IDM Mailing Archive

1997-04-19 03:26baseheadsorry, i'm in a bit of a shock tonight. i think the fact that there are people in the worl

From:: basehead <basehead@zip1.ziplink.net>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.com>
Date:: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 23:26:56 -0400 (EDT)
Subject:: (idm) shock

sorry, i'm in a bit of a shock tonight. i think the fact that there are people in the world who think copyrighting is a bullshit sham is disgusting. we'll see how your view changes if you ever have a track ripped off and put on a compilation without permission.. really i just dont even quite know what to say.. i can't believe that anybody could not realize how important to an artist a copyright is. if i put myself into something (and other artists too i would hope), and all of my time into it, why should it be just sitting there waiting to be stripped away from me for someone else to claim as their own? it's like copyrighting is protection against kidnapping of my child, in some ways. i dont know how anyone who is SERIOUS about music (making it especially) could see it differently. disillusioned, dan g

1997-04-19 10:07Black Dog DroidHi basehead, > i think the fact that there are people in the world who > think copyrightin

From:: Black Dog Droid <zoot@sparta.dogsquad.com>
To:: basehead <basehead@zip1.ziplink.net>
Date:: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 11:07:14 +0100 (BST)
Subject:: Re: (idm) shock
Reply to:: (idm) shock

Hi basehead,

quoted 2 lines i think the fact that there are people in the world who

> i think the fact that there are people in the world who > think copyrighting is a bullshit sham is disgusting.

grin, it takes all sorts.. while as an artist, i agree that "downright ripping off" *is* obscene....just one look at the internet, and it's lack of any copyright should show you how the future is going. As was pointed out to me, a lot of people are using CD's for recording at home. 'Piracy' is on the increase, you gotta face it.

quoted 2 lines we'll see how your view changes if you ever have a track

> we'll see how your view changes if you ever have a track > ripped off and put on a compilation without permission..

it's happened to me plenty of times, and i *still* gladly use wares and noncopywritten software when i get the chance. it's a moral thing for me. if i feel the artist can afford it, then tape it...likewise...how much more money do microsoft need?? grin, how many samples have *you* used, but not got clearance for?? "bloody loads" in my case.

quoted 2 lines i dont know how anyone who is SERIOUS about music

> i dont know how anyone who is SERIOUS about music > (making it especially) could see it differently.

grin. putting his hand up. but then i don't want a big house in the country, or lots of expensive material posessions. Primarily, I just want people to hear my music. On a pirate disc, or otherwise. I *DO* appreciate that we have to eat, but this is an exciting time for artists. There'll always be scumbags waiting to rip off creative people. Throughout history there are examples, try not to let it get you down.. Rgds, Ken -- + . /\___/\ . * | < The Black Dog > | + * . . * . . * (. .) + | | . * . * + ___ooO__\-/__Ooo___ | | + + + + . /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ | Dogma >> | http://www.feedback.com/tbd/ * 3-5-3 * (Dis)information > | tbd@feedback.com

1997-04-19 04:58brenden1@ix.netcom.combasehead wrote: > > sorry, i'm in a bit of a shock tonight. i think the fact that there >

From:: <brenden1@ix.netcom.com>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.com>
Date:: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 23:58:37 -0500
Subject:: Re: (idm) shock

basehead wrote:

quoted 18 lines sorry, i'm in a bit of a shock tonight. i think the fact that there

> > sorry, i'm in a bit of a shock tonight. i think the fact that there > are people in the world who think copyrighting is a bullshit sham is > disgusting. we'll see how your view changes if you ever have a track > ripped off and put on a compilation without permission.. > > really i just dont even quite know what to say.. i can't believe > that anybody could not realize how important to an artist a copyright > is. if i put myself into something (and other artists too i would > hope), and all of my time into it, why should it be just sitting > there waiting to be stripped away from me for someone else to > claim as their own? it's like copyrighting is protection against > kidnapping of my child, in some ways. i dont know how anyone who > is SERIOUS about music (making it especially) could see it > differently. > > disillusioned, > dan g

As a fellow electronic musician I understand your concern completely. There are far too many people looking to rip of artists as it is. The only protection you have from creative thievery is a copyright on your material. It's hard enough to make a name or any money in electronic music without having to worry about other people banking on your work. Personally I don't even feel right about sampling other artists.......at all! Why would I sample anything off someone elses recording when I've got the brains and the equipment to invent my own resources? B R E N D E N

1997-04-19 06:51brenden1@ix.netcom.comobjet petit a wrote: > I can't remember who it was -- Emma Goldman? Leon Trotsky? Malebran

From:: <brenden1@ix.netcom.com>
To:: <idm@hyperreal.com>
Date:: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 01:51:43 -0500
Subject:: Re: (idm) shock

objet petit a wrote:

quoted 25 lines I can't remember who it was -- Emma Goldman? Leon Trotsky? Malebranche?

> I can't remember who it was -- Emma Goldman? Leon Trotsky? Malebranche? > -- that once said the following: > > "Property IS theft." > > And 'kids' grow up to become their own people, too -- they kidnap > *themselves.* > > Wouldn't it be fascinating if a parent sued a child for copyright > infringement? > Or vice versa? > > Imitation being the sincerest form of flattery and all -- I guess views > on this would depend upon whether one wants to have ephemeral fame & > fortune or a massive transhistorical influence on culture. Should > Boeing and Lockheed channel a certain amount of royalties from every B-2 > bomber sold to the remaining estate of the Wright Brothers? > > Ways of the world. > > sr > -- > sd > > NP: refried food

I appreciate your opinion, and nobody can deny that they are "influenced" by previous musical accomplishments. I thought we were discussing incidents where someone actually use part or all of one of your compositions under their name. An example that comes to mind is an incident involving Mark Gage. He says someone slowed down one of his songs, changed the name, and proceeded to release it on a compilation cd. That is hardly flattery or musical evolution. And unless your material is properly protected this kind of thing can happen. As far as your example with airplanes, I see your point but the planes are more like the instuments we use than what we do with them. Do you understand me? My bottom line is that to me intelligent music of any genre infers originality. And if you do something truly original, other people are likely to want to get involved. Whether that means emulating your approach , your style, or looping four bars of your best song is up to them. I'd just prefer that they didn't have that last option. B R E N D E N

1997-04-19 23:46Brett McCormickOn Sat, 19 April 1997, at 01:51:43, brenden1@ix.netcom.com wrote: > I appreciate your opin

From:: Brett McCormick <brett@speedy.speakeasy.org>
To:: <brenden1@ix.netcom.com>
Cc:: <idm@hyperreal.com>
Date:: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 16:46:54 -0700 (PDT)
Subject:: Re: (idm) shock
Reply to:: Re: (idm) shock

On Sat, 19 April 1997, at 01:51:43, brenden1@ix.netcom.com wrote:

quoted 8 lines I appreciate your opinion, and nobody can deny that they are

> I appreciate your opinion, and nobody can deny that they are > "influenced" by previous musical accomplishments. I thought we were > discussing incidents where someone actually use part or all of one of > your compositions under their name. An example that comes to mind is an > incident involving Mark Gage. He says someone slowed down one of his > songs, changed the name, and proceeded to release it on a compilation > cd. That is hardly flattery or musical evolution. And unless your > material is properly protected this kind of thing can happen.

In this situation, I would think flattery would have to include enough respect for the artist and his work to approach him... Copyright is a weird thing, and it works better with some industries than others.. It's kind of one of those deep own ideology things for me. UnFortunately, things I create are only created out of what is already there. Therefore, I must resign myself to putting my creation in the same circumstances. Someone shouldn't be able to take credit for someone elses work, but they should be able to utilize that work to create their own. Or at least that's how I see it ;) --brett

1997-04-19 07:12objet petit abasehead wrote: > if i put myself into something (and other artists too i would > hope), a

From:: objet petit a <lacanian@sover.net>
To:: basehead <basehead@zip1.ziplink.net>
Cc:: <idm@hyperreal.com>
Date:: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 00:12:08 -0700
Subject:: Re: (idm) shock

basehead wrote:

quoted 5 lines if i put myself into something (and other artists too i would

> if i put myself into something (and other artists too i would > hope), and all of my time into it, why should it be just sitting > there waiting to be stripped away from me for someone else to > claim as their own? it's like copyrighting is protection against > kidnapping of my child, in some ways.

I can't remember who it was -- Emma Goldman? Leon Trotsky? Malebranche? -- that once said the following: "Property IS theft." And 'kids' grow up to become their own people, too -- they kidnap *themselves.* Wouldn't it be fascinating if a parent sued a child for copyright infringement? Or vice versa? Imitation being the sincerest form of flattery and all -- I guess views on this would depend upon whether one wants to have ephemeral fame & fortune or a massive transhistorical influence on culture. Should Boeing and Lockheed channel a certain amount of royalties from every B-2 bomber sold to the remaining estate of the Wright Brothers? Ways of the world. sr -- sd NP: refried food

Re: (idm) shock