IDM Mailing Archive

.... just curious...... now that "our" music is in the mainstream (USA, I mean) I realized something I hoped would *NOT* happen. I know a guy writing a book on the history of pop music. He teaches a course on it. Now he'll start with the delta blues and how it went on up to Chicago ... to Elvis....to Beatles....to 70's disco ...so forth. Now the most current book he showed me goes all the way up to the ALTERNATIVE craze when Nirvana blew up the charts. Do you all think that groups like (P/CB's/Orbital/etc.) will eventually be written about in these types of books? anyone think this stuff will last long enough, with Mtv and other corporate giants backing up 'the next big thing', to be considered for his book? Or is it still to early to tell. He is nowhere near DONE and, I would immagine, maybe this stuff will be a page or less to be thrown in at the end . I often hoped this style of music would be able to avoid this. Kinda wanted my children (later in life) to discover this music all to themselves, like I did, not by some retro-fad like kids today discovering Punk Rock b/c of Green Day. What do y'all predict? THis is *NOT* a continuation of the thread that won't die. It is a theoretical question for the INTELLIGENT people the list. I ask, are we on the road to making our mark in popular music's history??? Should we care??? Maybe we have tooo many sub-genre's within electronic music for it to be well represented. So, maybe I shouldn't worry, eh? One way or anotha' i will still play SAW1 to my wife's pregnant belly (if and when that happens). As long as the kids don't use my discs for frisbees..... 0 btw I don't have kids yet. Just wanted to clarify that part

quoted 5 lines Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 14:42:20 +0000

> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 1997 14:42:20 +0000 > From: 0 <galaxey@earthlink.net> > Reply-to: galaxey@earthlink.net > To: "idm@hyperreal.org" <idm@hyperreal.org> > Subject: (idm) will it be in the history books

quoted 5 lines THis is *NOT* a continuation of the thread that won't die. It is a theoretical

> THis is *NOT* a continuation of the thread that won't die. It is a theoretical > question for the INTELLIGENT people the list. I ask, are we on the road to > making our mark in popular music's history??? Should we care??? Maybe we > have tooo many sub-genre's within electronic music for it to be well represented. > So, maybe I shouldn't worry, eh?

I think that there probably are too many sub-genres... just within the list, so many are brought up that sometimes the definition of what we are supposed to discuss here (at least for me) gets pretty muddled... I'm not saying that I NEED a clear definition, just that there's alot of stuff going on. There's some movie being made on rave culture by Hypnotic (Cleopatra) and I highly doubt anything discussed here will even be touched on... of course, I'm sure, as with Cleo comps, it'll probably cover mostly THEIR artists =) Anyways, are the artists here really making a mark? I know that on rec.music.industrial, I am more and more seeing the names Autechre and Aphex brought up... FSOL was being mention constantly for a while. Maybe, if more people do start getting into it, it will start influencing other completely different genres (say industrial, if it hasn't already) and then I'd say, ya, its made a mark... otherwise, I couldn't say... but then, what the hell do I know =) __________________________________________ brap@sonic.net *** sfwd@sonic.net http://www.sonic.net/~brap/ DOT.info.station the.hardcore.outdated.GPO.page c.Gosselin, POBox8264, Santa Rosa, CA 95407

ess to be thrown in at the end .

quoted 4 lines I often hoped this style of music would be able to avoid this. Kinda wanted my

> > I often hoped this style of music would be able to avoid this. Kinda wanted my > children (later in life) to discover this music all to themselves, like I did, not by > some retro-fad like kids today discovering Punk Rock b/c of Green Day.

i find this a rather strange comment. isnt it more important that they can sift out the good from the bad instead of discovering through a "starter" group? i certainly didnt start listening to jega or boards of canada without a long journey starting with 808 state, altern8, etc. the key is to be able to realize that green day is not doing something all that new and to do the research to understand how they got there. unrelated note- the new farmers manual (fsck) is excellent. like oval meets squarepusher in parts. highly recommended. c

<galaxey@earthlink.net> wrote:

quoted 3 lines I know a guy writing a book on the history of pop

> I know a guy writing a book on the history of pop > music. He teaches a course on it. Now he'll start with the delta blues and how it > went on up to Chicago ... to Elvis....to Beatles....to 70's disco ...so forth.

This sounds just like the curriculum of the very excellent PBS mini-series "The History of Rock And Roll." Don't let the title deceive you - it's one of the most amazing and insightful documentaries ever made about the history of modern music. I wouldn't be surprised if your freind were using the 10-odd episode series as a course guide.

quoted 4 lines Now the

> Now the > most current book he showed me goes all the way up to the ALTERNATIVE craze > when Nirvana blew up the charts. Do you all think that groups like > (P/CB's/Orbital/etc.) will eventually be written about in these types of books?

The last episode of the show covers hip hop, electro, Kraftwork, Afrika Bambaata, Techno, and has extended interviews with Alex Paterson. The show was made about three or four years ago, so they were pretty hip even back then. The show basically implied that this was what was next. I highly recommend that all of you watch this series whenever it's on. You don't have to catch the whole thing either - every episode, whether its the one with the huge profile of Lee Perry's Black Ark Studios (showing him walking through the charred remains wondering why he did it), or the one about the James Brown/Bootsy Collins/Sly Stone connection, or the one about the stones vs. the beatles, watch them all! Don't avoid the southern rock episode because you hate Lynyrd Skynyrd - it's fascinating and damned relevent even today.

quoted 3 lines I often hoped this style of music would be able to avoid this. Kinda wanted my

> I often hoped this style of music would be able to avoid this. Kinda wanted my > children (later in life) to discover this music all to themselves, like I did, not by > some retro-fad like kids today discovering Punk Rock b/c of Green Day.

I was watching some Punk Rockers on St. Marks Place, NYC the other day, and I realized that their post-apocalyptic aesthetic belied a more disturbing characteristic: They were retro! I mean, I was a punk rocker about a decade ago, and even then I was about ten years out of date. And I remember at the time thinking how stupid the hippie kids were since they were aping a style twenty years out of date. Now Punk Rock is twenty years out of date! Who's the throwback now? If you want your kids to make informed decisions about what music they choose to enjoy, keep them well informed. A good start is to show them the PBS series. I can only wish one blessing upon you: That your kids will listen to music which at first makes you cringe in horror, but which they eventually teach *you* to enjoy. I hope my kids do not sinply worship what I was into two decades before, and I hope I don't either. -CF

-----Original Message----- Solenoid said Mark Smith, of the band The Fall once said of this retro stuff: "If I ever catch my kids listenning to my record collection because they thought this music was for them, I'd kill them. Real rock 'n roll is whatever a kid's parents can't stand, and right now that is electronic dance music, techno, etc. " ------ Word! Watch out all you makers of fads! It's M.E.S. in shoulder pads! -CF

quoted 13 lines I can only wish one blessing upon you: That your kids will listen to

>> >> I can only wish one blessing upon you: That your kids will listen to >> music which at first makes you cringe in horror, but which they >> eventually teach *you* to enjoy. I hope my kids do not sinply worship >> what I was into two decades before, and I hope I don't either. >> >> -CF > >Mark Smith, of the band The Fall once said of this retro stuff: "If I ever >catch my kids listenning to my record collection because they thought this >music was for them, I'd kill them. Real rock 'n roll is whatever a kid's >parents can't stand, and right now that is electronic dance music, techno, >etc. "

Further off topic I know but:- I'm going to be meeting Mark E. himself in a couple of weeks when a band in which I play supports The Fall at the Festival in Edinburgh. I'm not worried about playing (we'll slay the place... ;) ) but I can't help but think that, in the grand Charles Bukowski tradition, a face-to-face with the man could be disappointing (or even physically injuring...) ..ho hum. As quoted above, the man has a large stroke of genius accompanied by a bloody mindedness that I admire - but usually from a distance... Rubyjune.