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(idm) Rant on IDM/ADM

5 messages · 5 participants · spans 2 days · search this subject
1998-05-03 21:16robot Re: (idm) Rant on IDM/ADM
1998-05-03 21:17(idm) Rant on IDM/ADM
├─ 1998-05-03 19:17laerm Re: (idm) Rant on IDM/ADM
└─ 1998-05-05 17:11brian j tang Re: (idm) Rant on IDM/ADM
1998-05-04 02:28koalan ghibb Re: (idm) Rant on IDM/ADM
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1998-05-03 21:16robotNuutti-Iivari Meriläinen wrote: > Categorising > music by genre is either a masculine trai
From:
robot
To:
armchair music
Date:
Sun, 03 May 1998 14:16:50 -0700
Subject:
Re: (idm) Rant on IDM/ADM
permalink · <354CDEC2.D07CD810@san.rr.com>
Nuutti-Iivari Meriläinen wrote:
quoted 3 lines Categorising> Categorising > music by genre is either a masculine trait inherent in all human life or > a genial ploy of the marketing powers-that-be.
Wow! Categorizing ANYTHING is part of every known culture and language. It's our way of helping us describe the similarities in things. If we had to take the time to explain the details of everything, we wouldn't even have time to sleep! There's nothing wrong with categories. Literally speaking every instance of anything never happens twice. Everything is different. Everything is random, but within this randomness there are repeating similarities that occur in patterns. This is why we categorize. Humans, both women AND men, can see these patterns and therefore group things categorically. So then, why should music be any different? Sure every song is different. Even the same recording of every song played back is going to sound different given the changing acoustics of our surroundings or the random placement of our ears at any given moment. So based on your argument we shouldn't even name songs, because all music is different from listen to listen... If I start a thread declaring Two Bad Mice deserved to be discuss on this list, I'd get shot down in seconds. Sure several of the list members may like it, that's not the issue. It's a rave anthem! It's not the least bit cerebral. It's a speaker thumping, dance-floor moving, throw your hands in the air warehouse rave track. Hell, it doesn't need to be intellectual. Who can be intellectual when pumped full of e at a rave? It's extremely paranoid to pronounce categories as marketing ploys. Hell, most marketing firms aren't creative enough to come up with their own classifications. What makes marketing geniuses is not the ability to create a category, but the ability to exploit them. So it's not enough to say that people who purchase music or even build their identity on categories are fools. Instead you should say that people who buy into marketing ploys which exploit natural classifications in order to profit are buying into a commercial identity. People should stop being so lazy and express their own free will by exploring beyond what the commercial industry is feeding them. Besides, IDM wasn't a term coined by the industry. It was a term coined by a few net heads who wanted to start a list about this new style of Techno that began to emerge in the early 90's. It was seemingly a more "intelligent" approach to a scene that was driven by the dance floor and a mindless beat. There's nothing wrong with expanding new territories and there's especially nothing wrong with naming those territories. By identifying the boundaries of style it allows someone who wishes to create art within that boundary to explore the edges and push our understanding. -rbc3 robot
1998-05-03 21:17Nuutti-Iivari "Merilinen" <gordon@vip.fi>Thus spake GamePrg.: > > I still like IDM though.. > NB. This article may or may not be a
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Date:
Sun, 3 May 1998 21:17:15 +0300 (EET DST)
Subject:
(idm) Rant on IDM/ADM
permalink · <199805031817.VAA20052@pinnie.vip.fi>
Thus spake GamePrg.:
quoted 3 lines I still like IDM though..> > I still like IDM though.. >
NB. This article may or may not be a complete waste of your time and/or bandwidth. Continue at your own discretion, I will rant incoherently for a while. The current thread on IDM/ADM is pathologically ridiculous. Categorising music by genre is either a masculine trait inherent in all human life or a genial ploy of the marketing powers-that-be. I will not deny that classification and categorisation of things is futile or useless, but building one's identity or community via these fabricated constructs is. The terms IDM or ADM (or any other acronym you might think of that describes this list's contents), whether they refer to a style (or styles) of music or the community at large who listen to music that can be classified under the abovementioned style(s), are oxymoronic word-constructs. The music one listens to should be one's own, and I do not mean that you should materially possess the music in one form or another. I mean that the music one listens to should be emotionally, intellectually and even physically satisfying. An occasionally rising thread on this list concerns the 'essential IDM record'. It does not exist, because IDM/ADM/whatever as a genre does not exists. There are no artists that could be referred to as 'proto-IDM'. One could argue that the records and artists that were discussed in the beginning of IDM should be those that defined the category, but that would surely limit the scope of discussion even though the artists in question have undoubtedly progressed in thought, talent and style. Next time you listen to a record that was recommended on this list, pause for a thought. Really, REALLY listen to the record and ask yourself five times 'does the music really give me something or do I just want to belong in another group, another target market?' I have seen a sort of a lemming- effect a couple of times with one starting 'I bought (record X which belongs to a genre that is being pushed at the moment) and it is awesome! Go buy this now!' And it starts to cascade. After about twenty articles the thing has blown away and another starts. Excellent music is timeless. Seldom a day goes by that I do not grab an old record from my shelf, listen to it and think 'there is an idea on this record'. Most music discussed recently on this list have truly become what electronic music has always been accused of: soulless and unemotional. They are just the latest thing to pull coins out of your pockets through your ears. If I really think like this, what am I doing on this list? Because there are still tidbits of good information flying around, and every now and then someone is selling an old record that arouses me from my dormant state. Because this list (in general) reflects at least partially my taste in music. But I do tend to think with my own brains, not collectively like the custom is within lists of this kind. I do not seek to change things around here, and I do not wish to voice my opinion against any particular style of music, subject or person. Actually, there is one thing I would like to change. I would like to see the I back in IDM back on the list. In agreement with some of the recent articles, I think most of us lack the ability to verbalise our emotions when we listen to music. Thus, the thread on music that makes one weep was very near to my heart as well. That kind of a reaction is very personal and comes through subjective, not collective experience. Exactly what I am looking for when I listen to music. EDM - Emotional Dance Music? -- nuutti-iivari meril?inen -> gordon@diversion.org : diversion communications technostructuralist + information architect + media designer
1998-05-03 19:17laermOn Sun, 3 May 1998, Nuutti-Iivari Meril?inen wrote: > EDM - Emotional Dance Music? i'll fi
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laerm
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Date:
Sun, 3 May 1998 15:17:33 -0400 (EDT)
Subject:
Re: (idm) Rant on IDM/ADM
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(idm) Rant on IDM/ADM
permalink · <Pine.SUN.3.96.980503151623.13092A-100000@omni2>
On Sun, 3 May 1998, Nuutti-Iivari Meril?inen wrote:
quoted 1 line EDM - Emotional Dance Music?> EDM - Emotional Dance Music?
i'll finish the series: Odm (overt dance music), Udm (ugly dance music) and Ydm (yes, dance music). * #### a disturbance in a system. #### laerm. @voicenet.com #### one time and you're a philosopher; two times and you're a pervert.
1998-05-05 17:11brian j tang> Thus spake GamePrg.: > > > > I still like IDM though.. > > > NB. This article may or may
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brian j tang
To:
Date:
Tue, 5 May 1998 12:11:46 -0500
Subject:
Re: (idm) Rant on IDM/ADM
Reply to:
(idm) Rant on IDM/ADM
permalink · <8498B7F52533@smtp.royalblueny.com>
quoted 11 lines Thus spake GamePrg.:> Thus spake GamePrg.: > > > > I still like IDM though.. > > > NB. This article may or may not be a complete waste of your time and/or > bandwidth. Continue at your own discretion, I will rant incoherently for > a while. > > The current thread on IDM/ADM is pathologically ridiculous. Categorising > music by genre is either a masculine trait inherent in all human life or > a genial ploy of the marketing powers-that-be.
actually I tend to use on a semantical basis. Like talking to a friend, "I was thinking of going to listen to DJ foo tonite, what does he spin", "well dj foo spins a bit of minimal techno, and will sometimes have some runs of progressive house." These genrefications come in very handy at times. While what you are saying about the marketing aspects can be true I don't really think that the marketing powers that be really made it past electronica and drum'n'bass. Even though electronica is a marketing term, I thinks it's probably a good one in the sense of describing the whole broad based-genre including techno, house, jungle, downtempo, intelligent gabber, speed jungle, or happy trance. etc. etc. and I don't have to go and explain what IDM means, and how I find the term intelligent pretentious. ObIdm: RAC is gewWd brian tang royalblue technologies
1998-05-04 02:28koalan ghibb---Nuutti-Iivari Meril?inen <gordon@vip.fi> wrote: > NB. This article may or may not be a
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koalan ghibb
To:
,
Date:
Sun, 3 May 1998 19:28:22 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:
Re: (idm) Rant on IDM/ADM
permalink · <19980504022822.21126.rocketmail@send1a.yahoomail.com>
---Nuutti-Iivari Meril?inen <gordon@vip.fi> wrote:
quoted 1 line NB. This article may or may not be a complete waste of your time> NB. This article may or may not be a complete waste of your time
and/or it wasn't.. some good points.. i'll just show where i disagree/question it.
quoted 1 line record'. Most music discussed recently on this list have truly> record'. Most music discussed recently on this list have truly
become what
quoted 1 line electronic music has always been accused of: soulless and> electronic music has always been accused of: soulless and
unemotional. They i think a lot of the music (skam, etc) discussed recently and a lot of the music discussed in general is made by some of the most genious people of the world, putting their emotion and soul into it. sure, there's a lot of crap, but people crap a lot
quoted 1 line Excellent music is timeless. Seldom a day goes by that I do not> Excellent music is timeless. Seldom a day goes by that I do not
grab an
quoted 1 line old record from my shelf, listen to it and think 'there is an idea> old record from my shelf, listen to it and think 'there is an idea
on this and then
quoted 1 line someone is selling an old record that arouses me from my dormant> someone is selling an old record that arouses me from my dormant
state. old.. hmm.. didn't someone just comment on how they dislike people who cling to the greatness of the old and the horribleness of the new ?
quoted 1 line there is one thing I would like to change. I would like to see the I> there is one thing I would like to change. I would like to see the I
back in
quoted 1 line IDM back on the list.> IDM back on the list.
bad move.. don't do that. now people think you think they are unintelligent or have been saying unintelligent things ;(
quoted 1 line EDM - Emotional Dance Music?> EDM - Emotional Dance Music?
sure.. and: ADM - abnormal dance music WDM - weird dance music NDM - nontraditional dance music.. anything works.. XDM - place what you think for the X.. that should be what it is ;) cg == new type of phun advertisement follows: _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com