dilemma> This limitation on digital music on the Mac makes the switch dilemma > just more confusing and troublesome.
My biggest beef with iTunes is that I can't quite figure out how to make it simply play files from disk rather than "import" them (read: copy to it's own directory). Most of my music collection sits on the Linux server so it can be easily streamed to the XP workstation or the TiBook. Every time I want to load up an album in iTunes it has to copy the whole frigging directory first. What a pain. w --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-04-29 16:31Brett DietschOn Tuesday, April 29, 2003, at 12:21 PM, wallace winfrey wrote: > > My biggest beef with i
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Brett Dietsch
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Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:31:46 -0400
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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On Tuesday, April 29, 2003, at 12:21 PM, wallace winfrey wrote:
quoted 10 lines My biggest beef with iTunes is that I can't quite figure out how to> > My biggest beef with iTunes is that I can't quite figure out how to > make > it simply play files from disk rather than "import" them (read: copy to > it's own directory). Most of my music collection sits on the Linux > server so it can be easily streamed to the XP workstation or the > TiBook. > Every time I want to load up an album in iTunes it has to copy the > whole > frigging directory first. What a pain.
iTunes -> Preferences -> Advanced uncheck "Copy files to iTunes Music folder when adding to library" I just upgraded to 4, and it may be different in 3, but i know the checkbox is still under advanced there. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-04-29 17:16adam@damek.orgQuoting Brett Dietsch <elph@lawngnome.org>: > iTunes -> Preferences -> Advanced > > unchec
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Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:16:18 -0500 (CDT)
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[idm] iTunes not copy-to-folder (was Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system)
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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Quoting Brett Dietsch <elph@lawngnome.org>:
quoted 6 lines iTunes -> Preferences -> Advanced> iTunes -> Preferences -> Advanced > > uncheck "Copy files to iTunes Music folder when adding to library" > > I just upgraded to 4, and it may be different in 3, but i know the > checkbox is still under advanced there.
Furthermore, it seems you can reverse this option without going to the Preferences just by holding down the Option key when you drag music to iTunes: http://www.osxfaq.com/dailytips/10-2002/10-08.ws Good to know... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-04-29 17:11adam@damek.orgQuoting wallace winfrey <wally@booyaka.com>: > On Tue, 29 Apr 2003 adam@damek.org wrote: >
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Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:11:29 -0500 (CDT)
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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Quoting wallace winfrey <wally@booyaka.com>:
quoted 8 lines On Tue, 29 Apr 2003 adam@damek.org wrote:> On Tue, 29 Apr 2003 adam@damek.org wrote: > > the obstacles are to adding Vorbis support to iTunes and, more > > importantly, to iPod. For me to switch, currently I would be forced > > re-rip and encode all of my CDs, particularly if I want to get an > > iPod, which I do. This would be a major pain. > > Why get an iPod then? Let function follow form. Your collection is in > Ogg, get an Ogg-compatible player: http://neurosaudio.com/
The Neuros doesn't play vorbis files. It is an intended feature for the future, but I don't buy on future promises. Besides, OS X support for the Neuros is also just a future promise, and probably kludgy at that, by porting the linux software which is also non-existant at the moment.
quoted 3 lines If you want to play your Ogg files in iTunes, there's a plugin> If you want to play your Ogg files in iTunes, there's a plugin > available: > http://www.macosxhints.com/article.php?story=20021103065300430
Yeah, I know. I suppose I *am* just whining a lot. But that still wouldn't allow me to play them on the iPod, or any other portable. Yeah, I should have just stuck with MP3 years ago instead of deciding to go with Vorbis. Hindsight is 20-20 and all...
quoted 6 lines But what about music I import? Will my own music be similarly> > But what about music I import? Will my own music be similarly > > restricted? I mean, does iTunes 4 restrict the copying, sharing and > > burning of all AAC files, or only those downloaded from the iTunes > > Store? > > I don't believe iTunes4 is now limited to AAC format.
I know, but as I mentioned, I won't go back to MP3. That's a step backwards as far as I'm concerned. So I still wonder (and I'll probably ask Apple somehow) if iTunes can tell the difference between AAC files from the store and AAC files from my CDs - I would expect to have no restrictions on ones that aren't from the Store. In the end I suppose I'll stick with my PC for another year or so, at least until all the AAC issues get ironed out and there are common ways of encoding, tagging and playing them on multiple OSes. Right now, there's nothing but QuickTime/iTunes on the Mac, and a couple different in-development encoders for Linux and Windows. So at the moment I have no trust that QuickTime for Windows can play it, but QuickTime for Windows, well, sucks. The thing is, there's always 3rd party software and other tools, including UNIX ports through the Fink project. Heck, I could just run XMMS on OS X and be done with it. But I can do all that in Windows, too. And it's a pain. It's one of the main reasons I've been drawn to the Apple world lately. It's the draw of having everything "just work", and using built-in tools designed to work together, etc. That all may still overcome the pain of having to re-rip and encode all my music again, but it sure would make things a million times easier if Apple would just accept Vorbis as an equal citizen in they're little multimedia universe. -Adam (whiner) :P --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-04-29 17:30EggyToast> The thing is, there's always 3rd party software and other tools, > including UNIX ports
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Tue, 29 Apr 2003 13:30:05 -0400 (EDT)
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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quoted 10 lines The thing is, there's always 3rd party software and other tools,> The thing is, there's always 3rd party software and other tools, > including UNIX ports through the Fink project. Heck, I could just run > XMMS on OS X and be done with it. But I can do all that in Windows, > too. And it's a pain. It's one of the main reasons I've been drawn to > the Apple world lately. It's the draw of having everything "just > work", and using built-in tools designed to work together, etc. That > all may still overcome the pain of having to re-rip and encode all my > music again, but it sure would make things a million times easier if > Apple would just accept Vorbis as an equal citizen in they're little > multimedia universe.
It's so funny how critics of Windows complain about all of the programs that Microsoft stuffs in there to do various other things -- things most people use 3rd party software for. Yet, the #1 reason cited for using a Mac is the software that Apple provides, bundled with the OS. derek -- eggytoast.com - eggtastic.com ------ it's in your grocer's freezer --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-04-29 17:34Brett DietschOn Tuesday, April 29, 2003, at 01:30 PM, EggyToast wrote: > > It's so funny how critics of
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Tue, 29 Apr 2003 13:34:49 -0400
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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On Tuesday, April 29, 2003, at 01:30 PM, EggyToast wrote:
quoted 7 lines It's so funny how critics of Windows complain about all of the> > It's so funny how critics of Windows complain about all of the > programs that Microsoft stuffs in there to do various other things -- > things most people use 3rd party software for. > > Yet, the #1 reason cited for using a Mac is the software that Apple > provides, bundled with the OS.
I'm sure that if Apple gets busted sprinkling their OS with spyware of various natures, makes their bundled applications viral in that they take over everything else no matter what you want to choose, lose all of their integration with other apps, and have the stability of these apps drops to that of a junior high girlfriend, people will start bitching. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-04-29 17:32wallace winfreyOn Tue, 29 Apr 2003 adam@damek.org wrote: > In the end I suppose I'll stick with my PC for
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Tue, 29 Apr 2003 11:32:39 -0600 (MDT)
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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On Tue, 29 Apr 2003 adam@damek.org wrote:
quoted 5 lines In the end I suppose I'll stick with my PC for another year or so, at> In the end I suppose I'll stick with my PC for another year or so, at > least until all the AAC issues get ironed out and there are common ways > of encoding, tagging and playing them on multiple OSes. Right now, > there's nothing but QuickTime/iTunes on the Mac, and a couple different > in-development encoders for Linux and Windows.
Personally I have no interest in AAC or even the iTunes store. AAC is DRM-ware, and I like having my audio collection live outside what the RIAA says is an acceptable format for playback. Portability and quality (go LAME!) are my biggest concerns, not being able to easily buy .99 songs in iTunes. I think most interest in AAC right now is just part of that reality-distortion field Steve puts out whenever he announces a new product. Expect interest to die down in a month or two. Besides, I'm still waiting for MP3 support for ms.pinky, and I have a feeling she won't be supporting AAC (or Ogg) anytime soon. cheers w --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-04-29 17:41wallace winfreyand just in case any of you "windows-and-only-windows" users feel like you are missing the
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Tue, 29 Apr 2003 11:41:37 -0600 (MDT)
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
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and just in case any of you "windows-and-only-windows" users feel like you are missing the boat in re: to buying crap music for .99/song in your stock media player: http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2003/Jan03/01-20MusicChoicePR.asp w --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2003-05-01 18:35David SeruyangeHello - on http://www.thoughtbludgeon.com there was a mix called 'Sandpaper' done by someo
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Thu, 1 May 2003 11:35:21 -0700 (PDT)
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[idm] Edgey / ThoughtBludgeon Questions
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[idm] IDM-L Greatest Hits
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Hello - on http://www.thoughtbludgeon.com there was a mix called 'Sandpaper' done by someone named Edgey (http://artists.mp3s.com/artists/173/edgey.html). I was wondering if someone could help me ID the first few tracks that are played in the mix. Thanks much - David --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
2003-04-29 18:16Rusty H. Hodge> Personally I have no interest in AAC or even the iTunes store. AAC is > DRM-ware, and I
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Rusty H. Hodge
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wallace winfrey ,
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Tue, 29 Apr 2003 11:16:20 -0700
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Re: [idm] Apple's new online music-buying system
permalink · <005f01c30e7b$782b3650$9005780a@corp.consumerhi.com>
quoted 7 lines Personally I have no interest in AAC or even the iTunes store. AAC is> Personally I have no interest in AAC or even the iTunes store. AAC is > DRM-ware, and I like having my audio collection live outside what the RIAA > says is an acceptable format for playback. Portability and quality (go > LAME!) are my biggest concerns, not being able to easily buy .99 songs in > iTunes. I think most interest in AAC right now is just part of that > reality-distortion field Steve puts out whenever he announces a new > product. Expect interest to die down in a month or two.
AAC does not require DRM, it just has support for it. There are plenty of people using AAC without DRM. AAC has been around for a while. It's the standard audio format for MPEG4. You can encode AAC audio with Quicktime. You can broadcast AAC streams with Quicktime Broadcasters. XM radio is using AACplus, an enhanced version of AAC designed for lower bitrates. AAC sounds really really good. AACplus sounds amazing at low bitrates.... almost as good as 128k MP3s at 40kb AACplus! PS- Lots of rumors that AAC and AACplus are going to be supported by Winamp (and AOL) soon. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org