IDM Mailing Archive

quoted 3 lines check out "goz quarter" from envane. if that doesn't have hip hop

> check out "goz quarter" from envane. if that doesn't have hip hop >influences written all over it (and not just the dr octagon sample), then >call me helen keller. or maybe I just don't know what a hip hop vibe is.

Playing it now, directly after listening to Swollen Members (new CD on Jazz Fudge). Got two words for ya: "Helen Keller". :) ["Give me a turntable and some adidas shoes, then I'll be down with the hip hop scene."] --- Peace Hugs and Unity Jason J. Tar W. W. J. D? (What would Jason Do?) http://pilot.msu.edu/user/tarjason ICQ@13792120

quoted 3 lines check out "goz quarter" from envane. if that doesn't have hip hop

> > check out "goz quarter" from envane. if that doesn't have hip hop > >influences written all over it (and not just the dr octagon sample), then > >call me helen keller. or maybe I just don't know what a hip hop vibe is.

even if this track has "hiphop vibe" apparent to you, a stray track here and there doesn't really justify saying that autechre has a "hip-hop vibe"... this vibe in question is definitely not a staple to their music. and what *is* the deal with PBO? i mean, the first schematic ep is kind of cool. i hear that, and i definitely want to check out what this guy does next. it drags a bit, but, to me, at least, made me really interested... then i get the first CI 12", and that seems like a major dip in quality. but people are saying "oh, these are older songs," so i'm not sure what to think. and then the Skam EP comes along and, wary, i watch the list and most people seem to be going, "Where's the hip hop? Where's the funk?" and calling it straight-up skam-by-numbers. So I sat that one out, hoping to hear it myself off a friend... but I picked up the "half dozen" 12" because it was cheap and,i've listened to it a bunch and i have to say this is just getting silly. It's boring as hell. And the songs are apparently from 95-96. WTF? These tracks aren't quality classic cuts or anything.. And what artist wants to do a 12" of tracks that are almost 4 or 5 years old? Why not put out new PBO tracks or someone else's new tracks? Are we putting out old PBO tracks because we know they'll sell, or because blood is thicker than quality control? I don't get it. anyway, that's my long, tragic tale of being duped into purchasing 3 PBO 12"s that don't push my buttons at all. i guess i'm asking here, What is the deal? Was the first Schematic 12" a one-off excursion into hip-hop for a regularly bleep-blip type of guy? Why put out bland EPs of old material? If he doesn't have new tracks, it's not like there is any shortage of people who do... i don't know. Can anyone make me feel better? rjck.///_____

agreed. I never said that autechre was a rap ban who's missing an mc. I just thought it was a hilareous statement to say that there aren't hip-hop influences in SOME of their stuff. I think goz quarter is a fine exanple of this. I'm pretty sure I've read that rob & sean were (and maybe are) hip hop heads long before autechre happened, which would explain why to use the word "influence" wouldn't be so crazy. em.

quoted 9 lines check out "goz quarter" from envane. if that doesn't have hip hop

>> > check out "goz quarter" from envane. if that doesn't have hip hop >> >influences written all over it (and not just the dr octagon sample), then >> >call me helen keller. or maybe I just don't know what a hip hop vibe is. > > even if this track has "hiphop vibe" apparent > to you, a stray track here and there doesn't really > justify saying that autechre has a "hip-hop vibe"... > this vibe in question is definitely not a staple > to their music.

quoted 7 lines agreed. I never said that autechre was a rap ban who's missing an mc. I just

> agreed. I never said that autechre was a rap ban who's missing an mc. I just > thought it was a hilareous statement to say that there aren't hip-hop > influences in SOME of their stuff. I think goz quarter is a fine exanple of > this. > I'm pretty sure I've read that rob & sean were (and maybe are) hip hop heads > long before autechre happened, which would explain why to use the word > "influence" wouldn't be so crazy.

yeah, there totally needs to be two words to signify the difference between "influence" as in "they listened to a lot of this and it has had an effect on them" and "influence" as in "this music has a distinct discernible relation to this other kind of music..." ,rj../

Now a days everyone is influenced by everything. It's hard not to be. twine . . .

quoted 27 lines -----Original Message-----

> -----Original Message----- > From: warren g. (harding) [SMTP:KIDWELL@tessco.com] > Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 1999 1:11 PM > To: idm@hyperreal.org > Subject: Re: (idm) Helen. > > > agreed. I never said that autechre was a rap ban who's missing an mc. I > just > > thought it was a hilareous statement to say that there aren't hip-hop > > influences in SOME of their stuff. I think goz quarter is a fine exanple > of > > this. > > I'm pretty sure I've read that rob & sean were (and maybe are) hip hop > heads > > long before autechre happened, which would explain why to use the word > > "influence" wouldn't be so crazy. > > yeah, there totally needs to be two words to signify > the difference between "influence" as in "they listened > to a lot of this and it has had an effect on them" > and "influence" as in "this music has a distinct discernible relation > to this other kind of music..." > > > > > ,rj../

Obviously, Autechre has a bit of hip-hop influence. Hip-hop is the current pop music, everything has either incorporated it in some sense, or entirely rejected it. Also, as hip-hop was the first successful electronically created music, all current electronicall created music (as almost all "IDM" short of Rotted One Note is) has that as influence. I'm just thinking here of all my CDs that might vaguely be "IDM" hiphop is more prevalent than dub and house influences. Jungle and Electro are variant on hiphop. Go from there. Hiphop permeates all modern sound in some form or another. Autechre may bury thier influence, but it's still there. To test this, i just put in LP5 and Incunabula and hit random track. Listen. It's true.

quoted 1 line there aren't hip-hop influences in SOME of their stuff. I think goz

>there aren't hip-hop influences in SOME of their stuff. I think goz

quarter is >a fine exanple of this.

quoted 3 lines I'm pretty sure I've read that rob & sean were (and maybe are) hip hop heads

>I'm pretty sure I've read that rob & sean were (and maybe are) hip hop heads >long before autechre happened, which would explain why to use the word >"influence" wouldn't be so crazy.

_________________________________ Adam Roesch / roesch@augsburg.edu University of Idaho / Moscow / ID / USA Visit my Fila Brazillia/Pork Recordings fan site: http://dogbert.augsburg.edu/~roesch/pork/ "Because success needs killing" TRICKY

quoted 5 lines yeah, there totally needs to be two words to signify

>yeah, there totally needs to be two words to signify >the difference between "influence" as in "they listened >to a lot of this and it has had an effect on them" >and "influence" as in "this music has a distinct discernible relation >to this other kind of music..."

damn, that's called BITING. you are a hiphopper, aren't you, representing the 4 elements: biting, jocking, fronting and dissing. tomas

quoted 1 line Moonlight <roesch@augsburg.edu>:

>Moonlight <roesch@augsburg.edu>:

quoted 1 line Also, as hip-hop was the first successful electronically created music,

>Also, as hip-hop was the first successful electronically created music,

What about those Bavarian gents?

quoted 2 lines all

>all >current electronicall created music ...has that as influence.

What of straight swingless techno? Ambient? Beatless isolationism? 3

this subject can be fuzzed out pretty far afield, but sugarhill gang and treacherous three and cohorts were in full force (ar ar) well before planet rock came out. though these are widely considered to be rapping without hip-hop - they used disco grooves and leblanc/wimbish studio jams - flash's "on the wheels of steel" followed some time after, and "planet rock" generally signals the birth of both hip-hop and electro along the current of rap. they are coterminous. eric On Wed, 30 Jun 1999, Joanisse, Robert wrote:

quoted 2 lines electro was the precursor of hip-hop, not a variant. dr dre made surgery

>electro was the precursor of hip-hop, not a variant. dr dre made surgery >before he made straight outta compton.

evenin' all. eric, nice discussion on electro, hip hop and chronology. thanks for clearing up some debates. now, to start another: who can offer me a "canonical" electro album to take a listen to so i can nail down for myself what is electro and what is instead early hip hop ish? suggestions along the lines of "first electro album proper", "best compilation of tip top electro singles" or "peak album of electro in the day" (not revivalist) welcomed. reasoned debate allowed, name calling and attitude not alllowed. :) bonus round: who in the current IDM scene shows the most electro spirit, or influence, or what have you, so i can follow up my archaeology with some modern study. r o b np: digital underground "sex packets"

quoted 8 lines eric

> > eric > > On Wed, 30 Jun 1999, Joanisse, Robert wrote: > > >electro was the precursor of hip-hop, not a variant. dr dre made surgery > >before he made straight outta compton. >

Yeah, I have that 1st Sugarhill rap lp from '79 and it says it is w/the full crew who later became the On-U Sound house band (Wimbish, le Blanc, you can even see Wimbish (I guess) on the inside photo) My related question is: I just got this 12" of "2 Fly" produced by Grand.Flash and on the Out____ Music Co____ (I forget, but eerily similar to "Outward Music Company"). ...So, does anyone know who 2-Fly is? It is from '81-'82 I think... sorry for the spotty memory... On Wed, 30 Jun 1999, eric hill wrote:

quoted 7 lines this subject can be fuzzed out pretty far afield, but sugarhill gang and

> this subject can be fuzzed out pretty far afield, but sugarhill gang and > treacherous three and cohorts were in full force (ar ar) well before > planet rock came out. though these are widely considered to be rapping > without hip-hop - they used disco grooves and leblanc/wimbish studio jams > - flash's "on the wheels of steel" followed some time after, and "planet > rock" generally signals the birth of both hip-hop and electro along the > current of rap. they are coterminous.

----------- Christalmighty,what the heck does 'coterminous' mean, Eric? You're sirtainly verbicious with wordage, Eric... learn that one in one of those red Netware books or was it some O'Reilly pinup centerfold chart? Solanoyd

quoted 7 lines eric

> eric > > On Wed, 30 Jun 1999, Joanisse, Robert wrote: > > >electro was the precursor of hip-hop, not a variant. dr dre made surgery > >before he made straight outta compton. >

So, like, does anyone really know if that rapper's delight bassline was copied by Queen for "another one bites the dust" or was it somehow the other way around?... seems like Sugarhill was one year previous to the queen track. enquiring minds (mine) want to know (for a long time)... solenoid On Wed, 30 Jun 1999, eric hill wrote:

quoted 15 lines this subject can be fuzzed out pretty far afield, but sugarhill gang and

> this subject can be fuzzed out pretty far afield, but sugarhill gang and > treacherous three and cohorts were in full force (ar ar) well before > planet rock came out. though these are widely considered to be rapping > without hip-hop - they used disco grooves and leblanc/wimbish studio jams > - flash's "on the wheels of steel" followed some time after, and "planet > rock" generally signals the birth of both hip-hop and electro along the > current of rap. they are coterminous. > > eric > > On Wed, 30 Jun 1999, Joanisse, Robert wrote: > > >electro was the precursor of hip-hop, not a variant. dr dre made surgery > >before he made straight outta compton. >