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[idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...

12 messages · 7 participants · spans 9 days · search this subject
◇ merged from 2 subjects: banning music · speaking of branch davidians...
2001-08-07 03:36Chispas De Muerte [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
2001-08-07 19:39Anig Browl Re: [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
└─ 2001-08-16 06:45nethed [idm] banning music
2001-08-08 04:22Alex Morgan Re: [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
├─ 2001-08-08 04:27Alex Morgan RE: Re: [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
└─ 2001-08-08 23:13Richard Barnett Re: [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
2001-08-08 12:29Anig Browl Re: [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
2001-08-09 06:06Alex Morgan [idm] Re: speaking of Branch Davidians...
├─ 2001-08-09 13:44The Chisa Re: [idm] Re: speaking of Branch Davidians...
└─ 2001-08-10 03:54forel Re: [idm] Re: speaking of Branch Davidians...
2001-08-10 11:07forel Re: [idm] Re: speaking of Branch Davidians...
2001-08-10 22:40Alex Morgan [idm] Re: speaking of Branch Davidians...
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2001-08-07 03:36Chispas De MuerteI watched this documentary a few years back, called "Waco, rules of engagement". Up to the
From:
Chispas De Muerte
To:
InDirtyMinds
Date:
Mon, 6 Aug 2001 20:36:56 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
[idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
permalink · <20010807033656.1337.qmail@web4005.mail.yahoo.com>
I watched this documentary a few years back, called "Waco, rules of engagement". Up to the point that I watched this film I didnt care either way on what had happened in some remote place in Texas at some wierd religious compound. I am also not a big conpiracy nut, I just watched it because a good friend recommended it to me .I was blown away by how concise and thorough the research into this incident was, and how much very good evidence there is that the National Guard very deliberatley massacred all of the people there, in a very horrible and painful way. If you have any faith in the US government I dare you to watch this movie, as this documentary shatters any illusion of the Authorities in the ATF and National Guard as bieng anything but monsters. I dont think I have cried after watching a movie since I was a kid, but this definitley made me. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2001-08-07 19:39Anig BrowlFrom: Chispas De Muerte <generentropy@yahoo.com> > very horrible and painful way. If you h
From:
Anig Browl
To:
IDM List
Date:
Tue, 7 Aug 2001 20:39:39 +0100
Subject:
Re: [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
permalink · <00c501c11f98$28ce8e00$eda6869f@pauls>
From: Chispas De Muerte <generentropy@yahoo.com>
quoted 5 lines very horrible and painful way. If you have any faith> very horrible and painful way. If you have any faith > in the US government I dare you to watch this movie, > as this documentary shatters any illusion of the > Authorities in the ATF and National Guard as bieng > anything but monsters.
I don't want to start an extended debate on this, particularly as it is not music related. And I'm not going to make any excuse for the US authorities, I also think the whole Waco thing was a complete fiasco. But I have a problem with this monolithic approach to government. They're not the Borg, with every single thing controlled by an evil overmind. It's ultimately a variety of people in uniform and positions of authority. People make mistakes, communications get garbled, policies are misinterpreted, some people in authority are bad people, some are ineffective, etc. etc. etc. Of course as citizens (of any country) we should hold our governments accountable and demand fairness and transparency, and of course we will always have legitimate complaints and suspicions about how government works. But generally governments are not evil conspiracies which are Out To Get You. They're more like elephants - useful servants when kept in line, dangerous in times of confusion or panic, and sometimes they need to be brought down. If you want something to be really angry about, look at Afghanistan, where the religious fundamentalist government has made the owership or use of musical instruments a criminal offence. Anig Browl _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2001-08-16 06:45nethedyeah, or places like china which still has a policy of approving lyrics before a record ca
From:
nethed
To:
Anig Browl , IDM List
Date:
Thu, 16 Aug 2001 07:45:58 +0100
Subject:
[idm] banning music
Reply to:
Re: [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
permalink · <p05010403b7a11bedd2e0@[213.123.183.201]>
yeah, or places like china which still has a policy of approving lyrics before a record can be released officially - not that any idm tracks have lyrics - or do they?
quoted 4 lines If you want something to be really angry about, look at Afghanistan, where> >If you want something to be really angry about, look at Afghanistan, where >the religious fundamentalist government has made the owership or use of >musical instruments a criminal offence......
not to mention what afghanistan is doing to the female population (ie public execution of women is as popular as going to a bullfight in spain) whats with that??? --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2001-08-08 04:22Alex MorganPiontek wrote: "If you want something to be really angry about, look at Afghanistan, where
From:
Alex Morgan
To:
Date:
Wed, 8 Aug 2001 16:22:42 +1200
Subject:
Re: [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
permalink · <NNECJFLDEKDJDHFICIGEGEIHCBAA.amorgan@paradise.net.nz>
Piontek wrote: "If you want something to be really angry about, look at Afghanistan, where the religious fundamentalist government has made the ownership or use of musical instruments a criminal offence." The Afghanis banned musical instruments?!! Cripes, that makes the U.S. government's killing of a few dozen innocent men, women and children look tame in comparison! Erm, hold on... --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2001-08-08 04:27Alex Morgan> Piontek wrote: > "If you want something to be really angry about, look at > Afghanistan,
From:
Alex Morgan
To:
Date:
Wed, 8 Aug 2001 16:27:43 +1200
Subject:
RE: Re: [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
Reply to:
Re: [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
permalink · <NNECJFLDEKDJDHFICIGEMEIHCBAA.amorgan@paradise.net.nz>
quoted 10 lines Piontek wrote:> Piontek wrote: > "If you want something to be really angry about, look at > Afghanistan, where the religious fundamentalist government has > made the ownership or use of musical instruments a criminal offence." > > The Afghanis banned musical instruments?!! Cripes, that makes > the U.S. government's killing of a few dozen innocent men, women > and children look tame in comparison! > > Erm, hold on...
Oops! Shite, I'm responding to Anig Browl, not Adam Piontek. Sorry Adam. *bangs head against table to get those neurons firing. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2001-08-08 23:13Richard BarnettAlex Morgan wrote on 8/8/01 05:22: Piontek wrote: "If you want something to be really angr
From:
Richard Barnett
To:
Alex Morgan ,
Date:
Thu, 09 Aug 2001 00:13:38 +0100
Subject:
Re: [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
Reply to:
Re: [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
permalink · <B7978632.634E%richard.barnett@pobox.com>
Alex Morgan wrote on 8/8/01 05:22: Piontek wrote: "If you want something to be really angry about, look at Afghanistan, where the religious fundamentalist government has made the ownership or use of musical instruments a criminal offence." The Afghanis banned musical instruments?!! Cripes, that makes the U.S. government's killing of a few dozen innocent men, women and children look tame in comparison! Erm, hold on... http://www.web.amnesty.org/ai.nsf/countries/afghanistan?OpenView&Start=1&Cou nt=30&Expandall -- Richard
2001-08-08 12:29Anig BrowlFrom: Alex Morgan <amorgan@paradise.net.nz> > Piontek wrote: > "If you want something to b
From:
Anig Browl
To:
IDM List
Date:
Wed, 8 Aug 2001 13:29:08 +0100
Subject:
Re: [idm] speaking of Branch Davidians...
permalink · <002201c12066$bfbef380$35a5869f@pauls>
From: Alex Morgan <amorgan@paradise.net.nz>
quoted 2 lines Piontek wrote:> Piontek wrote: > "If you want something to be really angry about, look at Afghanistan,
where
quoted 2 lines the religious fundamentalist government has made the ownership or use of> the religious fundamentalist government has made the ownership or use of > musical instruments a criminal offence."
Actually I wrote it, but no matter. Oh, you already said that :-)
quoted 3 lines The Afghanis banned musical instruments?!! Cripes, that makes the U.S.> The Afghanis banned musical instruments?!! Cripes, that makes the U.S. > government's killing of a few dozen innocent men, women and children look > tame in comparison!
Waco was one disgraceful incident in recent US history. There have been others, but the US is not a totalitarian state. The Waco thing happened almost 10 years ago; the ban on music in Afghanistan (along with numerous other disgraces) is happening right now. So you can get worked up about what happened to a bunch of naive cultists who maintained a small arsenal (why?), or write a few letters. Take your pick. Anig Browl _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2001-08-09 06:06Alex MorganMy point wasn't that the human-rights record of Afghanistan is 'better' than that of the U
From:
Alex Morgan
To:
Date:
Thu, 9 Aug 2001 18:06:53 +1200
Subject:
[idm] Re: speaking of Branch Davidians...
permalink · <NNECJFLDEKDJDHFICIGEGEIKCBAA.amorgan@paradise.net.nz>
My point wasn't that the human-rights record of Afghanistan is 'better' than that of the US (clearly, it isn't). Rather, I was expressing distaste at what I (playfully) interpreted to be your suggestion that the banning of musical instruments outweighs the killing of a few dozen people. I'm pretty sure that you *don't* actually take this to be the case, and that your point was that, in the context of present world affairs, the Afghanistan situation deserves our attention and indignation more than the 10-year-old Waco incident. I agree, but feel that you were a little dismissive of the (largely innocent) victims of Waco. Anyways, basically I was just being a shirt-stirrer. I will be good now. Promise. No more wildy-off-topic controversial posts from me, nosiree. So... what's the IDMest abortion technique? --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2001-08-09 13:44The ChisaOn Thu, 9 Aug 2001, Alex Morgan wrote: > So... what's the IDMest abortion technique? Why,
From:
The Chisa
To:
Alex Morgan
Cc:
Date:
Thu, 9 Aug 2001 09:44:16 -0400 (EDT)
Subject:
Re: [idm] Re: speaking of Branch Davidians...
Reply to:
[idm] Re: speaking of Branch Davidians...
permalink · <Pine.LNX.4.21.0108090943320.4619-100000@holland.deathhouse.net>
On Thu, 9 Aug 2001, Alex Morgan wrote:
quoted 1 line So... what's the IDMest abortion technique?> So... what's the IDMest abortion technique?
Why, the rhythm method, of course! BWahahahahahahahaha! Okay, I know, that's BIRTH CONTROL, not ABORTION. Sue me. m@2zo --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2001-08-10 03:54forelAlex Morgan wrote: > I agree, but feel that you were a little dismissive of the > (largely
From:
forel
To:
Date:
Thu, 09 Aug 2001 23:54:36 -0400
Subject:
Re: [idm] Re: speaking of Branch Davidians...
Reply to:
[idm] Re: speaking of Branch Davidians...
permalink · <B79808D5.2650%forel@mac.com>
Alex Morgan wrote:
quoted 2 lines I agree, but feel that you were a little dismissive of the> I agree, but feel that you were a little dismissive of the > (largely innocent) victims of Waco.
Tell me...why do you feel you can trust the documentary film makers to be expressing the truth? What makes them more trustworthy than the US government? You know for sure they are not the type to side with the Michigan Militia on all things? Trust no one (it's not just an X Files catch phrase). -- forel elitist fuck --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2001-08-10 11:07forelChispas De Muerte wrote: > The fact that they approach the matter from a > completley unbi
From:
forel
To:
Date:
Fri, 10 Aug 2001 07:07:26 -0400
Subject:
Re: [idm] Re: speaking of Branch Davidians...
permalink · <B79938AE.2707%forel@mac.com>
Chispas De Muerte wrote:
quoted 3 lines The fact that they approach the matter from a> The fact that they approach the matter from a > completley unbiased view and all of the evidence > presented in the movie is totally factual,
Again...what makes you think it is totally factual? And unbiased? You need not reply, you need only to think. This will be my last post on it, considering it's extreme lack of relation to music. -- forel elitist fuck Who realises he has never once posted on topic about IDM. The ass. --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org
2001-08-10 22:40Alex Morgan> Tell me...why do you feel you can trust the documentary film makers to be > expressing t
From:
Alex Morgan
To:
Date:
Sat, 11 Aug 2001 10:40:24 +1200
Subject:
[idm] Re: speaking of Branch Davidians...
permalink · <NNECJFLDEKDJDHFICIGEAEJACBAA.amorgan@paradise.net.nz>
quoted 4 lines Tell me...why do you feel you can trust the documentary film makers to be> Tell me...why do you feel you can trust the documentary film makers to be > expressing the truth? What makes them more trustworthy than the US > government? You know for sure they are not the type to side with the > Michigan Militia on all things?
Because of the factual evidence presented: courtroom footage, witness testimonials, etc. But then again, it might all be a big hoax, like the Apollo landing. (for the record, I'm not a Waco supporter; I think they were a bunch of soft-minded, gun-toting rednecks. However, in my lighter moods, I don't think that ought to be punishable by death... well, I'll make an exception for George Bush). --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org