IDM Mailing Archive

Someone on this list must know the answer to this question: What has happened with 7"s? Last I remembered, I was getting domestic (U.S.) 7"s for $3-$4 & imports for $4-$5. Then I turned around & all of a sudden the imports went up to $10-$12. Well, not all of them, but particular ones I wanted, namely ones put out by V/Vm & Skam, 2 lovely UK record labels. Granted, both labels are releasing limited runs & that can increase production costs a bit, but I cannot fathom how that alone has led to a 200-300% price increase. This is the most incredible discrepency in pricing I think I've ever seen in all my years of record buying (I've even seen lathe-cut, New Zealand born, limited to less than 100, hand-packaged 8" records sell new for less than these). I thought that the whole attraction to 7"s was that they were cheap to make. Sound quality-wise, they are surely the poorest choice of a format. Unless I'm mistaken, they are the worst at reproducing audio out of all the formats presently available, but they are so cheap to manufacture. That's usually been the reason why I've seen them latched onto: because small-time musicians with little funds can use them to start to spread their music to others. The musicians don't have to put up much money & the record buyers can experiment with buying 7"s with little financial risk. So where did $10-$12 come from? I am not trying to stick out & blast our friends V/Vm, who I know are on this list (don't know about Skam), & I believe them to be honest fellows & fine music-makers & they do say that they are trying to get the prices down, but how did they get up there in the first place? That's more than most 12"s & many CDs. As much as they're some of my favourite musicians right now, I might have to drop them & pretend they don't exist because I can't afford their music (one CD of the "Machine Components" set would've cost me a third to a quarter the price & would've been sonicly much preferable; I wince at the amount of money I sent out for those today, even after searching for the lowest price I could find). So someone, please let me know what happened because I'm very puzzled & having trouble justifying supporting certain musicians who I want to support. Marc Poirier

On Mon, 25 Jan 1999 15:36:16 -0500, you wrote:

quoted 7 lines What has happened with 7"s? Last I remembered, I was getting domestic

> What has happened with 7"s? Last I remembered, I was getting domestic >(U.S.) 7"s for $3-$4 & imports for $4-$5. Then I turned around & all of a >sudden the imports went up to $10-$12. Well, not all of them, but >particular ones I wanted, namely ones put out by V/Vm & Skam, 2 lovely UK >record labels. Granted, both labels are releasing limited runs & that can >increase production costs a bit, but I cannot fathom how that alone has led >to a 200-300% price increase.

and it's not like zavody (where v/vm and skam get their stuff done) are expensive to get 200/300 pressing runs (about 250 pounds for a run of 200 7" singles with labels but no sleeves). there's a healthy profit margin at work here <grin>

quoted 4 lines Someone on this list must know the answer to this question:

> Someone on this list must know the answer to this question: > > What has happened with 7"s? Last I remembered, I was getting domestic > (U.S.) 7"s for $3-$4 & imports for $4-$5. Then I turned around & all of

a

quoted 3 lines sudden the imports went up to $10-$12. Well, not all of them, but

> sudden the imports went up to $10-$12. Well, not all of them, but > particular ones I wanted, namely ones put out by V/Vm & Skam, 2 lovely UK > record labels. Granted, both labels are releasing limited runs & that

can

quoted 1 line increase production costs a bit, but I cannot fathom how that alone has

> increase production costs a bit, but I cannot fathom how that alone has

led

quoted 2 lines to a 200-300% price increase. This is the most incredible discrepency in

> to a 200-300% price increase. This is the most incredible discrepency in > pricing I think I've ever seen in all my years of record buying (I've

even

quoted 4 lines seen lathe-cut, New Zealand born, limited to less than 100, hand-packaged

> seen lathe-cut, New Zealand born, limited to less than 100, hand-packaged > 8" records sell new for less than these). > I thought that the whole attraction to 7"s was that they were cheap to > make. Sound quality-wise, they are surely the poorest choice of a

format.

quoted 1 line Unless I'm mistaken, they are the worst at reproducing audio out of all

> Unless I'm mistaken, they are the worst at reproducing audio out of all

the

quoted 1 line formats presently available, but they are so cheap to manufacture.

> formats presently available, but they are so cheap to manufacture.

That's

quoted 3 lines usually been the reason why I've seen them latched onto: because

> usually been the reason why I've seen them latched onto: because > small-time musicians with little funds can use them to start to spread > their music to others. The musicians don't have to put up much money &

the

quoted 3 lines record buyers can experiment with buying 7"s with little financial risk.

> record buyers can experiment with buying 7"s with little financial risk. > So where did $10-$12 come from? I am not trying to stick out & blast > our friends V/Vm, who I know are on this list (don't know about Skam), &

I

quoted 3 lines believe them to be honest fellows & fine music-makers & they do say that

> believe them to be honest fellows & fine music-makers & they do say that > they are trying to get the prices down, but how did they get up there in > the first place?

A Skam 7" such as the Bola Aguilla cost 4.99 pounds from Picadilly Records in Manchester. And I'm pretty certain Picadilly get them delivered by the labels in person. So... at say 500 pounds to produce 250, it's a 100% markup. However, even at around a pound profit per unit for the label, it's not a huge amount of cash. Maybe that's why V/VM are releasing 50? I'd like to see more labels doing things like the Muslimgauze 'Melt' release. You got a top quality release and even the super hi-res artwork files. If the labels cared about getting their music out to people rather than playing games with the spotters they'd all be doing internet releases. The download times for a typical 12" release are bearable even on a modem connection...there's enough people keen enough to pillage that Bleep Bloop ftp site. And as for DJing with two copies of Winamp, I reckon you'd need two soundcards or a single fancy one. Dunno how practical it is getting two sound devices on a laptop though...

quoted 4 lines I'd like to see more labels doing things like the Muslimgauze 'Melt'

> I'd like to see more labels doing things like the Muslimgauze 'Melt' > release. You got a top quality release and even the super hi-res artwork > files. If the labels cared about getting their music out to people rather > than playing games with the spotters they'd all be doing internet releases.

I really disagree with this attitude. A lot of people into computers seem to forget that the vast majority of people in the world don't have computers, & (obviously) even fewer people have computers with web & sound capabilities. Marc Poirier

quoted 9 lines I'd like to see more labels doing things like the Muslimgauze 'Melt'

> > I'd like to see more labels doing things like the Muslimgauze 'Melt' > > release. You got a top quality release and even the super hi-res artwork > > files. If the labels cared about getting their music out to people rather > > than playing games with the spotters they'd all be doing internet releases. > > I really disagree with this attitude. A lot of people into computers seem > to forget that the vast majority of people in the world don't have > computers, & (obviously) even fewer people have computers with web & sound > capabilities.

Hence my objection to Public Enemy doing an MP3 release.

quoted 6 lines [...] A lot of people into computers seem

> > [...] A lot of people into computers seem > > to forget that the vast majority of people in the world don't have > > computers, & (obviously) even fewer people have computers with web & sound > > capabilities. > > Hence my objection to Public Enemy doing an MP3 release.

By all appearances, Public Enemy are being dicked around by their record company. In defiance, they are distributing the material through the best available route. I think it is less elitist than pressing white-label 12"s for example. --Mark __ Burning Rome : SENSELESS CD on Mindfield Records MindCD03 Cathartium 14 > Distributed by Dutch East India Trading, Com Four, and Carrot Top < < http://www.xnet.com/~mkolmar/BurningRome > < MP3 & RealAudio tracks >

quoted 2 lines I'd like to see more labels doing things like the Muslimgauze 'Melt'

> > > I'd like to see more labels doing things like the Muslimgauze 'Melt' > > > release. You got a top quality release and even the super hi-res

artwork

quoted 1 line files. If the labels cared about getting their music out to people

> > > files. If the labels cared about getting their music out to people

rather

quoted 1 line than playing games with the spotters they'd all be doing internet

> > > than playing games with the spotters they'd all be doing internet

releases. Cool!

quoted 1 line I really disagree with this attitude. A lot of people into computers

> > I really disagree with this attitude. A lot of people into computers

seem

quoted 2 lines to forget that the vast majority of people in the world don't have

> > to forget that the vast majority of people in the world don't have > > computers, & (obviously) even fewer people have computers with web &

sound

quoted 1 line capabilities.

> > capabilities.

And here I have to guess at how many people have computers (in the UK) compared to how many people have record players... (I have both :-). I'd bet there's now more people with a computer. Everyone on this e-mail list, by definition, has an Internet-capable computer. And (in the UK at least) you can get a web&sound capable computer for around 50 quid (the price has dropped dramatically over the past couple of years). Some big companies are *giving* away entire computer rooms, because the machines are just out of date.

quoted 1 line Hence my objection to Public Enemy doing an MP3 release.

> Hence my objection to Public Enemy doing an MP3 release.

MP4, actually. Perhaps they will encourage more people to get a cheap computer, and that would seem to be a good thing. Sorry, but I think it's just as elitist saying "You can't use a computer, it's not cool" as saying "You can't use a computer, you're poor and from the ghetto". Just IMHO, of course. Jeremy.

quoted 5 lines I really disagree with this attitude. A lot of people into computers

>> > I really disagree with this attitude. A lot of people into computers >seem >> > to forget that the vast majority of people in the world don't have >> > computers, & (obviously) even fewer people have computers with web & >> >sound capabilities.

well, while we're at it, while they probably do have electricity, the majority of The World no doubt get by in their daily lives without stereos. is it back to sticks and water for instruments in the interests of appealing to the majority? it's not like all musicians are foregoing everything that went before to make music listenable only on computers, bochum welt notwithstanding.

quoted 3 lines Hence my objection to Public Enemy doing an MP3 release.

>> Hence my objection to Public Enemy doing an MP3 release. > >MP4, actually.

the thing about PE and MP4 that gets me is that MP4 isn't related to MP3 (,2,1...) at all: "MP4" was co-opted by a private company for their proprietary, 'no free player needed,' self-running music delivery system. kind of like divx, i guess. eric onnow: tetsu inoue : world receiver (instinct)

Greg Clow wrote: <Chk... FIZZZzzz..... STOMP!>

quoted 3 lines And then there are some of us who do have computers with these

> And then there are some of us who do have computers with these > capabilities, but fucking hate listening to music on their computer. > That's what my stereo is for, godammit!

HUH? I always listen to my CDs using my PC as a CD player and hooking that thing up to my stereo - what's the problem with that? (And also, I'm makin' music using my PC - don't tell me I had a choice... ^_^)

quoted 2 lines I'll listen to CDs on my CD-ROM drive at work, but that's it. MP3s are a pain

> I'll listen to CDs on my CD-ROM drive at work, but that's it. MP3s are a pain > in the ass, except to get an idea if I need to own a CD or not.

Also, if your graphics card's drivers cause sound stuttering if you dare to put a little heavier load (like, say, scrolling a window) on it, it sucks - other than that (which ain't the MP3 format's fault) I don't have problems...

quoted 2 lines Maybe I'd feel different if I had a CD burner... but then again, I have

> Maybe I'd feel different if I had a CD burner... but then again, I have > enough 'spotter friends who can burn rare shit for me, so why bother?

Mmmm... The Orb's "Assassin" just comes to my mind... :) -- Kurt B. Pruenner kurt.pruenner@jk.uni-linz.ac.at Haendelstrasse 17 http://wildsau.idv.uni-linz.ac.at/~k30a2e7/ A-4020 Linz/AUSTRIA Web-Admin of http://www.hermes-gfx.gup.uni-linz.ac.at/ np: Underworld - Mother Earth (DubNoBassWithMyHeadMan) BUZZ / BUZZ 2 http://www.buzz2.com/ WARP Records http://www.warp-net.com/ Aphex Twin http://aphex.base.org/ Underworld http://www.dirty.org/