IDM Mailing Archive

quoted 31 lines i prefer "expression." "art" brings it to an elitist level, imo, and i

>> i prefer "expression." "art" brings it to an elitist level, imo, and i >> think it has paved the way for people like britney spears, spice girls, >> etc. >> (goes back farther than that, but they are a direct link) to take >> advantage >> of the formula of "art" for money's sake. it's deeper than all this but >> i >> don't know if i'd want to litter the list with all that. > > Oh most respected Vzaem, > > I gotta disagree. How is creative expression different from art? How > does calling music "art" make it elitist? How would its being elitist > make Britney Spears rich? > Art doesn't have formulas; science has formulas. Certain genres of art > have rules to follow in order to stay within that genre, but if you're > trying to write a rock song with paint on canvas your result may not be > rock music but it will probably still be considered art. Come to think of > it, it might end up IDM. Heh. > Computers follow formulas and spit out a result, people create art. If > Britney's songwriting team is simply plugging in random numbers into a > songwriting equation of some sort, then they are not making art and we > don't have to worry about it. But I don't see how it's possible for a > human, or even a committee of humans to write a piece of music without > some kind of creativity involved. Perhaps Britney Spears is just a vocal > athelete of sorts making money off of the work of artists, but that don't > mean it ain't art. Using B.S. and the Spice Girls as a reason not to call > music art is like refusing to ever use cars because some people choose to > drive them over cliffs! > > Zzb

I'd like to point out that regarding certain types of music esp. rock & pop as valid 'art' forms it is only a relatively recent phenomenon. Most rock and pop artists of the 60's and early 70's would have been offended if their work was spoken of as art. It is mainly due to the efforts of the prog-rockers that some people began applying artistic ideas to popular music. The 70's saw an explosion in conceptual art, which crudely speaking was supposed to be totally ideas based i.e.. you could not buy and sell works like paintings or sculptures. In the 70's you also see an emergence of 'sound artists' and relatively high profile collaborations between artists and musicians which helped to unify sound and art in the consosness. It is also worth noting that many of these developments in artistic thinking and endeavour are not recognised or 'understood' until many years after the event (art historian's like to think about things for at least 10 years so they can construct 'art history'). Personally I think it's a waste of time to categorise societies output into art and non art objects - as for elitism yes art has an established hierarchy as does music, sport and politics and is inherently elitist (it is certainly regarded as such by many people). As with all these discussions it all comes down to your personal interpretation - it's art if you think it's art etc. But remember just because you regard a thing as art it does not make it any good. john. _________________________________ _________________________________ Leafcutter Release info... <><>ZEAGMA 3 track 7" (ZIQ036, grey label) will be available from the usual outlets from April the 30th. <><>I have a new track on the CD version of the speedy j/µ-ziq re-mix comp 'Slag Boom Van Loon So Soon' (ZIQ007CD) which also features mixes by Boards of Canada (x2), µ-Ziq, Tipper, Horse Opera, Four Tet, Pole, Matmos, and Coil. It will be out sometime around May 29th. <><>Also in the pipeline a re-mix of Electric Company on on Tigerbeat6 and a track on their forthcoming double CD compilation. Live info... <><>The proposed tour if Germany with Capitol k is going ahead - we'll be visiting the following cities: Dresden - Scheune - 25th may, Chemnitz - Voxxx - 26th may, Hamburg - Golden Pudel - 27th may, Berlin - Bastard - 29th may. www.leafcutterjohn.co.uk www.planet-mu.com _________________________________ _________________________________ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: idm-unsubscribe@hyperreal.org For additional commands, e-mail: idm-help@hyperreal.org