On Tue, 16 Nov 1999, david turgeon wrote:
quoted 3 lines (warning: most of the following is heavily debatable)>
> (warning: most of the following is heavily debatable)
>
We always debate, don't we david?
quoted 5 lines i don't think we can really talk of 'production values' or 'sonic> i don't think we can really talk of 'production values' or 'sonic
> quality' when we're talking of something as crappy as the backstreet
> boys or celine dion. i'd rather compare it to a big mac: purely
> synthetized taste to appeal millions. does it make it better?
>
It has achieved its goal, which is to sell millions of copies,
and presumably it communicates something that millions of people
want to hear. I can't believe that someone who goes to the trouble
of making music doesn't also want the maximum number of people
to hear it and enjoy it.
I'm not so eager to dismiss things as crappy. If something is
successful, there is a reason it's successful. I want to know why.
Things that succeed in the marketplace have attributes lacking
in things that don't succeed in the marketplace.
What are those attributes? Can music that isn't purpose built to
shift units be imbued with those attributes, and still be artistically
valid? These are valid questions to ask. You'll only
answer these questions by taking the time to understand and
analyze music that you may not necessarily like.
And the whole issue of 'artistic merit' is slippery and complicated.
Today you can go back and look at music that at the time seemed
as disposable as BS Boys. In the context of current sensibilities
it may have merit that eluded its listeners back in the day.
The fact that some music seems worthless right now doesn't
mandate that it won't have value some time in the future when
tastes change.
And to get back to my original point (and I did have one), I
listen to stuff like BS Boys to try and deconstruct it, and learn
from it. I don't listen to it, run out and buy the record and
the poster, and lurk in AOL chat rooms to find out what my favorite
BS Boy's favorite dessert is. If you don't want to do this, that's
absolutely fine with me.
quoted 2 lines a 'clean' production is just the icing on a cake: it's a marketable> a 'clean' production is just the icing on a cake: it's a marketable
> point. it's audio coating: good if you have something to coat.
Production is a craft. That craft is equally applicable to
commersh fluff and deathless masterpieces. In the case of electronic
music, production is inextricably fused with composition. The
production IS to a large extent the composition.
quoted 3 lines so hurray for acid & home studios.>
> so hurray for acid & home studios.
>
Yeppers. And hurray for people who learn how to use them successfully
to become insurgents at the gates of commerce.
quoted 2 lines you can be just as creative, & just as much a good producer, on many> you can be just as creative, & just as much a good producer, on many
> an 'amateur' setup.
And you can be amateurish with thousands of dollars worth of gear.
quoted 4 lines most production techniques are nothing but borderline illusionistic> most production techniques are nothing but borderline illusionistic
> principles of how to be loved without really ever giving anything
> to deserve it.
>
It's all artifice, mate. It's organizing sound waves to manipulate
listeners. I agree that music whose only goal is to shift units
is annoying and to be avoided. But the picture is rarely that simple.
Most people who set out just to strip mine the marketplace for cash
fail. What succeeds is a combination of marketing skills, a product
with which people form an emotional bond, and the dumb luck to be
in the right place at the right time.
quoted 6 lines that all said, i have nothing against producers per se, but i think it's>
> that all said, i have nothing against producers per se, but i think it's
> up to the musician to judge whether production is 'needed', & if we
> leave it to something as vague as 'the public buys it because it's well
> produced', then maybe we're missing something here.
>
Straight up, people won't buy stuff that sounds crappy. If you're
a musician and you don't figure out how to do high quality production,
you're going to fail. And there's no better way to learn how to
do production than to analyze successful productions. It doesn't
mean your music will become homogenous and radio friendly. It just
means that if you break a rule (e.g. distorting drums, an IDM
favorite) you're doing it intentionally as part of the package you
create for listeners.
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